Proof The Wrangler Diesel Could Have Had A Manual

mrhumble1

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I have seen some posts here claiming random (and nonsense) reasons why FCA is not offering the diesel on the 2-doors or with a manual. This video shows the chief engineer behind the diesel project saying "There's no technical reason" why these things are not available. It's 100% a market-driven decision, so please stop defending the absence of these things as being "required" for some technical reason.

I did like that he also said "Who knows what could happen down the road..." If I ever decide to get another Jeep years from now it will be another 2-door manual, but hopefully with that diesel in it.
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Nickp01

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Business makes business decision. News at 11.

As an aside, I’m way more surprised at the 10% take rate for the 2-door. I wonder if big picture the 2-door will end up discontinued honestly.
 

Dogboyslim

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The biggest "issue" I've heard is that the current MT gearbox can't handle the torque. Implicit in that is the statement "FCA doesn't think there will be enough of them sold to justify design and production of a compatible gearbox" This is the same as what you are saying. I'm not understanding the distinction or what you are saying needs to stop...
 

SecondTJ

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No, it wasn’t possible. The Wrangler’s D478 has max torque rating of 272 lb-ft.

They’d need to find a small, compact trans that could hold the torque. Which is no small feat.

The TR6060 could handle the torque, but would it fit? Also it’s tall first gear (2.98) doesn’t suite a Jeep.

Not to mention nobody offers a diesel and manual transmission anymore. The market is dead.

GM dropped in 2006
Ford dropped in 2011
Ram dropped in 2018
 
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mrhumble1

mrhumble1

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The market is dead.
Easy to say a market is dead when nobody makes a thing anymore. Kinda hard to buy something that doesn't exist.

I am pretty sure I am not the only Wrangler owner who would have loved to see a manual diesel option when they bought their Jeep.
 

SecondTJ

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Easy to say a market is dead when nobody makes a thing anymore. Kinda hard to buy something that doesn't exist.

I am pretty sure I am not the only Wrangler owner who would have loved to see a manual diesel option when they bought their Jeep.
It’s dead for a reason though, the market is too small to justify the expense. If the sales and profits were there, companies would continue to build them.

Manual transmissions are simply a dying breed. I’m heart broken the new C8 Corvette is DCT only.
 

BuffaloBill

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I can’t help but wonder if epa requirements don’t play a role in the manual diesel decision also. With a computer controlled automatic they can keep the engine operating in a desired loading range. With a manual we as drivers make that decision. Heaven forbid we polite a bit more......
 

Hootbro

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Easy to say a market is dead when nobody makes a thing anymore. Kinda hard to buy something that doesn't exist.

I am pretty sure I am not the only Wrangler owner who would have loved to see a manual diesel option when they bought their Jeep.
Internet talk is cheap. You can easily count on 50% of those flapping their gums saying they want one, to fall off to wayside once it is actually out there and they have to put their money on the line. The remaining 50%, a good portion of them are going to take their sweet time buying one and will then hem and haw. Gauging interest in a product based on internet forum talk alone is a sure way to go bankrupt for something as expensive as a automobile.

Basically implying how will they know what sales are going to be if they do not offer it to begin with is a recipe for disaster and any company with a moderate of business acumen knows this.
 
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mrhumble1

mrhumble1

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Internet talk is cheap. You can easily count on 50% of those flapping their gums saying they want one, to fall off to wayside once it is actually out there and they have to put their money on the line.
I already did put my money on the line. You can see by my profile that I ordered a 2-door manual JL and bought it in March. I would have jumped at the chance to have a diesel engine in it. My point is that we don't even have a chance to get one even now, so how can FCA tell how many they would have sold???

Also, one reason there are so many JLUs out there is because dealers really push them. When I was ordering my 2-door they tried to sell me several 4-doors until they finally got the hint that I was serious.
 

cbrenthus

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It’s dead for a reason though, the market is too small to justify the expense. If the sales and profits were there, companies would continue to build them.

Manual transmissions are simply a dying breed. I’m heart broken the new C8 Corvette is DCT only.
Yup, I was going to bring up the C8 as well. And GM came out and said that the engineering required didn't justify the low demand for a true manual. The issue the 'vette has is that a shifter would require cutting a hole in the tunnel, resulting in structural loss that they'd need to engineer around, and they don't want to do all that work for the 10% that want it :(

However, I wonder what will happen in a year or 2 - if lots of people are swapping in manuals with aftermarket support, they might offer it. Remember, that's how the 4 door JK came about. There were lots of TJs and YJs being cut up and welded together into 4 door Wranglers for years, and Jeep finally realized there was a demand! ;)
 

fat_head

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I can’t help but wonder if epa requirements don’t play a role in the manual diesel decision also. With a computer controlled automatic they can keep the engine operating in a desired loading range. With a manual we as drivers make that decision. Heaven forbid we polite a bit more......
You can hold gears as long as you want in a auto. I hate fed.gov as much as the next patriot, but this isn’t fed.gov getting in the way this time.
 

Hootbro

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I already did put my money on the line. You can see by my profile that I ordered a 2-door manual JL and bought it in March. I would have jumped at the chance to have a diesel engine in it. My point is that we don't even have a chance to get one even now, so how can FCA tell how many they would have sold???

Also, one reason there are so many JLUs out there is because dealers really push them. When I was ordering my 2-door they tried to sell me several 4-doors until they finally got the hint that I was serious.
I guess you read it how you want to read it and missed the point. You and all the other special unicorns are not enough of a business case in their minds to make the juice worth the squeeze.
 

BuffaloBill

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You can hold gears as long as you want in a auto. I hate fed.gov as much as the next patriot, but this isn’t fed.gov getting in the way this time.
I was thinking not of taching out each gear but rather how with a manual a driver could lug the engine more than with an automatic.

One of the changes I noticed with my Ecodiesel Ram after getting the approved emission update, is that the engine isn’t allowed to pull quite as hard before downshifting. From what I’ve read that’s one of the many variables with emission output. I also wonder though if they did that to put less stress on the main and rod bearings. FCA hasn’t fessed up about the cause of the bearing failures.
 

Litfuse

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I believe I read in Automotive News that manual transmissions accounted for only 1.2% of sales in the US. Only to be surpassed by EV by .2% at 1.4%.
 
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