UPDATE: How I solved my shimmy and DW - SOLVED - For real this time

[AVGeek99]

UPDATE AS OF 4/4: My Shimmy/DW are now solved. Ball Joints did the trick. Full update posted on page 2.

UPDATE AS OF 3/23: Turns out my shimmy/DW was not solved. It was a lot better for about a week and then came back. Retorquing everything didn't fix it once it was back. Further update down below.

There are a lot of threads on DW and steering shimmy. But hopefully this will be helpful for some. Sorry for the length.

My saga with steering shimmy and DWs tarted at the beginning of November when I had a MC 3.5 GC lift. At that point I had 42k miles on my stock Rubi suspension. I had 35s since day one and in all those miles I never had a hint of shimmy, DW, or any sort of steering issues.

I was super excited when I got the lift, but that excitement soon turned to despair shortly after I got it back. The first thing I noticed was the terrible ride quality. But this was my fault. I wanted to do the shocks myself so I got a cheap set of shocks as a temporary stop gap until I installed Fox 2.5 DSCs. Once I quit focusing on the terribly bumpy ride I started to notice it wandered pretty badly on uneven road surfaces. And then sharpish bumps would cause the steering wheel to shake like it never had done previously. That next week a couple times on my commute it went into full on DW shaking very violently, only going away when I slowed by 20-30 mph.

By the end of that first week my escitement was completely replaced by dread. What had I done to my Jeep that funtioned perfectly prior to the lift?

As time went on I got used to the flightyness and just paid much closer attention. I tried to identify any loose connections, but all I could find was a little play in the (stock) tie rod and drag link. I figured that had to be the cause so I just dealt with it, and over time the suspension seemed to settle in a litle bit. The shimmy reduced quite a bit on it's own and I hadn't had any DW after the first week. So by mid December the terrible ride was what bothered me the most.

In early January I installed the Fox 2.5 DSCs, which improved the ride greatly. But with the improved ride the loose steering and flightyness started to bother me more and more.

Finally I started researching on what the problem(s) could be. I started checking the simple stuff and worked my way into more complicated stuff. I've never done much work on my cars, but since I got my JK I started dabbling more and more. I've done brakes a few times, shocks, bumpers, winch, but I'd never done any suspension work because I thought it was beyond my capabilities. But in my research I watched some videos and most of it seems simple enough.

Like I said above, prior to the lift I had no steering issues what so ever. It didn't seem logical that simply adding a (high quality) lift would have such a negative impact. In March I will be going to 37s and to handle the larger tires I'll be installing a Steer Smarts Yeti drag link and tie rod. My goal was to hopefully diagnose and resolve the steering shimmy and DW before any further upgrades so I set out. Here is what I've done over the last few weeks.

