nomographer

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I wonder how many with issues (of driver happiness) are actually because of the electronic throttle control moreso than the clutch.

The hydraulic clutch pedal is certainly not a dump truck, but the engagement has been consistent and clear. As one would tell a new manual driver, start by slowly releasing the clutch pedal to find how it behaves from a standstill. In my four-month old, this always works on flat surfaces without stalling, and even up some hills, with no accelerator pedal.

Of course this isn't the way one wants to drive so the next stage is to give it a little throttle. This seems to be where the issue actually lives, however, if you can't actually feather the throttle. Can you hold it in neutral at 1500 rpm? Or does it pop up to 3k instantly? If you're trying to reverse slowly and cautiously, you'll stall out if your throttle is all or nothing.

So then, does your accelerator pedal have 'travel', or is it all or nothing? Remember back to previous vehicles where you'd be testing the engine after an oil change, listening to its sounds, and sitting in neutral at idle, then holding at 1k, then 1.5k, 2k, etc? Get in your JL and try it.

If it only has idle and 4k, you'll not have a good time syncing speeds while shifting. Recalibrate your accelerator sensor.
 

daveprice7

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....
The fact that my rusty manual 1997 Ford Ranger with 205k miles and very little maintenance feels miles better than my JLU Clutch is pretty disappointing.

I don't know if it's just mine, but the feel is non-existent. It's like a two stage clutch. The top half has more resistance vs. the bottom half. It's already feather light and it's just the most annoying clutch I've ever used. It's pretty unpredictable and while it cold I can feel this gritty grind feel. I also offroad a lot and going over anything. Even steep hills makes my clutch difficult to navigate. I just can't get used to the two stage resistance and non-existent feel to it. You have to time it just right or you will stall. But it's hard to time it because you don't know when it's going to grab.
...
Hey, I had a manual '97 ranger with over 200k miles too! And, yes, even though the transmission whined in every gear but 4th, it shifted much better than the JL.

But, your "two stage" remarks are really the crux of the problem.. it's like the clutch pedal return spring kicks in hard before the clutch has fully engaged, so I have to let the clutch pedal out super, super slowly or it lurches. It's just impossible to release the pedal with a constant pressure unless you're just doing a full body butt pucker so the pedal can't catch you off guard. Annoying.
 

nomographer

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That's weird. You might want to get your system bled.

My clutch works when releasing slowly (but still works a bit faster than it sounds like you're using, maybe 1.0-1.5sec), and upshifts are really smooth above 3k (fast/immediate shifts). The only tough spot is between 2k and 3k which seems harder to match.

There should be no lurching if the tachometer shows the correct target rpm. (Right?) If there is, it's likely not operating to design. :/
 

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ive commented earlier in this post, but, after reading a lot more posts ill comment again....
i like others have driven a stick all my life, and have NEVER had a manual transmission vehicle act like this one.
The clutch pedal is to dang soft. period. No matter how hard i focus and try to train my leg (42k miles later) it is a pain in the rear end to get consistent smooth releases from a stop. I either stall, slip to much, or lurch. Every now and then ill get decent starts, once moving its no problem. I have never stalled a vehicle so much in my life. Quite honestly 4high off road if i have to go slow its a pain in the ass, because it ends up bogging and stalling. Maybe i need to experiment with 4 low more and use 2nd gear or something.

The gearing. again ridiculous. I live in northern Va. close to the mountains, if i am on back roads between 40-60 i dont even use 5th. why ? every up hill grade would require a downshift to maintain speed. Even on the freeway a mild hill requires downshifts to 4th gear. Eventually i will regear once i save the money up.

The "hiccup" as many others have mentioned in another thread. Never have i had a manual or even automatic do this. Its bullshit, and Jeep needs to come up with a dang fix for it. At first i thought the clutch was slipping, had it looked at nope, not slipping "we dont know why it does that" I dont know if its in the tuning, or maybe the throttle control or hell maybe it is the clutch slipping but this is definitely maddening.

Like i said i have driven manuals all my life, my 262K mile hard driven cobalt drives better then this jeep does. I know its not a race car but i should not feel like my clutch is slipping or my vehicle has a hiccup, and i should be able to let the clutch out with some confidence and consistency. These issues aside, i really enjoy my Jeep when its on a beach or on a fire trail with the top down.
 

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That's weird. You might want to get your system bled.

My clutch works when releasing slowly (but still works a bit faster than it sounds like you're using, maybe 1.0-1.5sec), and upshifts are really smooth above 3k (fast/immediate shifts). The only tough spot is between 2k and 3k which seems harder to match.

There should be no lurching if the tachometer shows the correct target rpm. (Right?) If there is, it's likely not operating to design. :/
I agree. If the tach is lurching, there is a problem and it needs to be seen NOW. That's a sign of the original problem that caused the recall in the first place.
 

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ive commented earlier in this post, but, after reading a lot more posts ill comment again....
i like others have driven a stick all my life, and have NEVER had a manual transmission vehicle act like this one.
The clutch pedal is to dang soft. period. No matter how hard i focus and try to train my leg (42k miles later) it is a pain in the rear end to get consistent smooth releases from a stop. I either stall, slip to much, or lurch. Every now and then ill get decent starts, once moving its no problem. I have never stalled a vehicle so much in my life. Quite honestly 4high off road if i have to go slow its a pain in the ass, because it ends up bogging and stalling. Maybe i need to experiment with 4 low more and use 2nd gear or something.

