Plug-In Hybrid Electric Wrangler Still on Track for 2020 Release Date

[KnG818]

$20K isn't the number though...re-read. It's just under $3K for the level 2 system, installed.

At that price point, it probably wouldn't take long to recoup it depending on one's driving habits and range per week.

My particular case would take 108 weeks to recoup the cost at gas being $3/gallon....but that's assuming the electricity were free, which it's not.

Again, while PHEV vs. hybrid may make more sense economically, it still doesn't make much sense for my own personal situation and I'd think even less so on a vehicle like a 5K lb Wrangler on 37s. But then, commuter cars and offroad vehicles are pretty divergent anyway.

I said 20k for cost of solar panels and charge station combined.

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[JMatt]

I said 20k for cost of solar panels and charge station combined.

LOL. All you need is a 240v outlet on 200amp service. I think I spent $150. I have a Tesla Model S and a JKUR with a JLUR Diesel on order. And I raced blown-alcohol dragsters that got 0.2 mpg. It's not (necessarily) about saving the planet, or saving on fuel costs. You've got all the justification you need the first time you nose up to a ledge and the extra electric torque just lifts your Jeep up and over.

 

[Goin2drt]

I saw a great break down once from a EV owner. No clue what forum it’s was on. He was in the weeds and all costs were SoCal costs. He took into consideration almost everything. Bottom line his break even point for that particular car was 10 yrs of ownership. There isn’t any math that works where an EV saves money, there just isn’t. The delta of a technology premium is still too great. When EV’s are more mass produced and the price of the cost of goods comes down then maybe.

Like I stated buy it because you want it. No way you can justify it monetarily. The bigger issue I have is the range anxiety. That would compound immensely on a Wrangler if you actually took it off road. No help out in the middle of Moab when that trail took you a lot longer than you expected. It will be a cool mall wagon.

 

[noswttea4u]

What's the typical cost of adding the EV charging station to one's home?

***EDIT***Looks like average cost installed is up to $2.7K for a "level 2" charging station. Level 1 is up to $2.3K***

Also, do you need 400A service or does "normal" 200A suffice?

240A is what they take....not sure if that necessitates a panel upgrade or not. Guessing not.

Level 1 is a regular outlet. No cost.

My cost to add a level 2 charger in my garage was $1500 including the charger. It had to be ran from the panel in my finished basement to the garage on the other side of the house. If your panel is in the garage, then it would be about $250 plus cost of charger.

My panel is 150a and was fine with the 40a charger I got which needed a 50amp breaker. If I wanted to add a hot tub, or something like that in the future, then I would need to upgrade the panel.

 

[misanthrope]

So the price varies greatly depending on where you are in the country and the location of your main breaker box....Not sure why your level 1 would be no cost....but whatever. I just wondered what the total investment would look like for an at home charging station.

Thanks for the input.

I think he meant no cost to install a level 1, as they just plug in to any 110 outlet.

 

[8flat]

Just a little information for the readers here:
First, though much of the electricity on the public grid is produced via the burning of fossil fuels, it is generally far more efficient, mainly due to economy of scale, and is usually cleaner. The advantage results in the newer MPGe ratings, which try to put PHEVs and EVs apples-to-apples with ICE vehicles when comparing cost per mile. Even the Pacifica get 84MPGe. Second, many of us would easily produce enough electricity using our current (pun?) solar electric systems, which often produce a surplus, to be able to charge a PHEV on a daily, commuter basis. Third, if the system is like the Volt, it would be a series PHEV, which means it's actually electric all of the time, so the engine serves only as a generator to recharge the battery. In this case, you would see a smaller 4 cylinder engine performing this task to reduce weight. This would mean the vehicle would have all of the instant torque of an EV, with the added range and versatility of a traditional ICE. Unfortunately, the Pacifica PHEV (upon which the Wrangler PHEV will almost certainly be based) uses a series-parallel system, which simply engages the ICE when the batteries are depleted enough to engage it (except in reverse, interestingly enough, which is always electric). So it can run all-electric for some of its advertised range, but engages the ICE depending on the demands of the driver and the battery status.
Finally, with the increasing demands on our aging in inefficient power grid, the US will be forced to turn to different forms of electricity production beyond fossil fuels while also making already overdue upgrades to the grid itself. Wind farms and solar are a start, but more flexibility is needed. Nuclear may never really take hold in this country while the images of Chernobyl and Fukushima remain in our collective memories, and the NIMBY attitudes of the entitled prevent even the most innocuous improvements. The Shoreham NPP has been sitting idle here on Long Island since its completion in 1984, and will never be operational, off-shore wind farms draw protests and opposition every year and we don't have the acreage for a large scale solar farm, but people want to run power cables to CT and NJ (regardless of the environmental impact) to tap into their nuclear output. NIMBY, but I'll use your nuclear-produced electricity, thank you very much.

This. I'm far from an enviro-nut, I own 2 big-block 454 chevys, haha.....but I've always liked the idea of electric vehicles for 2 reasons: we have the ability to generate our "fuel" at home, and the instant torque is freakin' spectacular (drive a tesla if you don't believe me).

In addition, out here in the NW a huge portion of our electricity comes from hydro. So it's actually pretty clean.