1. 3 or 4 weeks ago I started by torquing everything to spec. I didn't loosen anything first, I just torqued to spec. The Driver LCA was just a tad under torqued, everything else was correctly torqued. Doing this had no impact.
2. I then ordered an angle finder to check the caster. I first got an analog angle finder and seemed to give inconsistent measurements, but measuring the axle next to the front diff it looked like my caster was off by 2.5 to 3 degrees for a caster measurement of 3 to 3.5 degrees. I then decided I wanted to adjust the caster to get closer to 6 degrees. To loosen the jam nuts on the control arms I ordered the Crows Foot wrenches from MC.
3. I didn't like the inconsistency of the analog angle finder so I also ordered a digital one. I highly recommend a digital angle finder. Your garage floor is likely not as level as it should be. The digital angle finders can be zeroed out prior to taking a measurement. My garage floor is .6 degrees from perfectly level, which is 10% of the stock caster measurement of 6 degrees.
4. Last weekend I adjusted my caster. This ended up being much simpler than I thought it was going to be.
   1. First I took a measurement with the digital angle finder and discovered my caster was much worse than originally thought. My before reading on the axle was 85.8 degrees for a caster of just 1.8 degrees. The axle was leaning forward by 4.2 degrees more than stock. No wonder the steering was so flightly.
   2. 
   3. I started on the driver side lengthening the LCA by ~7/8 inch, which got the me to a reading a little under 90 degrees, so a little short of 6 degrees.
   4. I stopped there and moved to the passenger side adding the same amount of length.
   5. With both sides adjusted I measured again and it bumped the reading to about 89.4 but going the other way. Now the axle was leaning back by .6 degrees for a caster of 6.6 degrees, which was a little higher than I wanted to go.
   6. I then shortened both LCAs by 2 full turns. This got me to a perfect 90 degrees, or 6 degrees of caster.
   7. 
   8. Adjusting the caster ended up being very easy. The hardest part was breaking the jam nunts loose on the control arms. I had to get a 30" breaker bar to get enough leverage. I thought the most difficult part was going to reconnecting the LCAs after lengthening them. But this turned out to be very simple. I just jacked up the frame rail until the holes lined up.
5. After adjusting the caster I loosened all suspension bolts (CAs and track bar) and jumped up and down on the bumper to get the suspension to settle in. I then retorqued everything to spec and took one final caster measurement. It came in at 89.8 leaning back .2 degrees for a final caster of 6.2 degrees.
6. I then took it for a test drive.
   1. Good news: the flightyness and wandering were complely gone. I also drove for a bit in 4-high at about 60mph and there was no vibration or resonance from the front drive shaft. = huge win!
   2. Bad news: correcting the caster did little, if anything to fix the shimmy and DW. In fact it seemed worse, much more like when I first got it back after the lift. I had my first episode of DW in a couple months.
7. Over the course of this week the shimmy lessened and there were no more DW episodes. I did more research and found that the stock track bar bolts are a little undersized and the hole through the MC track bar bushings may be a bit larger than stock. This combination can lead to some play in the track bar connections even when torqued to spec. I ordered a set of 9/16 track bar bolts from Steer Smarts hoping this would be the magic bullet.
8. The bolts arrived on Thursday and I installed them today.
9. I went for a test drive and the shimmy and DW are now GONE!!! The larger track bar bolts were the magic bullet.
10. I drove around 50 miles, hitting all the spots that previously caused a lot of shimmy and a couple of my DW episodes. Nothing! Just shy of 4 months after getting the lift and it finally drives and rides like it did before the lift. The excitement is back!!

In the end I really only did three things to get rid of the shimmy, DW, and wandering/flightyness.

1. I adjusted the caster to 6.2 degrees, was 1.8 after the lift. This fixed the flightyness.
2. I loosened and retorqued all the suspension bolts. I don't know that this had any impact at all, though everything was already torqued to spec correctly to begin with.
3. I replaced the stock metric track bar bolts with larger 9/16" bolts. This fixed the shimmy and DW.

Now I'm ready to do the Yeti drag link and tie rod in a few weeks and then get the 37s.

Everything I did to fix my problems I learned through research on JLWranglerForums and getting good advice and answers to my questions from many forum members. For that I thank everyone!!!

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[BstingGray]

Kudos to you! It's gratifying that you troubleshoot and solved these issues. I have some new inspiration to tackle the drifting on my JL.

 

[AVGeek99]

Kudos to you! It's gratifying that you troubleshoot and solved these issues. I have some new inspiration to tackle the drifting on my JL.

Thank you. And yes, it does feel very gratifying that I was able to fix the problem on my own. And it gives me confidence to do more work on my Jeep. I think I'd almost feel comfortable installing a full lift now. Swapping out the springs is the one thing I'd really be nervous about.

 

[J.Ferreira]

 

[J.Ferreira]

Nicely done!
Caster fixed the wander, and tracking down the component with excess play, due to the wrong size hardware of all things, fixed the wobble.

 

[AVGeek99]

There are a lot of threads on DW and steering shimmy. But hopefully this will be helpful for some. Sorry for the length.

My saga with steering shimmy and DWs tarted at the beginning of November when I had a MC 3.5 GC lift. At that point I had 42k miles on my stock Rubi suspension. I had 35s since day one and in all those miles I never had a hint of shimmy, DW, or any sort of steering issues.

