Trade in a 21 Willys for a 23 Rubicon

[roaniecowpony]

If you can't make an obstacle, push in your fuses and give it another try.

But should you go to a Rubicon? I'd say if I would only do it if the factory D44s, lockers and 4:1 transfer case were what I wanted in the end. The first thing that us Rubi owners worry about when crawling is breaking that FAD housing in the factory D44. So, Rubi owners spend thousands on UD44s or D60s.

If your desire is to go to 37s or higher, the Rubi D44s will give you the strength for confidence the axles will be less likely to break/twist axles. But they get to their limits quickly in the 39-40" tire range. So, for me, I'd really like to have a front axle without a FAD, but with hubs. That means a different set of wheels with larger hole pattern and bore, and different rear axles with a larger pattern. It's all a cascading series of changes.

If you do your own wrenching, a Rubicon transfer case and axles are relatively cheap compared to buying a new(er) Rubi. But it takes cash and work.

I didn't buy my 4 dr Rubicon to rock crawl/wheel. I bought it to hunt with my bird dogs. But, I came to a point where I wanted to do some activities with my old school friend before we run out of time (we're late 60s), and I decided to lift it, put 37s on it and do some of the BOH trails with him. But if I were to get a rig specifically to crawl/wheel, it'd be a 2 dr. A 2 dr can maneuver so much easier on the trail and it makes obstacles a lot easier. A 2 dr can do more difficult obstacles on smaller tires. That makes things cheaper right off.

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[roaniecowpony]

Just a final note, if you ask a thousand people is something "worth it" you'll get a thousand different answers. Only you know how much the difference in $$ means to your financial situation. To me, it sounds like you are already willing and able.

 

[desertdude59]

On my 2020 Willys I have the 2 inch Mopar lift, 35s, stock wheels with spacer (I know some people don't like them), a front winch bumper, winch, all the factory switches for lights. I pulled up next to a stock Rubi and it looked like a baby. My interior and dash looks pretty much like a Rubi too except it's grey and black. It's a work in progress, but most good Jeeps are built anyways.

 

[Flip]

OK great! I got all the permission I need; I ordered my Willys decals. Some people name their vehicles/jeeps, my jeeps name will be Willy!

 

[The Last Cowboy]

Well, Willys is just a package added to the Sport. A Willys is still a Sport.

But it's kinda like the old frog analogy; All toads are frogs, but not all frogs are toads.

Same could be said for the Willys; All Willys are Sports, but not all Sports are Willys

Some Sports are equipped very closely to a Willys anyway. Here's what a Willys has over a Sport S as of 2023

32" MT tires on matte black aluminum wheels
Rubicon shocks
Heavy Duty brakes
Limited slip rear axle, D44/M220
LED head lights and fog lights
Gloss black one piece grille
Vintage Willys design 4 wheel drive decal on tailgate

The Willys Sport gets all of that except the LED lights

There are a lot of Sports out there with the LS M220 rear axle and optional HD brakes. Those are the big things in my opinion. Rubicon shocks can be bought cheap as new take offs. The Willys wheels aren't special, 17x7.5 +44, like the majority off all other Jeep wheels. They are the same pattern as the more common Rubicon wheel, but solid black. The factory tires are nothing to write home about, but the Firestone MTs are great off road, I'll give them that.

So, in conclusion, a falsely badged Willys isn't that big of a deal. A falsely badged Rubicon however, is another story, since there is so much unique mechanical equipment on one.

 

[kah.mun.rah]

My friend in his stock Willys can out wheel me off-roading in my modified Rubicon on 37s. Manually disconnect your front sway bar and let some air out of your tires and you will be amazed what a Willys can do.

 

[2nd 392]

Well, Willys is just a package added to the Sport. A Willys is still a Sport.

But it's kinda like the old frog analogy; All toads are frogs, but not all frogs are toads.