 

[Bren]

I saw a great break down once from a EV owner. No clue what forum it’s was on. He was in the weeds and all costs were SoCal costs. He took into consideration almost everything. Bottom line his break even point for that particular car was 10 yrs of ownership. There isn’t any math that works where an EV saves money, there just isn’t. The delta of a technology premium is still too great. When EV’s are more mass produced and the price of the cost of goods comes down then maybe.

Like I stated buy it because you want it. No way you can justify it monetarily. The bigger issue I have is the range anxiety. That would compound immensely on a Wrangler if you actually took it off road. No help out in the middle of Moab when that trail took you a lot longer than you expected. It will be a cool mall wagon.

My EV saves me money over a comparably equipped BMW or Audi. My charging is free, supplied by my building at no charge. I also have free supercharging. The car requires no maintenance beyond tire rotations. Wouldn't normally need brakes until 100k, but I track it so that's out the window.

Don't get me wrong, it's an expensive car. But it holds its value well and so total cost of ownership will be very low by the time I sell it.

 

[Bren]

The tiny bit of research I did (quick Google search) said the level one could run as much as $2300.....hence my confusion. I'd think that would only happen if the contractor had to run conduit/wire and install an outlet on the other end of the house if it were 110V.

How's that work exactly? I thought the system was 40 or 50A which would necessitate 240V (in most residential cases).

The charger is actually on board in the car, not on the wall. The car is intelligent, and will adjust to the power source. If I plug my car into a 110v outlet, it'll limit the draw to 12A. I can adjust it up or down based on my capacity. If I use a NEMA adapter to plug into a dryer outlet (again no cost if there's already one in the garage) it'll jump to 40A on the 240V plug.

You can buy ~$500 juice boxes to put on the wall if you don't have the right hook ups, and depending on how much power you have in your box and where your lines are running I have no doubt it could creep up to $3k... but that strikes me as a worst case scenario.

 

[Kevin Mojito]

I did my own L-2 charger. $800 for unit, under $100 for wire and 220 40 amp breaker. Then got my money back on taxes. If you have no electrical experience, do not try it on your own.

 

[Bren]

It should be noted that this PHEV Wrangler won't need a fancy charger. Assuming it's a similar sized battery as the Pacifica (16kwh), just plug it into a standard 110v wall outlet and the battery will be full in 4-5 hours (overnight).

(For contrast it takes my Tesla's 85kwh pack about 3 days to fully charge on 110v, which is why a 240v plug is necessary at home)

 

[Kevin Mojito]

It should be noted that this PHEV Wrangler won't need a fancy charger. Assuming it's a similar sized battery as the Pacifica (16kwh), just plug it into a standard 110v wall outlet and the battery will be full in 4-5 hours (overnight).

(For contrast it takes my Tesla's 85kwh pack about 3 days to fully charge on 110v, which is why a 240v plug is necessary at home)

My 7kwh battery takes like 8 hrs on 110v It sucks. 220v gets it done. Would not like to wait for the car that long to use again. over 36k and only 3K on ICE. Lots of small trips.

 

[noswttea4u]

My 7kwh battery takes like 8 hrs on 110v It sucks. 220v gets it done. Would not like to wait for the car that long to use again. over 36k and only 3K on ICE. Lots of small trips.

4amp? My Volt took around 8.5hrs with 12amp. My smart defaulted to 8amp(could manually change to 12) and took around 12 to fully charge.

 

[KnG818]

4amp? My Volt took around 8.5hrs with 12amp. My smart defaulted to 8amp(could manually change to 12) and took around 12 to fully charge.

Soooo...an electric car is only good as a secondary vehicle?

I mean gawd forbid you have an emergency and your only vehicle is dead....what about power outages too? What then?

 

[misanthrope]

The tiny bit of research I did (quick Google search) said the level one could run as much as $2300.....hence my confusion. I'd think that would only happen if the contractor had to run conduit/wire and install an outlet on the other end of the house if it were 110V.

How's that work exactly? I thought the system was 40 or 50A which would necessitate 240V (in most residential cases).

Level 1 chargers are run on up to 20a 110-120V outlets, and they take a lot of time to charge (on a Leaf-type, 22 hour to full charge). Also, many utilities/states don't offer rebates or other incentives on Level 1 charging installations. Most if not all EVs come with a simple, plug into the wall Level 1 charger.
Level 2 chargers, which use 240V breakers and lines, can range from 20 or so amps all the way up to 80, which would drastically reduce your charging time.
The chargers themselves can be found on Amazon and a gillion other places, starting under $200. The wiring? That's what's situational. Have an outlet and a lot of time? Level 1 is cheap and easy and probably comes with your EV/PHEV. Feel like charging in under 3 hours and want to have an electrician install a fancy Level 2 (or even 3)? No problem, just pony up.

 

[Squibbles]

Wranglers are notoriously bad on gas, what makes anyone thing they wont be just as bad consuming electricity?

What's the point or what's the savings?

People seem to think electricity comes from thin air. Electricity takes just as much fossil fuels to produce.

...again, what's the point?

I think like 80% of electricity in the US comes from gas generators. I think plug in hybrids would make more sense if we used more renewable energy or in a few more years when battery technology makes another leap.

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