I was super excited when I got the lift, but that excitement soon turned to despair shortly after I got it back. The first thing I noticed was the terrible ride quality. But this was my fault. I wanted to do the shocks myself so I got a cheap set of shocks as a temporary stop gap until I installed Fox 2.5 DSCs. Once I quit focusing on the terribly bumpy ride I started to notice it wandered pretty badly on uneven road surfaces. And then sharpish bumps would cause the steering wheel to shake like it never had done previously. That next week a couple times on my commute it went into full on DW shaking very violently, only going away when I slowed by 20-30 mph.

By the end of that first week my escitement was completely replaced by dread. What had I done to my Jeep that funtioned perfectly prior to the lift?

As time went on I got used to the flightyness and just paid much closer attention. I tried to identify any loose connections, but all I could find was a little play in the (stock) tie rod and drag link. I figured that had to be the cause so I just dealt with it, and over time the suspension seemed to settle in a litle bit. The shimmy reduced quite a bit on it's own and I hadn't had any DW after the first week. So by mid December the terrible ride was what bothered me the most.

In early January I installed the Fox 2.5 DSCs, which improved the ride greatly. But with the improved ride the loose steering and flightyness started to bother me more and more.

Finally I started researching on what the problem(s) could be. I started checking the simple stuff and worked my way into more complicated stuff. I've never done much work on my cars, but since I got my JK I started dabbling more and more. I've done brakes a few times, shocks, bumpers, winch, but I'd never done any suspension work because I thought it was beyond my capabilities. But in my research I watched some videos and most of it seems simple enough.

Like I said above, prior to the lift I had no steering issues what so ever. It didn't seem logical that simply adding a (high quality) lift would have such a negative impact. In March I will be going to 37s and to handle the larger tires I'll be installing a Steer Smarts Yeti drag link and tie rod. My goal was to hopefully diagnose and resolve the steering shimmy and DW before any further upgrades so I set out. Here is what I've done over the last few weeks.

1. 3 or 4 weeks ago I started by torquing everything to spec. I didn't loosen anything first, I just torqued to spec. The Driver LCA was just a tad under torqued, everything else was correctly torqued. Doing this had no impact.
2. I then ordered an angle finder to check the caster. I first got an analog angle finder and seemed to give inconsistent measurements, but measuring the axle next to the front diff it looked like my caster was off by 2.5 to 3 degrees for a caster measurement of 3 to 3.5 degrees. I then decided I wanted to adjust the caster to get closer to 6 degrees. To loosen the jam nuts on the control arms I ordered the Crows Foot wrenches from MC.
3. I didn't like the inconsistency of the analog angle finder so I also ordered a digital one. I highly recommend a digital angle finder. Your garage floor is likely not as level as it should be. The digital angle finders can be zeroed out prior to taking a measurement. My garage floor is .6 degrees from perfectly level, which is 10% of the stock caster measurement of 6 degrees.
4. Last weekend I adjusted my caster. This ended up being much simpler than I thought it was going to be.
   1. First I took a measurement with the digital angle finder and discovered my caster was much worse than originally thought. My before reading on the axle was 85.8 degrees for a caster of just 1.8 degrees. The axle was leaning forward by 4.2 degrees more than stock. No wonder the steering was so flightly.
   2. 
   3. I started on the driver side lengthening the LCA by ~7/8 inch, which got the me to a reading a little under 90 degrees, so a little short of 6 degrees.
   4. I stopped there and moved to the passenger side adding the same amount of length.
   5. With both sides adjusted I measured again and it bumped the reading to about 89.4 but going the other way. Now the axle was leaning back by .6 degrees for a caster of 6.6 degrees, which was a little higher than I wanted to go.
   6. I then shortened both LCAs by 2 full turns. This got me to a perfect 90 degrees, or 6 degrees of caster.
   7. 
   8. Adjusting the caster ended up being very easy. The hardest part was breaking the jam nunts loose on the control arms. I had to get a 30" breaker bar to get enough leverage. I thought the most difficult part was going to reconnecting the LCAs after lengthening them. But this turned out to be very simple. I just jacked up the frame rail until the holes lined up.
5. After adjusting the caster I loosened all suspension bolts (CAs and track bar) and jumped up and down on the bumper to get the suspension to settle in. I then retorqued everything to spec and took one final caster measurement. It came in at 89.8 leaning back .2 degrees for a final caster of 6.2 degrees.
6. I then took it for a test drive.
   1. Good news: the flightyness and wandering were complely gone. I also drove for a bit in 4-high at about 60mph and there was no vibration or resonance from the front drive shaft. = huge win!
   2. Bad news: correcting the caster did little, if anything to fix the shimmy and DW. In fact it seemed worse, much more like when I first got it back after the lift. I had my first episode of DW in a couple months.
7. Over the course of this week the shimmy lessened and there were no more DW episodes. I did more research and found that the stock track bar bolts are a little undersized and the hole through the MC track bar bushings may be a bit larger than stock. This combination can lead to some play in the track bar connections even when torqued to spec. I ordered a set of 9/16 track bar bolts from Steer Smarts hoping this would be the magic bullet.
8. The bolts arrived on Thursday and I installed them today.
9. I went for a test drive and the shimmy and DW are now GONE!!! The larger track bar bolts were the magic bullet.
10. I drove around 50 miles, hitting all the spots that previously caused a lot of shimmy and a couple of my DW episodes. Nothing! Just shy of 4 months after getting the lift and it finally drives and rides like it did before the lift. The excitement is back!!

