Redo of Steering TSB 08-074-20

Crawldad

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my story:
Synergy Jeep JL / JLU / JT Front Track Bar and Sector Shaft Brace
and HD adjustable trackbar.

fixed. fixed everything. Before the TSB's and before replacing the steering box. when i was driving my 2019 Sport

I put a similar aftermarket brace on my RAM 3500, and that steering is perfect now. no more wander.

my 2021 rubicon is getting one, it just came in today and is sitting here next to me in the box. the 2021 is fine, just a little wander. i'm being proactive.

without the brace, there is a LOT of force on the steering box. not only is it turning your vehicle (radial force = torque), it's absorbing left / right forces as well. a few good potholes and your steering box (brand new) will start developing play.

the brace with the bearing at the end of the steering shaft where it exits the pitman arm is the best solution.

1615498802091.png





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Dusty

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Yes, My steering is the Black Iron box my bad did not elaborate, i had checked the number on it previously when i started to learn about things with Jeeps.
Yes it is my First Jeep and first Solid axle.
I have been driving for nearly 30years and i know what and how cars should handle on any normal given day.
The first day i took it home, back in October, tires were 38psi and all along the way the feel was "different" , chalked it up to being a Jeep with Axles etc..was expecting it...but when i learnt about the steering on the forums it opened my eyes to things i thought were normal.

First, it tracks well but you have to keep giving small nudges , left or right all the time, so if im in my lane, its like playing pong in between it....people would think im drunk.
So after asking here i was advised to lower the tires a bit, so i did to 33-34 cold and it runs around
35 max 36 (winter time) and it did feel much better but the steering had a small gap ( not that much of an issue but still) and if i turn to the left by about 10Oclock it stays at 10.....NEVER goes back to center...unless its more than a 10 O'clock turn...
If i turn right then it does return to center but not fully but much much better, they say solid axles are like this but i'm sure turning left has an issue.

Right next day after i bought it i went back to finish some paper work and told the advisors, she said "first jeep?'
Yes i replied..
"That's how it is and its a jeep thing". I swear to you they did not even wanna look at it.

Now, i did tyre rotation and oil change at 6K miles and the problem got worse ....I can drive straight when the steering is at the 11 oclock ....I am sur eit needs an alignment but if i were to take it to them what should i tell them exactly to look at or check? bolts? tighten stuff up? etc? i want to be specific so they dont brush me off.

I am not very technically knowledgeable with Jeeps but i am learning.
My first mods are gonna be aesthetic mostly as i dont offroad much on this kind of terrain (moved here from Dubai where we did sand mostly in defenders and landrovers and toyotas etc) so its a different game.

Sorry for the long post just wanted to give as much as i can background . As for the TSB i saw there's many revisions for the same thing and cant find any difference....i dont want to go to the dealer looking ignorant especially if i go to another dealer they might tell me not our problem or pay for alignment etc...

Thanks again
I suggest not taking mechanical or engineering advice from anyone in sales. Call the service department and make an appointment to bring it in. Minus the tire pressure and rotation info, explain the play in the wheel and ask them to update all the TSBs, include any computer flashes.
 

Boogey

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I suggest not taking mechanical or engineering advice from anyone in sales. Call the service department and make an appointment to bring it in. Minus the tire pressure and rotation info, explain the play in the wheel and ask them to update all the TSBs, include any computer flashes.
Will do that after the weekend. Just to make it clear , it was the service advisor that told me all this when next day i went into the service dept.They know me well cuz i wrecked their heads with questions and even the audio with the USB carplay had issues as i drove in...When i was done "Checked the Audio carplay and no problems found" Next time it happens dont turn off the car and come straight here we will check it out " :) sure will....ill leave everything and drive right up.I think i may need to take a video of this issue and post it if i get no where.

Thanks again
 
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Dusty

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Will do that after the weekend. Just to make it clear , it was the service advisor that told me all this when next day i went into the service dept.They know me well cuz i wrecked their heads with questions and even the audio with the USB carplay had issues as i drove in...When i was done "Checked the Audio carplay and no problems found" Next time it happens dont turn off the car and come straight here we will check it out " :) sure will....ill leave everything and drive right up.I think i may need to take a video of this issue and post it if i get no where.

Thanks again
Yeah, they always use the excuse of “cannot replicate customer’s complaint”. They had a lot boy/detailer drive my JL around after ‘fixing’ the steering. The lot boy said it drove just fine... that’s what they reported back to Jeep to close my case.
Good luck! I don’t know why they make warranty work such a pain.
 

entropy

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Yes, My steering is the Black Iron box my bad did not elaborate, i had checked the number on it previously when i started to learn about things with Jeeps.
Yes it is my First Jeep and first Solid axle.
I have been driving for nearly 30years and i know what and how cars should handle on any normal given day.
The first day i took it home, back in October, tires were 38psi and all along the way the feel was "different" , chalked it up to being a Jeep with Axles etc..was expecting it...but when i learnt about the steering on the forums it opened my eyes to things i thought were normal.