Same could be said for the Willys; All Willys are Sports, but not all Sports are Willys

Some Sports are equipped very closely to a Willys anyway. Here's what a Willys has over a Sport S as of 2023

32" MT tires on matte black aluminum wheels
Rubicon shocks
Heavy Duty brakes
Limited slip rear axle, D44/M220
LED head lights and fog lights
Gloss black one piece grille
Vintage Willys design 4 wheel drive decal on tailgate

The Willys Sport gets all of that except the LED lights

There are a lot of Sports out there with the LS M220 rear axle and optional HD brakes. Those are the big things in my opinion. Rubicon shocks can be bought cheap as new take offs. The Willys wheels aren't special, 17x7.5 +44, like the majority off all other Jeep wheels. They are the same pattern as the more common Rubicon wheel, but solid black. The factory tires are nothing to write home about, but the Firestone MTs are great off road, I'll give them that.

So, in conclusion, a falsely badged Willys isn't that big of a deal. A falsely badged Rubicon however, is another story, since there is so much unique mechanical equipment on one.

As it always has been with false badging, moderation, or you become a joke. Put the GT badging on a gen 1 Mustang, but Not the GT350 badges and striping— put the BB hood on a SB C2 but please leave off the 427/L88 badges. Countless examples. Excess makes you look like a fool. Like the idget in town with an SRT 10 PU look alike, uhh, we have ears to hear the V8 with. Stupid— Not Fooling Us.

 

[The Last Cowboy]

Yep. I've never false badged anything, even as a joke. I wouldn't even build a "tribute" muscle car. For example a Cutlass can be built just a cool or better than a 442. Fake BMW M badging has to be the worst I've seen though.

I've seen a great many fake Rubis, Decepticons as I call them. I've only seen a handful of falsely badged Willys though.

I guess people do it for the prestige, they want people to think they got the "best' one, when they themselves would not or could not pay for the higher end model. Many think that no one will know the difference, they would be wrong. Some of us do, no matter how hard the effort was made to appear otherwise.

In the JK days, many used car lots would put Rubicon wheels and hood decals on a Sport, then then price it almost like a Rubicon. They would never claim it to be, and they would have plausible deniability to say that they took it in that way. It was easier and less expensive to make a JK Sport look like a Rubicon than it is on a JL. It's a whole lot easier to make a JL Sport look like a Willys than a Rubicon.

 

[2nd 392]

Yep. I've ever false badged anything, even as a joke. I wouldn't even build a "tribute" muscle car. For example a Cutlass can be built just a cool or better than a 442. Fake BMW M badging has to be the worst I've seen though.

I've seen a great many fake Rubis, Decepticons as I call them. I've only seen a handful of falsely badged Willys though.

I guess people do it for the prestige, they want people to think they got the "best' one, when they themselves would not or could not pay for the higher end model. Many think that no one will know the difference, they would be wrong. Some of us do, no matter how hard the effort was made to appear otherwise.

In the JK days, many used car lots would put Rubicon wheels and hood decals on a Sport, then then price it almost like a Rubicon. They would never claim it to be, and they would have plausible deniability to say that they took it in that way. It was easier and less expensive to make a JK Sport look like a Rubicon than it is on a JL. It's a whole lot easier to make a JL Sport look like a Willys than a Rubicon.

Unfortunately, the Tribute cars often get good money at auction. I falsely badged my 66 (only) L79 Nova SS, put 283 badges on it. Great Fun, the look on the drivers faces and sometimes laughing passengers in losing GTO’s and other low tier BB’s was priceless. (but beware the 425 hp solid lifter 396’s, don’t play if you hear the clatter) Edit— the 283 badges didn’t fool the thieves that stripped the L79, close ratio 4spd, posi traction, buckets and console, and bashed the LR quarter panel and rear end just to be Dicks.

 

[C.Sco]

Nope. Grass is greener, always. Love what you got!

100%.
Even if you get a Rubicon you'll still see people offroading in Rubicons that are more built than yours, and make you want more.

I speak from experience. Here's how my life has been for the last 3 months:

1. Owned a Grand Cherokee, lifted on 33's with lots of skids. It mostly did what I wanted, but I envied those stock Wranglers that could do so much more.
2. Traded the GC for a Rubicon.
3. Envied those other Rubicons I saw that were lifted on 37's and could do so much more than mine.
4. Got a lift and 37's.
5. Envied those other Rubicons that were covered in skid plates and armor and could do so much more than mine.
6. Got tons of skids and armor.
7. Envy those other Rubicons with axle upgrades and 40's....

