Should we expect anything better than 4-5% below invoice for now?

[Specter491]

West Coast Florida aint budging !!

That's what I keep hearing/seeing. North Florida seems to be more open to making a deal

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[Chicago]

I paid 6% under invoice

 

[Specter491]

I paid 6% under invoice

Nice! Did you do anything special?

 

[Chicago]

Nice! Did you do anything special?

I just EMailed jason at Tyson Motors, I found him on this forum and asked him if he was still doing 6% under invoice, no haggle he said yes I went and saw him and ordered my Jeep

 

[Specter491]

I just EMailed jason at Tyson Motors, I found him on this forum and asked him if he was still doing 6% under invoice, no haggle he said yes I went and saw him and ordered my Jeep

Where is that dealer located?

 

[Chicago]

Where is that dealer located?

Shorewood Illinois about 35 miles outside Chicago

 

[Chicago]

Shorewood Illinois about 35 miles outside Chicago

 

[Chicago]

Shorewood Illinois about 35 miles outside Chicago

Tell him I sent you

 

[OscarMike_to_Rubi]

That's what I keep hearing/seeing. North Florida seems to be more open to making a deal

I ordered at 4% under invoice in Pinellas. Not sure if I was lucky or if it was something they had across the board for orders. I heard from someone else I referred that a different person at same dealership only offered them 2 under.

Quoted nearly 4 under in Manatee, 3 under in Sarasota.

Hillsborough was like crickets. No one wanted to play.

Just gotta keep knocking on the doors (or emails, or autotrader chat).

Also, doesn't hurt to have a preliminary POC with quote for vehicle configured as you want it from another in state dealer (or out of state for that matter) to help further the discussion.

 

[Scott2373]

I want to see someone post a fully itemized purchase order that shows them *actually* receiving 5-6% below invoice at the bottom line. Currently, I'm at 2.7% below invoice and my local dealers have pretty much stopped talking to me at this point. I want to see what your dealership is charging for Document and/or "processing" fees. What are they charging for "Pre-Delivery inspection" and Dealer Prep? What are the hidden fees/costs/charges that are only expressed in codes or vague verbiage? Those fees that they tell you are non-negotiable and are part of doing business. What are they charging you for your "extended warranty" or window etching or "glass / paint protection" ? I want to see all of it. The reason I ask is because the local dealers I am in negotiations with DO NOT charge for any of this garbage except a standard $75 doc fee, which is limited by New York state regulations. I sat down with a dealership owner yesterday and he showed me the actual numbers and how there is no way a dealership can make money by selling everything at 5% below invoice in a truly transparent, no BS sale. This is a non-commission dealership that I trust and I've purchased 3 vehicles from them since 2013. If a dealer does their own financing, I can understand, because they're making that money back on the percentage rate. Other than that, I'm perplexed! I want to know because I'd love a deal like that!

 

[Saejin]

Bottom line is you're right...everyone is saying 6% or 5%, but in the end after they add in fees and such, the discounts are really between 3-4% unless you can take advantage of military rebate of $500 or the tread lightly. However, the tread light is only supposed to be 1% below invoice, but some dealers are allowing you to take 1% off the negotiated price as in the case of my dealer or a set discount like $250 which Koons is doing.

I could have went to Koons as it's only an hour away, but opted to use my local dealer through the truecar buying program my bank offers. I'll be using them as my service dealer, so wanted to purchase from them in case I ran into issues upon delivery or shortly after. I paid $588 more, but got some other discounts at the dealer that I don't think Koons would have offered.
See below for the breakout.

Koons Deal (Advertised as 5%, but in reality its 3.6% or 5% if you can use tread light and military combined)
Invoice - $51040
Invoice Discount of 5% = $48,488
Add Fee $699 = $49,187
Difference between the two = $1,853
Difference / Invoice = 3.6%
So adding the $699 processing negated 1.3% of the advertised 5% discount off of invoice.
However Koons allows you to use a tread lightly affiliate code and subtracts an additional $250 from the price and you can also use the Military Rebate of $500. Keep in mind the tread lightly costs $100, so the net discount would only be $150. If you add those two discounts in then you get the below:
$49,187 - $250 - $500 = $48,437
$48,437...this would be 5% below invoice...keep in mind you had to pay $100 for the tread lightly membership

My Deal (Negotiated 4%, but in reality its 2.9% or 3.9% for me since I got the military discount)
Invoice - $51,040
Invoice Discount of 4% - $48,946 (included 1% tread lightly discount of $510)
Add Fee - $300 doc and $279 protection = $49,525
Difference between the two = $1,515
Difference / Invoice = 2.9%
My dealer already gave me the tread lightly discount and I was eligible for the military rebate of $500.
My total out the door with their doc and protect fees but before tax, tags, and license was:
$49,025 - $500 = $49,025
$49,025...this would be 3.9% below invoice...I also had to pay $100 for the tread lightly

Also, on my numbers worksheet, there is a $286 charge. This is tag and title fee. I took care of my taxes separately.