First, it tracks well but you have to keep giving small nudges , left or right all the time, so if im in my lane, its like playing pong in between it....people would think im drunk.
So after asking here i was advised to lower the tires a bit, so i did to 33-34 cold and it runs around
35 max 36 (winter time) and it did feel much better but the steering had a small gap ( not that much of an issue but still) and if i turn to the left by about 10Oclock it stays at 10.....NEVER goes back to center...unless its more than a 10 O'clock turn...
If i turn right then it does return to center but not fully but much much better, they say solid axles are like this but i'm sure turning left has an issue.

Right next day after i bought it i went back to finish some paper work and told the advisors, she said "first jeep?'
Yes i replied..
"That's how it is and its a jeep thing". I swear to you they did not even wanna look at it.

Now, i did tyre rotation and oil change at 6K miles and the problem got worse ....I can drive straight when the steering is at the 11 oclock ....I am sur eit needs an alignment but if i were to take it to them what should i tell them exactly to look at or check? bolts? tighten stuff up? etc? i want to be specific so they dont brush me off.

I am not very technically knowledgeable with Jeeps but i am learning.
My first mods are gonna be aesthetic mostly as i dont offroad much on this kind of terrain (moved here from Dubai where we did sand mostly in defenders and landrovers and toyotas etc) so its a different game.

Sorry for the long post just wanted to give as much as i can background . As for the TSB i saw there's many revisions for the same thing and cant find any difference....i dont want to go to the dealer looking ignorant especially if i go to another dealer they might tell me not our problem or pay for alignment etc...

Thanks again
So keep in mind if the road has any, the smallest camber to it, you have to constantly "fight" the camber, meaning compensate with the steering wheel because of the SFA. Also any small bump oe pothole on the road is going to push the jeep to the side, thats normal.

Still your experience does not sound normal to me, specially since you are saying the steering wheel doesnt go back to center. Have you run an allignment check on your jeep? what numbers do you get? your caster my be too low. Is it a Rubicon?

Just for the sake of it find the smoothest, flattest road you can and drive the jeep. when cruising straight let go off the steering wheel and see how long it takes for you to make an adjustment. It should drive straight. Mine does.
 

Boogey

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So keep in mind if the road has any, the smallest camber to it, you have to constantly "fight" the camber, meaning compensate with the steering wheel because of the SFA. Also any small bump oe pothole on the road is going to push the jeep to the side, thats normal.

Still your experience does not sound normal to me, specially since you are saying the steering wheel doesnt go back to center. Have you run an alignment check on your jeep? what numbers do you get? your caster my be too low. Is it a Rubicon?

Just for the sake of it find the smoothest, flattest road you can and drive the jeep. when cruising straight let go off the steering wheel and see how long it takes for you to make an adjustment. It should drive straight. Mine does.
I have a 2021 JLU sport S, I cannot adjust the camber unless i fit diff LCA i was told.
No alignment was ever checked or made when i bought it off the lot or when i serviced the oil and rotated that one time.
If i go in and tell them about the mess after the tire rotation im afraid they might tell me it needs an alignment and i have to pay, thats why im looking for the correct approach. I guess ill just tell them the story from the start and hope they done doze off in the middle of it ....

I have tested this on straight, flat newly paved roads, on windy roads and driven over uneven bumps and i can confirm it DOES drive straight if i aim it down the road but the steering wheel has a small gap and i could have the steering at 12 o clock or 11 o clock and it will drive straight, also at 1 Oclock too...thats the gap.
If i put it on 10 it starts to turn left slowly but it stays there.....
On 1 o'clock it turns back to 12 but just.

so yeah....now the tires in this weather are 36-37 when cold....so it is all confusing, i know many factors are at play so lets see what they say. i am sure they wont tell me " Hey , dont worry, we checked and your NEW Steering box is bad from the start and we shall replace it."
 

entropy

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I have a 2021 JLU sport S, I cannot adjust the camber unless i fit diff LCA i was told.
No alignment was ever checked or made when i bought it off the lot or when i serviced the oil and rotated that one time.
If i go in and tell them about the mess after the tire rotation im afraid they might tell me it needs an alignment and i have to pay, thats why im looking for the correct approach. I guess ill just tell them the story from the start and hope they done doze off in the middle of it ....