It doesn't end. You (and I) will be happier and more satisfied if we just enjoy what we've got and make it work. I have to keep reminding myself that my Jeep can already do SO much more than I ever set out to do, and that it doesn't really NEED to be able to do more.

Your Willys is already pretty close to being as capable as a Rubicon, it mostly just lacks lockers. But as already mentioned, you can easily add airlockers for less money than trading to a Rubicon would cost.

 

[Shibadog]

Keep your Willy’s. There will ALWAYS be somebody with a more “built” Jeep than yours. Who cares? As far as making it easier, in a lot of cases driver skill is far more useful than a bit more capability. ANYTHING can be stuck if you try hard enough. Save your Money.

 

[Mocopo]

I would say the only reason to go to a Rubi (or Willy's XR) is if you want to go to 37s and wheel it hard. If what made it easier for those Rubis is the lockers or the gearing, then just add lockers or upgrade gears to your Willys.

I had a JK Sport on 35s. I knew when i got my JL I was gonna be putting 37s on it, so I went Rubi right out of the gate so I wouldn't have to look back. But a Willy's XR would have been an option also, I just would have planned for aftermarket lockers at some point.

 

[roaniecowpony]

100%.
Even if you get a Rubicon you'll still see people offroading in Rubicons that are more built than yours, and make you want more.

I speak from experience. Here's how my life has been for the last 3 months:

1. Owned a Grand Cherokee, lifted on 33's with lots of skids. It mostly did what I wanted, but I envied those stock Wranglers that could do so much more.
2. Traded the GC for a Rubicon.
3. Envied those other Rubicons I saw that were lifted on 37's and could do so much more than mine.
4. Got a lift and 37's.
5. Envied those other Rubicons that were covered in skid plates and armor and could do so much more than mine.
6. Got tons of skids and armor.
7. Envy those other Rubicons with axle upgrades and 40's....

It doesn't end. You (and I) will be happier and more satisfied if we just enjoy what we've got and make it work. I have to keep reminding myself that my Jeep can already do SO much more than I ever set out to do, and that it doesn't really NEED to be able to do more.

Your Willys is already pretty close to being as capable as a Rubicon, it mostly just lacks lockers. But as already mentioned, you can easily add airlockers for less money than trading to a Rubicon would cost.

You can see the trail of bread crumbs that leads from a little ol Sport to a full on tube rock buggy.

 

[2nd 392]

100%.
Even if you get a Rubicon you'll still see people offroading in Rubicons that are more built than yours, and make you want more.

I speak from experience. Here's how my life has been for the last 3 months:

1. Owned a Grand Cherokee, lifted on 33's with lots of skids. It mostly did what I wanted, but I envied those stock Wranglers that could do so much more.
2. Traded the GC for a Rubicon.
3. Envied those other Rubicons I saw that were lifted on 37's and could do so much more than mine.
4. Got a lift and 37's.
5. Envied those other Rubicons that were covered in skid plates and armor and could do so much more than mine.
6. Got tons of skids and armor.
7. Envy those other Rubicons with axle upgrades and 40's....

It doesn't end. You (and I) will be happier and more satisfied if we just enjoy what we've got and make it work. I have to keep reminding myself that my Jeep can already do SO much more than I ever set out to do, and that it doesn't really NEED to be able to do more.

Your Willys is already pretty close to being as capable as a Rubicon, it mostly just lacks lockers. But as already mentioned, you can easily add airlockers for less money than trading to a Rubicon would cost.

With a lifetime of experience participating in and suffering from your affliction I welcome you to Snowballers Anonymous. There is no cure.

 

[C.Sco]

You can see the trail of bread crumbs that leads from a little ol Sport to a full on tube rock buggy.

Hell, even if you talk to a guy in the most badass rock buggy you've ever seen, ask him if he's got it exactly how he wants it and I guarantee he'll get into a 20 minute story about all his future mod plans

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