I posted pics of my numbers worksheet. I'm also working an additional $500 discount because I used my banks True Car buying price guarantee and the dealer didn't do the calculations correctly. Truecar is working with the dealer to adjust...basically they included my $500 military rebate in the true car discounted price when it should have been separate. I also applied for the BonusDrive $500 rebate which hopefully will come in the mail soon. So, in the end if both adjustments work then my final price would be $48,025 which is 6% under invoice.

 

[ThirtyOne]

I want to see someone post a fully itemized purchase order that shows them *actually* receiving 5-6% below invoice at the bottom line. Currently, I'm at 2.7% below invoice and my local dealers have pretty much stopped talking to me at this point. I want to see what your dealership is charging for Document and/or "processing" fees. What are they charging for "Pre-Delivery inspection" and Dealer Prep? What are the hidden fees/costs/charges that are only expressed in codes or vague verbiage? Those fees that they tell you are non-negotiable and are part of doing business. What are they charging you for your "extended warranty" or window etching or "glass / paint protection" ? I want to see all of it. The reason I ask is because the local dealers I am in negotiations with DO NOT charge for any of this garbage except a standard $75 doc fee, which is limited by New York state regulations. I sat down with a dealership owner yesterday and he showed me the actual numbers and how there is no way a dealership can make money by selling everything at 5% below invoice in a truly transparent, no BS sale. This is a non-commission dealership that I trust and I've purchased 3 vehicles from them since 2013. If a dealer does their own financing, I can understand, because they're making that money back on the percentage rate. Other than that, I'm perplexed! I want to know because I'd love a deal like that!

Noone is quoting 5-6% below invoice OTD. It is before Tax, tag, title, and fees.

But dealers can certainly make money at those prices. With holdback alone their cost is at 3% below invoice. If you add in an affiliate code their cost is 5% below invoice. In some cases, they are large dealers who are hitting sales incentives from the factory that give them cash back on every Jeep they sell when they hit that target. Or they could be leveraging their fleet program which also has lower cost for them. In other cases the doc fees are high and that is pure profit. Maybe they generally sell Wranglers at good margins and they lose money on factory orders just to increase their allocation. They may make money off of financing.

But 2.7% below invoice is a very fair price! You are not getting screwed at that price. If you like the dealer and you like the Jeep I would take it and be happy and not worry about what the Internet says. It's the people who think they have to pay MSRP because it is a "hot" vehicle that need to do a little research. I think anything under 1% below invoice is fair.

 

[Scott2373]

Excellent breakdown and good deal! I wasn't aware of BonusDrive, but after looking it up, I am eligible through my employer. Thanks!

 

[Scott2373]

With holdback alone their cost is at 3% below invoice. If you add in an affiliate code their cost is 5% below invoice.

Holdback is 3% of total MSRP for Jeeps, so it is not calculated after the invoice. Affiliate rewards programs are typically 1% below invoice, such as Friends and Family. Typically, they are not applicable with any other negotiations other than the $500 military discount.

 

[Saejin]

On the order form you'll see the holdback. On mine it was $1,595 which is about 2.9%. So basically, my dealer offered me the Jeep at invoice, less the holdback, less the 1% affiliate discount, less the $500 military rebate and then added back in their doc fee and protection fee for profit. I got Mopar wheel locks with the protection fee which was $40. The protection fee also included cleaning and prepping the vehicle, which should be a sunk cost anyway. I didn't argue given the fact I was getting a great deal on the Jeep. Profit on the Jeep for them was $579-$40 for the locks plus what they get from FCA for selling a ton of jeeps, etc.

I'm sure there is other hidden profit in the deal because if I had gone to Koons I could've saved an additional $500. So if I had to guess, they made about $1000 on the deal which was a combination of cash and incentives they get back from FCA for very minimal effort as there was little to no back and forth in negotiations eating up time for the salesman or the sales manager. Finance took about 30min and I added in the MaxCare Lifetime warranty for $2665, which gave them an additional $100 profit.

My salesman had over 20 on order, so if they make $1000 on average per order, then in the first quarter of 2018 they made $20,000 in gross profit just from selling Wranglers.

I've seen some others post 7-8% below invoice and I've seen some really low OTD prices. I'd love to see those owners post details. I know some prices are contingent on using dealer financing which the dealer gets a kickback from the bank.

In the end, I'm happy, got a smoking deal, and have a good relationship with my dealer for future service and even purchases.

Given what I've learned from this deal and this forum I'm well prepared to negotiate my next vehicle purchase. I'm just not sure Porsche will be as flexible...ha!

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