The gearing. again ridiculous. I live in northern Va. close to the mountains, if i am on back roads between 40-60 i dont even use 5th. why ? every up hill grade would require a downshift to maintain speed. Even on the freeway a mild hill requires downshifts to 4th gear. Eventually i will regear once i save the money up.

The "hiccup" as many others have mentioned in another thread. Never have i had a manual or even automatic do this. Its bullshit, and Jeep needs to come up with a dang fix for it. At first i thought the clutch was slipping, had it looked at nope, not slipping "we dont know why it does that" I dont know if its in the tuning, or maybe the throttle control or hell maybe it is the clutch slipping but this is definitely maddening.

Like i said i have driven manuals all my life, my 262K mile hard driven cobalt drives better then this jeep does. I know its not a race car but i should not feel like my clutch is slipping or my vehicle has a hiccup, and i should be able to let the clutch out with some confidence and consistency. These issues aside, i really enjoy my Jeep when its on a beach or on a fire trail with the top down.
I'd get that looked at immediately. If you've driven manuals all your life and this one behaves so differently, then you were right to think something is wrong. What you've described there is abslutely not normal. Neither is the hiccup. Yours is not working correctly. Whoever looked at it doesn't know what they are doing. I'd contact Jeep immediatly, and I mean the corporate folks, NOT that dealer who told you it is fine.

Nothing you've described there sounds right and it certainly doesn't match at all with the way mine behaves.

At a minimum, it should be re-bled, but by now that clutch would also likely have some advanced wear on it, depending on how many miles you've put on it. They should do the prescribed clutch test from recall 1, after bleeding it.

But again, I'd go to Jeep directly. I would not trust the dealership that told you it was fine.
 

OldGuyNewJeep

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Nothing you've described there sounds right and it certainly doesn't match at all with the way mine behaves.
+1

Mine drives great since day one.
 

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I agree with punkinhed 100%. I have almost 10K on mine in two years; and after driving mostly manuals for the last almost 50 years, I still can't trust myself to pull away from a stop gracefully every time, in this JL. I turned off hill start assist a long time ago and that helped; but I still can't do it right every time. In my case, I think I blame the very sensitive throttle, though. And yes, the gearing is for the EPA ratings, not driveability.
 

OldGuyNewJeep

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I agree with punkinhed 100%. I have almost 10K on mine in two years; and after driving mostly manuals for the last almost 50 years, I still can't trust myself to pull away from a stop gracefully every time, in this JL. I turned off hill start assist a long time ago and that helped; but I still can't do it right every time. In my case, I think I blame the very sensitive throttle, though. And yes, the gearing is for the EPA ratings, not driveability.
I wonder how much gearing is a factor for those of you who are having trouble. @DanW and I have Rubicons, and our stock gearing makes a lot more sense for this 6sp.
 

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I wonder how much gearing is a factor for those of you who are having trouble. @DanW and I have Rubicons, and our stock gearing makes a lot more sense for this 6sp.
I'm thinking that must be making a huge difference. The only 2 gears that I think suck are 6th and reverse. Everything else is fine. Sixth is slightly usable, depending on conditions, but any headwind or uphill and 5th gets the fuel economy advantage.
 
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Punknhed

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I'd get that looked at immediately. If you've driven manuals all your life and this one behaves so differently, then you were right to think something is wrong. What you've described there is abslutely not normal. Neither is the hiccup. Yours is not working correctly. Whoever looked at it doesn't know what they are doing. I'd contact Jeep immediatly, and I mean the corporate folks, NOT that dealer who told you it is fine.

Nothing you've described there sounds right and it certainly doesn't match at all with the way mine behaves.

At a minimum, it should be re-bled, but by now that clutch would also likely have some advanced wear on it, depending on how many miles you've put on it. They should do the prescribed clutch test from recall 1, after bleeding it.

But again, I'd go to Jeep directly. I would not trust the dealership that told you it was fine.
I had the recall done, come to find out one of the lines had a small hole in it. The dealer fixed and bleed it. I do agree though it shouldn't be doing what its doing.
 

daveprice7

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I'm thinking that must be making a huge difference. The only 2 gears that I think suck are 6th and reverse. Everything else is fine. Sixth is slightly usable, depending on conditions, but any headwind or uphill and 5th gets the fuel economy advantage.
I've long speculated that is the reason some folks think everything is peachy with their MTs (4.10 vs 3.45 gears).

If I drive like I'm racing (over-revving between shifts), I can get smooth shifts... But I don't have a Jeep to race it... and it's a piss poor design choice to match 3.45s with a transmission+engine combo that can't cope with it. They put the D44 on the manual Sports, they should have matched the gearing better too.
 

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I've long speculated that is the reason some folks think everything is peachy with their MTs (4.10 vs 3.45 gears).

If I drive like I'm racing (over-revving between shifts), I can get smooth shifts... But I don't have a Jeep to race it... and it's a piss poor design choice to match 3.45s with a transmission+engine combo that can't cope with it. They put the D44 on the manual Sports, they should have matched the gearing better too.
I agree. They actually should make gear ratios into options. If buying a Sport, I'd gladly pay more to get a better final drive ratio. It used to be common for car companies to offer that.
 

bwright1818

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I would pay extra to have mine work better, too. Is putting a 4.10 into my Sport even an option? I think they did some kind of hush-hush reflash on mine; because after having a melted, manual-control mirror replaced, I had to re-establish my Bluetooth connection and the engine has run much better, ever since, with little to no misfire. Now if I could just get the clutch operation ironed out, I might actually like driving it.....
 

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