In the end I really only did three things to get rid of the shimmy, DW, and wandering/flightyness.

1. I adjusted the caster to 6.2 degrees, was 1.8 after the lift. This fixed the flightyness.
2. I loosened and retorqued all the suspension bolts. I don't know that this had any impact at all, though everything was already torqued to spec correctly to begin with.
3. I replaced the stock metric track bar bolts with larger 9/16" bolts. This fixed the shimmy and DW.

Now I'm ready to do the Yeti drag link and tie rod in a few weeks and then get the 37s.

Everything I did to fix my problems I learned through research on JLWranglerForums and getting good advice and answers to my questions from many forum members. For that I thank everyone!!!

UPDATE: After doing everthing in my post my shimmy and DW were gone for about a week. Since then it has returned and gotten progressively worse even after taking further steps to address the DW. At this point I'm almost stumped as to what my problem could be. I'm going to start a new thread with a shorter post listing everything I've done to try to fix my shimmy/DW issue.

When I finally do resolve the problem once and for all I will come back here and provide a final update.

 

[DanFelix]

Your write-up is excellent and well written. Could you elaborate on the road and driving conditions that precipitate the shimmy/wobble? Thank you.

 

[renegadecaderyn]

UPDATE: After doing everthing in my post my shimmy and DW were gone for about a week. Since then it has returned and gotten progressively worse even after taking further steps to address the DW. At this point I'm almost stumped as to what my problem could be. I'm going to start a new thread with a shorter post listing everything I've done to try to fix my shimmy/DW issue.

When I finally do resolve the problem once and for all I will come back here and provide a final update.

Check your ball joints. Even if they seem to be OK, I would replace them. I've read many times people didn't know they were bad until they were replaced and you can see the excess movement in them. The stock ball joints are the weakest link if you've upgraded everything else.

 

[Medsker]

I replaced the drag link, track bar, and tie rod with Teraflex units and still had the DW. I finally replaced the ball joints even though I had two different shops tell me they were fine. This took care of it. I'm solid now and don't cringe every time I'm coming up to a crack in the road.

So another vote for ball joints from me.

 

[AVGeek99]

Check your ball joints. Even if they seem to be OK, I would replace them. I've read many times people didn't know they were bad until they were replaced and you can see the excess movement in them. The stock ball joints are the weakest link if you've upgraded everything else.

I replaced the drag link, track bar, and tie rod with Teraflex units and still had the DW. I finally replaced the ball joints even though I had two different shops tell me they were fine. This took care of it. I'm solid now and don't cringe every time I'm coming up to a crack in the road.

So another vote for ball joints from me.

Yes, ball joints are the only thing that really make any sense. They were always on the upgrade plan, but I wanted to wait until they needed replacement. Get as much out of the stock joints as possible. The only reason I've not focused on the ball joints up until now is because, other than the shimmy and DW episodes the Jeep drives fine, even at speeds beyond 75mph.

