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kidney

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Anyone know why the 2.0 doesn't have Multiair?
Price difference is not huge so I will exclude that part.

MultiAir system is very sensitive to oil type. It needs oi to operate. And such a oil is expensive and not easy to find in the USA.
So maybe they are playing safe.
The other part is NVH with cold engine

Is anyone else concerned that the upgraded Pentastar is being built in Mexico?
Any problems on Grand Cherokee?
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Redneck_Jedi

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Is anyone else concerned that the upgraded Pentastar is being built in Mexico?
About the loss of American jobs to Mexico, Yes. From an engine reliability standpoint, No.
I believe they make a few of the Hellcat and SRT engines there.
 

TPFilm1994

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Regarding the fenders and flares. Officially the fenders are the front side of the Jeep. The flares are the things that are attached to the fenders. It's all kind of misleading because in the front, the flares actually ARE the fenders. But in automotive terminology the fender is the front side.
I read and heard all the different auto "experts" referring to the aluminum fenders and knew people would get confused. One video reviewer even tapped the flare on the front of the Jeep and say these fenders are now made of aluminum. SMH
 

Matt The Hammer

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I looked up using magnesium instead of aluminum for the tailgate. This is what I found:

The Hard Facts about Magnesium:
  • Magnesium is 33% lighter than aluminum
  • 60% lighter than titanium
  • 75% lighter than steel
  • In most applications, magnesium is stronger per unit than aluminum, titanium or steel
  • A versatile metal, magnesium can also be cast into various mechanical parts and replace aluminum alloys to make them lighter and stronger.
New Cars are already using More Magnesium

More and more cars are using magnesium, so while aluminum is getting most of the media attention, magnesium is the dark horse in this race to lighter vehicles. For example, The Corvette Z06 uses magnesium roof components to reduce mass and a magnesium engine cradle to cut weight without sacrificing integrity. As a result, it is one of the lightest high-performance vehicles available on the market today.

Ford is also doing a lot of work with magnesium and the Chrysler Group employs magnesium in the interiors of its Grand Cherokee, Wrangler, Liberty, Compass and Patriot models. Its instrument panels and front console are currently being made out of a single-piece magnesium die cast. In addition, Volkswagen AG, one of the pioneers of using magnesium in its auto parts, uses magnesium gearboxes and clutch housings in many of its models, including the Golf models.


GaPHyF4RDzrts5TWCMbH.jpg


Possible Drawbacks Exist

There are some drawbacks with magnesium—it costs more than aluminum and steel and getting it out of the ground isn’t exactly a green process. Most magnesium used around the globe is sourced from China. This not only pushes up the cost through import taxes, but draws heavily on China's largely coal-fired industry to produce--a pollution and carbon dioxide nightmare. Even in the U.S, most magnesium is produced in Utah, using electrolysis of molten brine to extract magnesium from the state's Great Salt Lake.

So, discovering a way to extract magnesium without the significant environmental impact is a key goal if magnesium can become the go-to metal for our newer cars. Car designers worldwide are looking carefully at magnesium right now, because the clock is ticking and we need to get our vehicles lighter fast.

Will magnesium replace aluminum in the race to getting lighter? Only time will tell.
 

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MrJeepNut

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I looked up using magnesium instead of aluminum for the tailgate. This is what I found:

...

Will magnesium replace aluminum in the race to getting lighter? Only time will tell.
Good info, I was curious about that, but hadn't found time to research it. You saved me the trouble.
 

MrJeepNut

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Also - Magnesium burns! Hot! So if you encounter a JL a burning - git!

tenor.gif


Git Away From Here!
Good advice... I remember watching my high school chemistry teacher burn magnesium strips, and it was blinding! Imagine a whole tailgate full of it going up! Of course, I can't imagine they haven't though of this and tested it... perhaps it is alloyed with something that prevents it from igniting.
 

ColoradoJeep

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Hopefully so. I don't see the benefit of having a Rubicon for the simple fact that I will never rock crawl or do any serious trails but at the sametime, I didn't want to have the most fragile jeep not even worthy of a lift kit. :whew:
Did anyone else catch Mike Manley say that the diesel should be rated for OVER 30 MPG?....