I have tested this on straight, flat newly paved roads, on windy roads and driven over uneven bumps and i can confirm it DOES drive straight if i aim it down the road but the steering wheel has a small gap and i could have the steering at 12 o clock or 11 o clock and it will drive straight, also at 1 Oclock too...thats the gap.
If i put it on 10 it starts to turn left slowly but it stays there.....
On 1 o'clock it turns back to 12 but just.

so yeah....now the tires in this weather are 36-37 when cold....so it is all confusing, i know many factors are at play so lets see what they say. i am sure they wont tell me " Hey , dont worry, we checked and your NEW Steering box is bad from the start and we shall replace it."
I dont think theres anything wrong with your steering box. Just take the Jeep to get an allignment check, a check is free. It doesnt have to be at the dealer. You probably need to get the steering wheel adjusted, it is cheap and easy. Dealer might do for free under warranty.

Also dont let the forum get to your head. It is extremely unlikely you have the bad steering, specially with a 2021 sport. The vast majority of JLs have normal steering, even prior to 2021.
 
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2mnycars

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Wait, I have the 2021 JLU and it came with the Steel box, when i went to the service the next day and told them it has play /not correct return to center etc they told me it s a jeep thing and they cant do anything since i have the new box.I rotated tyres a month ago and changed oil and the only way to lessen the wandering and track str8 was to deflate to 35 ish PSI. When i got it back after the oil change and tyre rotation as i said, the return to center from the left back to center is much worse...

AS i understood, there is also a NEW TSB for this whole fiasco? even for 2021 that have the steel box? any links for that? From the day i bought my Jeep and i sensed my dealer was not the type that wants to do anything to be honest.If i take it to another dealer will they charge me for looking at it or re aligning or what not? sorry but This is my first purchase here in the US and i have no clue how it goes.
First, it's not a handful or there would be a handful of posts here on this forum and the Gladiator forum.
I started reading here 1 year and 7 months ago because of steering issues.

I suggest you PM @JeepCares Too many of us have heard, "It's a Jeep Thing".

If it was easy to fix they would have done it quietly and finished it first time.

I don't know if you need a new box. Suggest you air down and see if the problem goes away.

My case....

What I know is that the selling dealer was no help. It's a Jeep thing. Probably heard that 6 or 7 times from them. So I talked to @JeepCares and they were most helpful I'm Canadian; they referred me to FCA Jeep Canada Customer Care. With that introduction FCA Canada CC was most helpful. I did find a new dealer, recommended by them. I made an appointment (required in Canada). They agreed; ordered parts. FCA Jeep Canada followed up, and made sure ALL the parts were there. The Tech that did the work did a wonderful job.

My story doesn't matter. What matters is that you get your Jeep handling the way you want it to.

Hope this helps. I have the new black box for the JLU. It made the Jeep drivable at highway speed. It was horrible before and was all over the road. UNSAFE.

https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/fo...o-help-cure-steering-issues-68394087aa.25299/

Hope the link helps.
 

Boogey

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I dont think theres anything wrong with your steering box. Just take the Jeep to get an allignment check, a check is free. It doesnt have to be at the dealer. You probably need to get the steering wheel adjusted, it is cheap and easy. Dealer might do for free under warranty.

Also dont let the forum get to your head. It is extremely unlikely you have the bad steering, specially with a 2021 sport. The vast majority of JLs have normal steering, even prior to 2021.
Thank you , you might be right and i will only know once i go there and have a conclusive answer or result.I hope i do not have a bad steering box and it only needs alignment, but what makes me think most is that when i had just taken the keys, it felt wobbly, like if i took my eyes of the road for a second and looked at something on either side of the car even for a short second i would find myself in a bad spot to say the least...I just cant get it to go straight.....there has to always be small correctional nudges..left, right, left right, left right... UNTIL i lowered the tyre pressure..thats when it was a bit better...

Lets see this week.I will 100% post a video of this issue before i take it ....thanks again
 

Boogey

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First, it's not a handful or there would be a handful of posts here on this forum and the Gladiator forum.
I started reading here 1 year and 7 months ago because of steering issues.

I suggest you PM @JeepCares Too many of us have heard, "It's a Jeep Thing".

If it was easy to fix they would have done it quietly and finished it first time.

I don't know if you need a new box. Suggest you air down and see if the problem goes away.

My case....

What I know is that the selling dealer was no help. It's a Jeep thing. Probably heard that 6 or 7 times from them. So I talked to @JeepCares and they were most helpful I'm Canadian; they referred me to FCA Jeep Canada Customer Care. With that introduction FCA Canada CC was most helpful. I did find a new dealer, recommended by them. I made an appointment (required in Canada). They agreed; ordered parts. FCA Jeep Canada followed up, and made sure ALL the parts were there. The Tech that did the work did a wonderful job.

My story doesn't matter. What matters is that you get your Jeep handling the way you want it to.

