TrailRecon drops the Diesel

BroncoHound

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Transmission temps have never exceeded 235 degrees at any time. I usually find it 20 degrees cooler than the oil when traveling on mountainous highway grades.
What gear was your transmission in when your oil and coolant temps got near the derate point? Was the transmission still in 7th or 8th gear when you got to the top of the grade, or had it downshifted to 6th or 5th? If it had downshifted, do you recall if those shifts happened towards the bottom of the grade or towards the top?

I'm not overly concerned with transmission temperatures, but was more wondering if the trans tuning behind the diesel was holding the overdrive gears longer, which would lug the engine when pulling a grade and cause the excessive heat buildup evidenced by the higher coolant and oil temperatures and, eventually, the derate scenarios.

My thinking is that, because of all the available torque, perhaps the Jeep engineers tuned the transmission behind the diesel not to downshift as early as it would if it were behind a gas engine. If that were the case and the driver were to manually downshift to direct or 5th gear BEFORE the coolant and oil temps started spiking, perhaps the higher RPM and reduced engine load would help mitigate the heat buildup.
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Scott.B

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Thanks; I guess I was a bit misleading in my questioning. I'm more interested in what the differences are in the trans tuning between the diesel and gasoline options and whether or not the diesel transmission holds overdrive gears longer due to the torque profile of the diesel engine.

As for whether or not TrailRecon actually had a derating issue, I see no reason to doubt that it happened. The issue itself has been documented by others, so we know it does happen. The Casey250 dude on YouTube recorded a video last summer of his and a diesel Gladiator both going into limp mode and restricting speed to 50mph or so while pulling a grade. Neither were pulling a trailer, if i remember, but both vehicles were loaded fairly heavy. Still no excuse for this to happen, but Jeep Wranglers of all engine types still have TONS of "personality traits" that shouldn't exist in this day and age. However, as long as we keep buying half a million of the things a year, Jeep will continue to sell whatever the hell they want to sell in whatever half-baked configurations they choose. Ultimately, all of these little quirks are our fault as consumers; so long as we keep buying them, they see no reason to fix them.
The fuck if I know what you are asking? I don't live in Colorado thank god. Use to be a free place now just California x2 cesspool.

Buy a bicycle

Get some running shoes.

Buy a clue? Get a job?
 

VinDiesel21

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Why is he bitching about DEF? Not difficult to fill and carry a extra if you are on a long trip and worried you can't find any. Guess because I drive semi and am use to filling it every week or so it's not a big deal to have to fill my Wrangler. So far 2k miles on it and it's at the halfway mark. And I will use the bulk def pump at my local gas station with a fuel island
 

AZ-Chris

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What gear was your transmission in when your oil and coolant temps got near the derate point? . . .
Transmission is generally between 6 to 7th gear when cresting the grades, but, depending upon traffic, downshifts to 5th gear can and do happen when passing opportunities permit. However, the transmission always shifts smoothly and the engine never lugs . . . this transmission is simply one of the two best automatics I've ever owned.

Again, transmission temps have never gotten near any alarming thresholds. Oil temperatures rise rapidly when pulling a grade at altitude . . . they also drop rapidly once off the grade.
 

Bobsled

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if I remember correctly, in an earlier video Brad was disappointed in the carrying capacity of the diesel . That was a big deal for his overlanding .
He was not enamored with the diesel from the jump.
 

DadJokes

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I don't own a diesel but would have bought one if Jeep offered it in the 2-door.

Given that Brad was having overheating problems in his diesel, he should have just turned the heater on high and rolled his windows down.

That strategy worked quite well in my Family's 1986 Grand Wagoneer. Who cares if we were in the middle of the Nevada desert with outside temps at 100+. Car didn't overheat.
Middle of summer, heat full blast, windows up, run down the 1/4 mile. lol Every bit helps.
 

Gawdly

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This is absolutely a cooling system issue specific to the JL platform. It is simply undersized. Likely a concession made to accommodate the limited size of the Wrangler grill and engine bay.

I own both a 2020 JLURD and a 2021 Ram 1500 Eco-diesel so I have a unique position to test one against the other.

My jeep is lifted with 37s, winch and aluminum bumpers. Last year I went camping with a rooftop tent and pulling a small bushwhacker teardrop trailer weighing in at about 1800lbs. This is in the mountains of Southern Idaho mind you so ya, big hills and 80+ degrees outside. I de-rated on the first big hill doing about 65. After that I slowed down and watched my temps, no issues as long as I babied it but it continually wanted to overheat if I wasn't careful.

Shortly after, I took the Ram out pulling an 18' flatbed (2000lbs) with a 3500lbs car on it. It's on slightly oversized tires on 22" rims. I intentionally tried to get it hot. At one point I was doing 85mph into a 20mph headwind up a grade with throttle over 3/4 to maintain. Temps didn't budge. Sucked DEF like a fiend and MPG was around 8 but not even a hint of overheating.

It's the Jeep cooling system. No question. The engine is a rockstar.
 

Metal Dawg

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This is absolutely a cooling system issue specific to the JL platform. It is simply undersized. Likely a concession made to accommodate the limited size of the Wrangler grill and engine bay.

I own both a 2020 JLURD and a 2021 Ram 1500 Eco-diesel so I have a unique position to test one against the other.

My jeep is lifted with 37s, winch and aluminum bumpers. Last year I went camping with a rooftop tent and pulling a small bushwhacker teardrop trailer weighing in at about 1800lbs. This is in the mountains of Southern Idaho mind you so ya, big hills and 80+ degrees outside. I de-rated on the first big hill doing about 65. After that I slowed down and watched my temps, no issues as long as I babied it but it continually wanted to overheat if I wasn't careful.