I'm likely not a potential diesel buyer but WOW!
Not surprising considering they rate the Ram 1500 diesel at 21/29. Notice the huge difference between city and highway. Given my experience with the liberty diesel, the path to 30+ mpg is likely long highway driving with larger than stock tires that you spin in the upper gears of the automatic transmission at low engine rpms.
 

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Jason

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Good advice... I remember watching my high school chemistry teacher burn magnesium strips, and it was blinding! Imagine a whole tailgate full of it going up! Of course, I can't imagine they haven't though of this and tested it... perhaps it is alloyed with something that prevents it from igniting.
And water and magnesium that is on fire dont play together very nicely.
 

BillyHW

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I looked up using magnesium instead of aluminum for the tailgate. This is what I found:

The Hard Facts about Magnesium:
  • Magnesium is 33% lighter than aluminum
  • 60% lighter than titanium
  • 75% lighter than steel
  • In most applications, magnesium is stronger per unit than aluminum, titanium or steel
  • A versatile metal, magnesium can also be cast into various mechanical parts and replace aluminum alloys to make them lighter and stronger.
New Cars are already using More Magnesium

More and more cars are using magnesium, so while aluminum is getting most of the media attention, magnesium is the dark horse in this race to lighter vehicles. For example, The Corvette Z06 uses magnesium roof components to reduce mass and a magnesium engine cradle to cut weight without sacrificing integrity. As a result, it is one of the lightest high-performance vehicles available on the market today.

Ford is also doing a lot of work with magnesium and the Chrysler Group employs magnesium in the interiors of its Grand Cherokee, Wrangler, Liberty, Compass and Patriot models. Its instrument panels and front console are currently being made out of a single-piece magnesium die cast. In addition, Volkswagen AG, one of the pioneers of using magnesium in its auto parts, uses magnesium gearboxes and clutch housings in many of its models, including the Golf models.


GaPHyF4RDzrts5TWCMbH.jpg


Possible Drawbacks Exist

There are some drawbacks with magnesium—it costs more than aluminum and steel and getting it out of the ground isn’t exactly a green process. Most magnesium used around the globe is sourced from China. This not only pushes up the cost through import taxes, but draws heavily on China's largely coal-fired industry to produce--a pollution and carbon dioxide nightmare. Even in the U.S, most magnesium is produced in Utah, using electrolysis of molten brine to extract magnesium from the state's Great Salt Lake.

So, discovering a way to extract magnesium without the significant environmental impact is a key goal if magnesium can become the go-to metal for our newer cars. Car designers worldwide are looking carefully at magnesium right now, because the clock is ticking and we need to get our vehicles lighter fast.

Will magnesium replace aluminum in the race to getting lighter? Only time will tell.
Thanks for doing the research for us. I think I'm going to start a new thread on metallurgy. I will quote your post.
 

theplankeye

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You must have a high surface area to volume ratio to burn magnesium. You need chips or thin foil.
 

BillyHW

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You must have a high surface area to volume ratio to burn magnesium. You need chips or thin foil.
My high school chemistry teacher also did the magnesium burning trick. It was a thin piece of magnesium that he used.
 

Matt The Hammer

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There were some images of Porsche bodies burnt. They've been in the magnesium game for a while.

?q=70&w=1440&url=http%3A%2F%2Fd254andzyoxz3f.cloudfront.net%2Fcorvette-z06-fire-magnesium.jpg


So what is the problem? Well, Magnesium isn't necessarily any easier to ignite than many other automotive materials, but it burns a whole hell of a light hotter and faster.

Once ignited, magnesium will burn at a heat of more than 5000 degrees Fahrenheit. Putting off that kind of heat will easily melt aluminum the aluminum or steel found elsewhere in the car. That kind of heat is enough to immediately break a water molecule into its Hydrogen and Oxygen components, both of which are highly combustible.

Further, mg is harder to extinguish, as the standard fire extinguishers are ineffective. An mg fire requires sand or dry powder to be put out, which many fire trucks do not carry.

All of this being said, vehicle fires are by-and-large rare these days, and as we said earlier Magnesium isn't very easy to ignite without an already serious vehicle fire.
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