Hope this helps. I have the new black box for the JLU. It made the Jeep drivable at highway speed. It was horrible before and was all over the road. UNSAFE.

https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/fo...o-help-cure-steering-issues-68394087aa.25299/

Hope the link helps.
Maybe i am overthinking it as @entropy said but i still have my concerns.I am not a new driver and you can sense when something is not the way it should be. I will go to them and insist on a solution and keep you guys updated so we can add my experience to this post...

Thanks!
 

Boogey

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my story:
Synergy Jeep JL / JLU / JT Front Track Bar and Sector Shaft Brace
and HD adjustable trackbar.

fixed. fixed everything. Before the TSB's and before replacing the steering box. when i was driving my 2019 Sport

I put a similar aftermarket brace on my RAM 3500, and that steering is perfect now. no more wander.

my 2021 rubicon is getting one, it just came in today and is sitting here next to me in the box. the 2021 is fine, just a little wander. i'm being proactive.

without the brace, there is a LOT of force on the steering box. not only is it turning your vehicle (radial force = torque), it's absorbing left / right forces as well. a few good potholes and your steering box (brand new) will start developing play.

the brace with the bearing at the end of the steering shaft where it exits the pitman arm is the best solution.

1615498802091.png
This is the second time i was told about this as a clear solution and if everything fails at the dealership and i get no results them i am going this route.
 

Crawldad

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This is the second time i was told about this as a clear solution and if everything fails at the dealership and i get no results them i am going this route.
the place i took my jeep when the problem started installed the two parts free of charge, since their first go at the repair failed.
 

2mnycars

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Maybe i am overthinking it as @entropy said but i still have my concerns.I am not a new driver and you can sense when something is not the way it should be. I will go to them and insist on a solution and keep you guys updated so we can add my experience to this post...

Thanks!
We have a culture where modifying Jeeps is cool. And it's really cool to modify a Jeep to make it stronger and more capable.
What's not cool is paying to modify a Jeep to correct a problem that's in the design or making of a Jeep.
When I worked at 3M Canada I was encouraged to ask questions as an engineer. First: "Did it ever work?" If it did, then "What's changed?"

My Jeep is a lot better since the steering gear was changed.
I feel badly for those people that have had the change done and it's as bad or worse.

It was FCA Jeep Canada Customer Care that suggested I change dealers for service. I'm glad they did.
Now there's a new TSB I have to decide whether to get the work done on that TSB. I've got some thinking to do...
 

Boogey

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We have a culture where modifying Jeeps is cool. And it's really cool to modify a Jeep to make it stronger and more capable.
What's not cool is paying to modify a Jeep to correct a problem that's in the design or making of a Jeep.
When I worked at 3M Canada I was encouraged to ask questions as an engineer. First: "Did it ever work?" If it did, then "What's changed?"

My Jeep is a lot better since the steering gear was changed.
I feel badly for those people that have had the change done and it's as bad or worse.

It was FCA Jeep Canada Customer Care that suggested I change dealers for service. I'm glad they did.
Now there's a new TSB I have to decide whether to get the work done on that TSB. I've got some thinking to do...
You are right, there are many components that can make one Jeep be fixed and another that can't...makes you think of Quality control and how these are put together, what they missed etc etc....

You are also 100% on point with the dealer , finding one that will actually go above and beyond to help is rare these days. Once they sell it there job is mostly done.
 

Boogey

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JLU Sport S 2021
my story:
Synergy Jeep JL / JLU / JT Front Track Bar and Sector Shaft Brace
and HD adjustable trackbar.

fixed. fixed everything. Before the TSB's and before replacing the steering box. when i was driving my 2019 Sport

I put a similar aftermarket brace on my RAM 3500, and that steering is perfect now. no more wander.

my 2021 rubicon is getting one, it just came in today and is sitting here next to me in the box. the 2021 is fine, just a little wander. i'm being proactive.

without the brace, there is a LOT of force on the steering box. not only is it turning your vehicle (radial force = torque), it's absorbing left / right forces as well. a few good potholes and your steering box (brand new) will start developing play.

the brace with the bearing at the end of the steering shaft where it exits the pitman arm is the best solution.

1615498802091.png
Anyone know if i NEED the Synergy Adjustable HD trackbar along with the BRACE to make it a better steering ride if I do NOT have any lift (stock) or if i dont even plan on it in the near future? would the Synergy Brace be enough for my JLUS? from what i gathered adding the trackbar is for reinforcing when you have a lift, but will it do any difference if i dont? waste of money? Got quoted 600+ for both just labor if i bring in the parts, which seems kind of ridiculous for a job like that.

Trackbar takes like 15 minutes to install, brace could take 1 hour tops if you are a shop/pro so i dont wanna spend extra money for parts/ labor if there are things unneccessary.
 

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