Shortly after, I took the Ram out pulling an 18' flatbed (2000lbs) with a 3500lbs car on it. It's on slightly oversized tires on 22" rims. I intentionally tried to get it hot. At one point I was doing 85mph into a 20mph headwind up a grade with throttle over 3/4 to maintain. Temps didn't budge. Sucked DEF like a fiend and MPG was around 8 but not even a hint of overheating.

It's the Jeep cooling system. No question. The engine is a rockstar.
I never understood why they simply didn't put a different hood on the diesel. A hood with a scoop sufficiently large enough to keep the engine cooler.
 

donmontalvo

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True. I also find him to be overly enthusiast about things, which is a bit grating. Still, it FAR more watchable than the lite brite channel.
Rough crowd. ;p
 

OnlyOne

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If you live and regularly drive in the mountainous west, just don't plan on towing with Jeep EcoDiesel any time soon.

I run a 6" lift and 37" tires . . . I regularly see 250 degree oil temperatures when cresting Arizona mountain grades on the highway and holding the speed limit - - I AM NOT TOWING. Too me, it seems dangerously close to having the engine derate. While I have yet to experience an engine derate, I have scrapped all plans on towing an offroad trailer until an engine/oil cooling solution comes to market.

I have recently been in contact with BulletProof Diesel that I know is actively engaged in working on this problem. I still have no idea when a solution will be offered, but I know they intend to provide a solution.
I live in Northern New Mexico and run the mountains of Colorado every week with 37’s and 400lbs in the bed constantly and have never come close to overheating or limp mode. Not sure what the differences are but the doom and gloom is definitely boring. I’m sure these issues exist and are at the minimum highly annoying, but some of this crap especially from those who have never set foot in a diesel is asinine.

I hope someone comes up with a solution for those of you that have these problems, because this is an expensive hobby. I know for a fact that Jeeps cooling system isn’t the best in the business because every Jeep from my JKs, to JLs went into limp mode coming up Vail pass in the summer. Frustrating but we keep buying them. The crazy part is my diesel has yet to have the issue. Whether that’s the case going forward, we shall see.
 
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OnlyOne

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Don't tell the other diesel guys, they get offended. If you didn't record it it didn't happen. They can put any vehicle into limp mode by just looking at it. You should drive around with the heater on so the cooling system works. And all the other bs excuses we've witnessed in this thread. Of course the heater trick helps, as does turning off the AC, but I stand by the statement that the cooling system shouldn't be that marginal to need all those tricks towing a small trailer in mild climates.
Do you own an eco diesel Jeep?
 

AZ-Chris

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I live in Northern New Mexico and run the mountains of Colorado every week with 37’s and 400lbs in the bed constantly and have never come close to overheating or limp mode.
Do you know the overall weight of your rig? I know that mine, when I'm in it, is right at GVWR. When cresting steep grades, can you report back what oil temperatures you're seeing? Have you towed a trailer in the mountains?

I haven't experienced an engine derate yet, but having read many reports from others that have, I believe I am quite close to reaching those derate thresholds. I have scrapped my plans to acquire an offroad trailer until an engine/oil cooling solution is commercially available.
 

OnlyOne

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Do you know the overall weight of your rig? I know that mine, when I'm in it, is right at GVWR. When cresting steep grades, can you report back what oil temperatures you're seeing? Have you towed a trailer in the mountains?

I haven't experienced an engine derate yet, but having read many reports from others that have, I believe I am quite close to reaching those derate thresholds. I have scrapped my plans to acquire an offroad trailer until a solution is commercially available.
I towed my 16’ car trailer to Grand Junction late last summer over the passes on 550 through Ouray with no issues. I wasn’t nice to it either. I never thought to even check it. It was brand new with the stock tires. I don’t have a trailer anymore. It very well could have been quite hot, without me knowing it. It’s the only time I towed a trailer and it was empty. About 2k lbs. I didn’t have a trailer brake controller but was extremely impressed with the Jeeps brakes.

I’ll take a pic next week. It won’t be the best because it’s so cold but I’ll be running up Wolf Creek pass. I’m not sure what my weight is total. I’ve got a bed full and the wife and myself. Standard bumper and winch etc. This is obviously on a Gladiator so a bit heavier vehicle to start with. I’ve got to be past 6K.
 
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AZ-Chris

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Your experience certainly would be good information to add to the dialog . . . you live and drive in a region where this issue surfaces.

When stock, my rig ran fine through the mountains . . . it wasn't until I started modding that I began noticing the higher temperatures. The engine/oil temperature issue IS an "extreme, pushing the envelope" sort of thing . . . several conditions/parameters need to be present: Overall weight (towing exacerbates) , ambient temp, elevation, speed, and road-grade contribute to engine loading and propensity to overheat.

Apparently, it's difficult to have your cake and eat it too.
 

OnlyOne

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Your experience certainly would be good information to add to the dialog . . . you live and drive in a region where this issue surfaces.

When stock, my rig ran fine through the mountains . . . it wasn't until I started modding that I began noticing the higher temperatures. The engine/oil temperature issue IS an "extreme, pushing the envelope" sort of thing . . . several conditions/parameters need to be present: Overall weight (towing exacerbates) , ambient temp, elevation, speed, and road-grade contribute to engine loading and propensity to overheat.

Apparently, it's difficult to have your cake and eat it too.
LOL. Truth. I guess that’s why they don’t offer 37’s from the factory. :CWL:
 
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