Rough draft: Cost analysis of Diesel Wrangler

CarbonSteel

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Any programmed mechanical shutdown in a Jeep is otherwise a lawsuit in the making.
Nearly all, if not all, post-2007 diesels go into a limp mode when the emissions system has a failure. Plenty of 4x4 diesels out there that have had this issue on road and off, no lawsuits that I have seen. Modern diesels are a bad idea for most people, particularly those who assume they are like the "good old days" of diesel ownership.





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GARRIGA

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Thats the problem, its nearly impossible to check for software issues, or issues that the software HASNT picked up yet (like a dying catalytic converter.).
There’s a workaround. As it pertains to aging parts. Just replace them early. Software doesn’t just go bad. Something caused it to go bad. Hope is people don’t mess with their CPU.

Ever since we abandoned carburetors in pursuit of squeezing more performance out of the same block or better fuel efficiency with all the emission controls we introduced the chance for ghosts in our systems to reek havoc. It is what it is.

If any are seriously concerned about getting stranded then carry survival gear and always have an EPIRB both personal and a larger unit. Sat phone not a bad idea. Both mostly used for sea ventures but both can be life saving and should be considered as essential as a shovel, Jerry can or lift.
 

Goin2drt

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Yes people should buy diesel (or electric cars for that matter) based on want not pricing. All these calculations I have seen for diesel and electric cars takes a VERY long time to break even.
I think most buy electric and diesel cars because of preference just like buying a Rubicon vs a Sahara etc. All about choices. If you are buying purely on savings, buy something else
 

toolaide4fit

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With respect.....

Do people actually care about cost effectiveness, or is that just something we tell our significant others to get away with stuff?
NOPE! I don't! I don't worry about sensor failures. I don't worry about flat tires or running out of Def. You can "What if?" your life to death. Software doesn't go bad! It works exactly as it is programed.

Buy extra sensors! There are work arounds for most everything if you are smart. If you aren't smart then pay someone to have a solution to your problem. Take extra fluids when you go wheeling, because I bet you will need that way before you need a new sensor.

This is all crazy talk. Crap happens everyday to every type of vehicle. They only way to be 100 percent safe and not take risks is sit at home! For all you "RISK TAKERS" see you on the trials. I've got your back and I know you've got mine.

When will they build my new Jeep???
 

JLURD

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Nearly all, if not all, post-2007 diesels go into a limp mode when the emissions system has a failure. Plenty of 4x4 diesels out there that have had this issue on road and off, no lawsuits that I have seen. Modern diesels are a bad idea for most people, particularly those who assume they are like the "good old days" of diesel ownership.
Limp mode will get you home. Refusing to turn on will not. The proportion of and total number of people wheeling JLU 3.0s will be higher than any other modern diesel vehicle in the US. The capability of these rigs compared to the others you reference will be vastly superior, further increasing the chances of a programmed failure far from civilization. Guess we’ll see.
 

CarbonSteel

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Limp mode will get you home. Refusing to turn on will not. The proportion of and total number of people wheeling JLU 3.0s will be higher than any other modern diesel vehicle in the US. The capability of these rigs compared to the others you reference will be vastly superior, further increasing the chances of a programmed failure far from civilization. Guess we’ll see.
I was not clear on what I meant--there have been many cases of limp mode and complete failures, but there have not been lawsuits (should there be is a different story). I think it is a very bad idea to design a system such that if the emission system fails (or any part thereof), it ham strings or totally disables the vehicle. From my estimation, we have "gone too far" with diesel emissions and if there is no way to design them not to disable the vehicle, then diesel engines are not fit for use in this modern age. The vast majority of the "tuners" out there have been taken down by the EPA for existing vehicles and I would be very skeptical that a new one will suddenly appear for the FCA diesel.

Granted, I do not like the smell of burnt diesel or black soot rolling everywhere, but I also do not relish the idea of when (not if) part of the emission system fails that I will be either stuck somewhere or face an unmanageable repair bill or both. I kicked a 2015 Ford Powerstroke to the curb in early 2018, not due to any issues that it was currently having, but for the future ones that it most certainly would have out of warranty (of course). Everyone has to make their own minds up, but I would seriously suggest that potential buyers (especially those who have not owned a diesel in a while or have never owned a post-2007 diesel) to do their homework and check it twice.
 

