No PHEV Wrangler Reveal at LA Auto Show 2019

RockyMtnHigh

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Well put. The issue is, that next "battery breakthrough" is not likely to happen, ever. Same could be said for anti-gravity thrusters. They would be a great solution to all kinds of problems but you can hardly bet the farm on ever seeing them.
"The internal combustion engine automobile is too expensive, it will never be feasible." - Some guy riding around on a horse.

Progress isn't made by naysayers. It took a very long time to make the ICE as efficient and cheap as it is today. There HAS to be expensive, inefficient electric vehicles before they're standard. And if we shrugged off electric vehicles this way, with no market demand (therefore no research), the break through will never come.

But it will.

And other fun fact; Internal combustion engines are 40% efficient, at best.

 

Toycrusher

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"The internal combustion engine automobile is too expensive, it will never be feasible." - Some guy riding around on a horse.

Progress isn't made by naysayers. It took a very long time to make the ICE as efficient and cheap as it is today. There HAS to be expensive, inefficient electric vehicles before they're standard. And if we shrugged off electric vehicles this way, with no market demand (therefore no research), the break through will never come.

But it will.

And other fun fact; Internal combustion engines are 40% efficient, at best.
Same can be said about anti-gravity thrusters...

Piston engines started with steam, design was proven in the industrial sector, and it was just a matter of time for the technology to shrink down and become feasible for automobiles...
Batteries are in reverse. They are proven in small applications but they don't scale well. Hoping they someday will lose weight and gain capacity doesn't mean they will.

And another fun fact... unless you simply happen to have the right geography for a hydroelectric power plant, burning your choice of fuel to produce electricity, convert it, transport it, convert it again, store it, convert it again, and use it to turn the electric motor results in under 40% efficiency...
 
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RockyMtnHigh

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Same can be said about anti-gravity thrusters...


And another fun fact... unless you simply happen to have the right geography for a hydroelectric power plant, burning your choice of fuel to produce electricity, convert it, transport it, convert it again, store it, convert it again, and use it to turn the electric motor results in under 40% efficiency...
The cars we're talking about don't break the laws of physics, we just need higher energy density. Which will be achieved. The first batteries, which were quite large, produced 2 volts. If established that as the ceiling for energy density way back when, we'd have never achieved anything for batteries.

Do you live on an oil reserve? Energy is stored and transported all the time. Hydroelectric isn't the only option. There's so many options for electricity, but only one for gas.
 

DocTwinkie

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Doc... Duh.
Well put. The issue is, that next "battery breakthrough" is not likely to happen, ever. Same could be said for anti-gravity thrusters. They would be a great solution to all kinds of problems but you can hardly bet the farm on ever seeing them.
Thanks for the well put. I do think it will happen. At some point we will look back on lithium ion and can’t believe we ever had batteries that crappy. They are certainly working on it and pumping lots of R&D into it. Two hydrogen atoms combining into one helium holds tremendous energy. There are ways to get lots of energy from minimal weight.

It’ll happen. Just not today.
 
OP
OP

Jeep-Noob

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You guys are a riot. This isn't the future, it's the present. My car drives my ass to work every day while I ponder podcast preferences. It's warmed up for me when I get into it in the winter, and pre-cooled for me in the summer. It's full of fuel every morning, and I don't have to play chicken with the meth heads and six pack joes at the gas station twice a week. (You don't realize what horrible places gas stations really are until you go to one for the first time in 6 months...sheesh!) I win EVERY stop light race.

Today.

The base Model 3s are sub $40k. Ignore those kids on your lawn and go take a test drive! Complaining about EVs not being feasible is a great hobby...for the 90s. The Model S came out in 2012! ;) Your perspective is 7 years out of date.
 


Toycrusher

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You guys are a riot. This isn't the future, it's the present. My car drives my ass to work every day while I ponder podcast preferences. It's warmed up for me when I get into it in the winter, and pre-cooled for me in the summer. It's full of fuel every morning, and I don't have to play chicken with the meth heads and six pack joes at the gas station twice a week. (You don't realize what horrible places gas stations really are until you go to one for the first time in 6 months...sheesh!) I win EVERY stop light race.