I've driven on bad ball joints on past vehicles, including a JK, and they've all felt the same. As you go faster the front end starts to shake a little and it shakes constantly until drop below the speed where it starts. And even then that shaking is not DW, or anything close to that. Its just enough to tell you "hey, maybe don't go too much faster". The shaking is like what I'm used to with out of balance tires.

 

[AVGeek99]

Your write-up is excellent and well written. Could you elaborate on the road and driving conditions that precipitate the shimmy/wobble? Thank you.

So all the miles I've put on since the lift have been around home and my daily commute. All hard surface roads, mostly blacktop, some concrete. The shimmy (with sharper bumps) has been ever present since getting the lift in Nov, but until recently DW has been pretty rare.

The types of bumps that consistently always caused the shimmy have been patched expansion joints in concrete and transitions from blacktop to concrete, or vice versa and severely cracked and uneven surfaces. Normal epansion joints that haven't been patched dont' cause any problems. In most cases the DW occured when I was at HWY speeds as low as about 60mph, mostly 68-72mph. Before the last week, the DW would stop when I slowed to 35-40 mph.

I'm sure it happens in most places but in the summer when it is hot, expansion joints in concrete can buckle. The way those get patched in MN is to remove the buckled concrete and patch it with black top. Over time these turn into pretty sharp bumps. Prior to getting my Jeep lifted, it handled these fine, and they weren't really all that bad. Since being lifted they have had a little more bite and consistently have caused the shimmy, occasionally leading to DW.

On Friday on my morning commute they caused three DW episodes. And three more, all within a mile driving home that afternoon. Where previously slowing to 35-40 would make the DW stop. On Friday morning I had to slow to 20 or less, thankfully very light traffic. In the afternoon I had to pull on to the shoulder and stop. After the third episode I kept my speed to 55mph or less, took the next exit and just took back roads the rest of the way home. I had about 15 miles to go taking the back roads and there wasn't any DW in those 15 miles. Most of those 15 miles was at 55-60mph or slower due to speed limit.

There have been a few times since getting the lift in Nov that 2 lane county roads have induced DW at 45-60mph, but that has been rare. I can remmember 3 episodes all on pretty bumpy stretches of road.

 

[TxJeepers]

I fought shimmy and death wobble the entire time I had my 19 after lifting. Not going to list all the things I did but know it was just stupid. Fast forward, my 22 was awesome. Then I lifted it. Fucking shimmy and death wobble. Both the 19 and the 22 had correct caster, I even tested different casters. This time, said screw it, I’m trying geo brackets and put on some from Metalcloak. Problem resolved. Smh.

 

[Jeep Wick]

I fought shimmy and death wobble the entire time I had my 19 after lifting. Not going to list all the things I did but know it was just stupid. Fast forward, my 22 was awesome. Then I lifted it. Fucking shimmy and death wobble. Both the 19 and the 22 had correct caster, I even tested different casters. This time, said screw it, I’m trying geo brackets and put on some from Metalcloak. Problem resolved. Smh.

Can you be more specific about which brackets you used? I see that MC makes quite a few.

 

[AVGeek99]

I fought shimmy and death wobble the entire time I had my 19 after lifting. Not going to list all the things I did but know it was just stupid. Fast forward, my 22 was awesome. Then I lifted it. Fucking shimmy and death wobble. Both the 19 and the 22 had correct caster, I even tested different casters. This time, said screw it, I’m trying geo brackets and put on some from Metalcloak. Problem resolved. Smh.

Can you be more specific about which brackets you used? I see that MC makes quite a few.

Yes I'm wondering the same. I actually have these being delivered tomorrow. I got these to hopefully take the bite of bigger, sharper bumps.

https://metalcloak.com/jl-wrangler-hd-control-arm-pro-lignment-kit.html

Is this what you're referring to or the track bar relocation bracket?

https://metalcloak.com/jeep-jl-wran...angler-suspension-lift-kits.html#subCategory3

 

[AnnDee4444]

Changing caster or suspension arm mounting locations isn't addressing the problem. You might be able to tune the resonance (DW) away with some combination of parts/settings, but ultimately something is loose and allowing deflection.

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