ShineJL

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If you buy a Wrangler w/ Diesel for $3k more than a gasser, come time to sell, the car will be worth $2-3k more than a gasser, so you’re not really losing $3k.

You’re getting more MPG and more Torque. A tuning chip might extract more power and mpg.

You’re getting range and less frequent gas station visits. Time is money.
 

GARRIGA

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If you buy a Wrangler w/ Diesel for $3k more than a gasser, come time to sell, the car will be worth $2-3k more than a gasser, so you’re not really losing $3k.

You’re getting more MPG and more Torque. A tuning chip might extract more power and mpg.

You’re getting range and less frequent gas station visits. Time is money.
that’s the part I keep pointing out on any discussion where the added cost is used to justify not adding it yet the author fails to realize they will get most if not all possibly back when sold.

I’d like to see a comparison of this diesel Jeep five years from now compared to those who swapped a hemi and how much they recouped from their transformation. Cheapest 400 plus torque for those wanting torque.
 

CarbonSteel

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that’s the part I keep pointing out on any discussion where the added cost is used to justify not adding it yet the author fails to realize they will get most if not all possibly back when sold.
Of course, one would need to factor in the cost differential of the fuel (if any) and the increased cost of diesel maintenance over that of a gasoline engine.
 

GARRIGA

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Of course, one would need to factor in the cost differential of the fuel (if any) and the increased cost of diesel maintenance over that of a gasoline engine.
At that point. Forget the math. Just buy a Prius.

It’s not always about cents vs sense. Sometimes it’s just about smiles per mile. Jeeps in general suck on fuel economy. Brick on wheels usually are. Add diesel. Get brick on steroids. ;)
 

CarbonSteel

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At that point. Forget the math. Just buy a Prius.

It’s not always about cents vs sense. Sometimes it’s just about smiles per mile. Jeeps in general suck on fuel economy. Brick on wheels usually are. Add diesel. Get brick on steroids. ;)
I totally agree with the "smiles per mile" it is why I traded an AMG for my Rubicon. The part I struggle with (and this is generally--not meant for you) is that a modern diesel will **almost always** cost more than its gasoline equivalent to own and operate, the difference in MPG fully included. Post-2007 diesels are not the ones of yesteryear and deleting the emissions should not be an option and we have both said--time will tell.
 

GARRIGA

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I can’t speak for others but I’m not buying a diesel for its fuel efficiency. I’m getting it for torque and practicality such as being able to have better access to fuel during emergencies such as the guaranteed shortages that occur just before a hurricane and post, combined with the fact their are thousands of truck stops between home and where ever I need to go should the need warrant along with the fact that carrying diesel is safer and refueling from a can is considerably safer because of the higher required heat needed to combust. Cost comparisons don’t take those types of intangibles into the equation.

Current options to obtain torque without going diesel is a hemi swap or LS. The kit alone cost $5k. Crate engines can exceed $20k plus. How much more maintenance would one have to endure to surpass that? Jeep is never getting a hemi factory installed. Sadly.

Something else to ponder. My plan. Drive the diesel for now then when it’s time to upgrade the daily driver turn this into an off-road only vehicle. Bye bye emission control. At that point it sits on trailer until off-road.

Unless an all electric Jeep comes out. That’s my holly grail of leaving the pavement behind and having fun away from crazy drivers and all the chaos I endure to and from where I make the beacon so I don’t have to worry about how much it costs to get a well earned smile. :)
 
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JLURD

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I can’t speak for others but I’m not buying a diesel for its fuel efficiency. I’m getting it for torque and practicality such as being able to have better access to fuel during emergencies such as the guaranteed shortages that occur just before a hurricane and post combined with the fact their arethousands of truck stops between home and where ever I need to go should the need warrant
Another consideration, in most regions there are sufficient numbers of homes with 200+ gallon home heating oil tanks if things got really ugly.
 

56nomad56

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You have to wait for your kid to dictate where and how you're going to live the rest of your life? Good luck.
One kid in college, one a junior in high school. My wife wants to settle close to where they live so she can be a grandma. Sorry if that means something to us.

That, and we're stuck here for at least 10 more years until we (both public school employees) can retire.
 

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