Today.

The base Model 3s are sub $40k. Ignore those kids on your lawn and go take a test drive! Complaining about EVs not being feasible is a great hobby...for the 90s. The Model S came out in 2012! ;) Your perspective is 7 years out of date.
Except your car only has to deal with a 1000 lb ish payload. It's perfectly capable of being a people hauler, and long trips can be carefully planned and executed. It's a completely different story when you ask it to do "truckish" things
 

DocTwinkie

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Doc... Duh.
You guys are a riot. This isn't the future, it's the present. My car drives my ass to work every day while I ponder podcast preferences. It's warmed up for me when I get into it in the winter, and pre-cooled for me in the summer. It's full of fuel every morning, and I don't have to play chicken with the meth heads and six pack joes at the gas station twice a week. (You don't realize what horrible places gas stations really are until you go to one for the first time in 6 months...sheesh!) I win EVERY stop light race.

Today.

The base Model 3s are sub $40k. Ignore those kids on your lawn and go take a test drive! Complaining about EVs not being feasible is a great hobby...for the 90s. The Model S came out in 2012! ;) Your perspective is 7 years out of date.
I’ll say to start that I’m ignoring this user since this is an absolute troll remark. Feel free to reply. I won’t see it.

I’m happy you’ve adopted an EV. The fact that you posted this in a Jeep forum... these are people interested in Jeeps and what a Jeep can do. The model 3 is a competent compact sedan. It has the functionality and practicality of a carolla.

If you’re in the market for a Carolla that can do 0-60 in an insane number then go for it. If you want to off road, camp, carry a lot of stuff, tow, etc then you wouldn’t buy a model 3 any more than you would a carolla.

And speaking of which you can get a Carolla that has all the functionality of that model 3 minus the speed for less than half the price.

If you want to:
Off-road
Haul
Tow
Drive long distances (without waiting at chargers)
Carry large items.
Carry more than 4 people
Have a dealer nearby


Any of these things... then no. EVs are not here. Some of these things you could do for 70k plus in a high end model X I suppose.

But all can be done for around 30k or less with an ICE.

You chose to buy a compact sedan to get you from point a to point b paying a huge premium over a similarly equipped ICE sedan. I’m glad you did. It will help foster research and decrease prices. But talking to people the way you just did in this forum does zero to further a green agenda. It just makes people mad at you which is probably what you were going for.
 

sanman357

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I hate cars especially modern aero design. If I can get a Jeep looking vehicle that does 500miles per charge or better. I would maybe consider an E.V.. I am the king of day trips. Ny to Boston pick up my kid from college drive to Portsmouth NH for lunch or dinner drop her off and back to NY in one day. I work weird hours and can't always stay overnight. If I want to have a life I don't want it interrupted sitting at a charging station. I like E.V.s for what they can be and do. Ludicrous mode in a Model S is pretty impressive. But not designed for me. Currently I drive 800+ miles each way to get my other daughter to and from school in GA, 13hours straight through. Not going to happen with an E.V..
Maybe if the government funds inductive charging into the roadways on the interstates than their would be no downside to a fully electric vehicle. You would have a provider linked to your vehicle to charge you appropriately. No stopping except for bathroom and fuel for yourself. Until then I'm out.
 

four low

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You guys are a riot. This isn't the future, it's the present. My car drives my ass to work every day while I ponder podcast preferences. It's warmed up for me when I get into it in the winter, and pre-cooled for me in the summer. It's full of fuel every morning, and I don't have to play chicken with the meth heads and six pack joes at the gas station twice a week. (You don't realize what horrible places gas stations really are until you go to one for the first time in 6 months...sheesh!) I win EVERY stop light race.

Today.

The base Model 3s are sub $40k. Ignore those kids on your lawn and go take a test drive! Complaining about EVs not being feasible is a great hobby...for the 90s. The Model S came out in 2012! ;) Your perspective is 7 years out of date.
Could you elaborate on the "Base Model 3s sub $40k" pricing ? Thanks
 

sanman357

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The base Model 3s are sub $40k. Ignore those kids on your lawn and go take a test drive! Complaining about EVs not being feasible is a great hobby...for the 90s. The Model S came out in 2012! ;) Your perspective is 7 years out of date.
Who would want a base model? We're Jeepers we modify everything. So if I would have to buy this microwave to actually enjoy it it would still ba a 50k vehicle. Base model?? Lol
 


OP
OP

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If you can’t understand the benefit of a 16kWh power source for car camping, I probably can’t help you.

But what are you guys doing on the PHEV wrangler forum? Isn’t Wheel of Fortune on right now?
 

ThirtyOne

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I’ll say to start that I’m ignoring this user since this is an absolute troll remark. Feel free to reply. I won’t see it.

I’m happy you’ve adopted an EV. The fact that you posted this in a Jeep forum... these are people interested in Jeeps and what a Jeep can do. The model 3 is a competent compact sedan. It has the functionality and practicality of a carolla.

If you’re in the market for a Carolla that can do 0-60 in an insane number then go for it. If you want to off road, camp, carry a lot of stuff, tow, etc then you wouldn’t buy a model 3 any more than you would a carolla.

And speaking of which you can get a Carolla that has all the functionality of that model 3 minus the speed for less than half the price.

If you want to:
Off-road
Haul
Tow
Drive long distances (without waiting at chargers)
Carry large items.
Carry more than 4 people
Have a dealer nearby


Any of these things... then no. EVs are not here. Some of these things you could do for 70k plus in a high end model X I suppose.

But all can be done for around 30k or less with an ICE.

You chose to buy a compact sedan to get you from point a to point b paying a huge premium over a similarly equipped ICE sedan. I’m glad you did. It will help foster research and decrease prices. But talking to people the way you just did in this forum does zero to further a green agenda. It just makes people mad at you which is probably what you were going for.
Which is why Jeep is coming out with a PHEV. Better gas mileage, full tank every morning, and no gas for daily driver use. Plus an ICE to do Jeep things. The trade-off is cost and complexity.

How come every time there is a conversation about PHEV, it turns into weighing the merits of an EV? They are two completely different things.
 

BearJewJonny

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Yea it’s pretty hilarious. Like the rest of life’s interactions most of these mutants just come in here, have no knowledge of what they are talking about, drop useless comments that hold no weight, and clog it up for the rest of us.

I don’t know about them but I have better things to do with my time. If I wasn’t interested in a PHEV I wouldn’t even open this thread but they feel the need to troll.

I mean trying to compare a Tesla to a Toyota, I mean come on haha.
 

DocTwinkie

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Doc... Duh.
Which is why Jeep is coming out with a PHEV. Better gas mileage, full tank every morning, and no gas for daily driver use. Plus an ICE to do Jeep things. The trade-off is cost and complexity.

How come every time there is a conversation about PHEV, it turns into weighing the merits of an EV? They are two completely different things.
it’s all a spectrum I guess. From one standpoint a hybrid has all the problems and complexity of an ICE and then some with the added expense of a battery.

An EV while it is the future evolution given the insane simplicity of an EV architecture is simply too damn expensive given current battery tech.

I get why they are part of the conversation but I also get why someone touting them when they are clearly overpriced is really counterproductive. Not everyone can drop 50k on a compact econobox. If you do that is for supporting the tech, but don’t be rude to others who that doesn’t work for.
 

Toycrusher

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Personally I would love a PHEV Wrangler. I want to keep my manual transmission, and I want to be able to choose when to use electric. I can drive 600 miles to the trail without camping to charge up. I can run gas through the majority of the trail and switch to electric only for the technical climbs. Only need 15-30 mile electric range to hopefully keep the extra cost under $10k

 

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