Newbie Considering EcoDiesel order any advise?

[Bartholomew]

if they switch away from diesel it won't be because "diesels are meant to be driven longer distances." It would be because their bottom line shows it will save them money. Of course it will be a contrived situation where they'll be incentivized to 'make the right choice'.

As to the examples, they are numerous. But any of them can be argued against. Most people probably think an all electric bus fleet would be a boon to every city in the world.

As an aside, the push against diesels has nothing to do with the environment. It is mainly about control. The world controllers want everyone to live in mega cities. Where movement can be more tightly monitored and metered. Dare I say disallowed?

And as a future proof that it is a politician agenda, I guarantee for 50+ years after they achieve their goals of locking everyone down, they would still ship goods across the oceans using the same giant diesel engines they do now. It's a sick joke.

Yes, switching from diesel engines will save delivery companies money due to reduced maintenance costs from using a long hauler engine for stop and go services.

You kind of took a left turn there with it being world controllers trying to force everyone into mega cities...

And it is probably a safe bet that ocean liners will use diesel engines in 50 years, but it won't be a political agenda. It will be because diesel engines are efficient over long distances without stop and go... like the ocean.

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[AZ-Chris]

Europeans have been driving small diesels for 40 or more years in their daily drivers. They do so for fuel economy as well as fuel price because their governments tax the hell out of gasoline. Also, no European country has a highway as extensive as the US, meaning most of their driving is short hop oriented. Diesel engines are more than capable of running as clean and efficient as a gasoline engine . . . it just comes down to arbitrary government intervention that serves to direct which products consumers buy.

As far regulations being here to stay . . . they last as long as people tolerate the stupid rules their governments impose upon them. Care to discuss stupid governments and leaders?

 

[WXman]

There must be something wrong with my diesels. I drive city streets daily. Drive-thrus, red lights, stop signs. Have had 2 of these new Gen 3 EcoDiesels and never a single issue. They run strong and get 5-6 MPG above gas engines in these same Jeeps. Regen happens rarely. The diesel seems like the perfect city vehicle.

 

[AZ-Chris]

. . .
OP said that they are not going off-roading and rarely on highways. That is where Jeep's ecodiesel shines (and how it is marketed).
. . .

At its conception, the Gen 3 EcoDiesel was designed by VM Motori in Italy intended for the Cadillac CTS as GM needed a diesel engine to compete in the European market. There's no way anyone can claim that the EcoDiesel is not meant for city driving, or is somehow optimized for towing, long-haul highway cruising or off-roading. This engine has always been intended for multi-purpose use from passenger cars to light/medium duty trucks in the US AND European markets.

 

[Bartholomew]

At its conception, the Gen 3 EcoDiesel was designed by VM Motori in Italy intended for the Cadillac CTS as GM needed a diesel engine to compete in the European market. There's no way anyone can claim that the EcoDiesel is not meant for city driving, or is somehow optimized for towing, long-haul highway cruising or off-roading. This engine has always been intended for multi-purpose use from passenger cars to light/medium duty trucks in the US AND European markets.

An engine being designed to compete in a market does not mean it is the optimal option for a task, just that there is a want for it. The engine can absolutely drive in a city, but if you don't need to sacrifice HP for torque where is the benefit?

OP said that they don't have multiple driving needs, just around town. How does having more torque and less HP benefit them?

All 5 Jeep engine options deliver good torque and HP for what the vehicle is. All engine options can power through a city, up a mountain, over a rock, through the sand. But each configuration better suites different primary functions

 

[AZ-Chris]

It seems as though YOU somehow believe that the Pentastar is better suited for city driving than the EcoDiesel, and yet offer zero evidence to that claim. The EcoDiesel is used in a variety of applications in the European market as well as North America from passenger cars like Maserati to the Ram 1500.

Torque is the greater contributor to acceleration while hp has more to do with top end speed. I'd argue that torque is a more useful feature for city driving to pull away from traffic lights while hp in city driving is not nearly as important. Further, the OP to this thread did specify the occasional highway trip AND the desirability of additional torque. The EPA estimates for city fuel efficiency still favor the EcoDiesel.

 

[Bartholomew]

It seems as though YOU somehow believe that the Pentastar is better suited for city driving than the EcoDiesel, and yet offer zero evidence to that claim. The EcoDiesel is used in a variety of applications in the European market as well as North America from passenger cars like Maserati to the Ram 1500.

Torque is the greater contributor to acceleration while hp has more to do with top end speed. I'd argue that torque is a more useful feature for city driving to pull away from traffic lights while hp in city driving is not nearly as important. Further, the OP to this thread did specify the occasional highway trip AND the desirability of additional torque. The EPA estimates for city fuel efficiency still favor the EcoDiesel.

Honestly, the 4XE is a better option if torque and MPG are the driving factor. You just have to deal with the potential for more things to go wrong.

As for faster acceleration, a diesel will come off the line faster but will be overtaken by the gas hitting 5,252 RPMs quicker. The Wrangler having no aerodynamics hinders the output given from the torque.

Diesel or gas engine, both are getting beat by the 4XE.

 

[AZ-Chris]

Honestly, the 4XE is a better option if torque and MPG are the driving factor. You just have to deal with the potential for more things to go wrong.

As for faster acceleration, a diesel will come off the line faster but will be overtaken by the gas hitting 5,252 RPMs quicker. The Wrangler having no aerodynamics hinders the output given from the torque.

Diesel or gas engine, both are getting beat by the 4XE.

Oh boy, here comes this tired argument . . .

Once you're over 1,500 ft in elevation, the hp advantage of the naturally aspirated Pentastar IS GONE! The EcoDiesel simply outperforms the Pentastar in EVERY measurable category once you get off the coastal areas. As an aside, NO ONE buys a Wrangler with the intention of drag racing, but as you said, the EcoDiesel pulls off the line faster . . . which is what you do a stop sign/traffic light. The EcoDiesel is rated 2 mpgs better than the Pentastar in city driving.

Now if you insist on watching a drag race between these two engines, here you go . . . performed by the folks at TFL in the Denver area.

 

[AZ-Chris]

The 4XE is just as heavy as the EcoDiesel and is all but useless on the trail. IMHO, the 4XE has a very limited use case . . . once that heavy battery is depleted, you're worse off than the standard 4 cylinder turbo engine since you're carrying all the battery weight.

 

[Bartholomew]

The 4XE is just as heavy as the EcoDiesel and is all but useless on the trail. IMHO, the 4XE has a very limited use case . . . once that heavy battery is depleted, you're worse off than the standard 4 cylinder turbo engine since you're carrying all the battery weight.

Considering that the OP lives in Florida where the highest elevation is something like 300 feet the Pentastar will not lose any power. With no plans to take it off road and just using it around town, they would fall into the target market for the 4XE. With charging stations all over that area, they could save on the added electricity cost. Not to mention the $7,500 in tax credit.

 

[AZ-Chris]

As I said, there is a limited use case for the 4xe and perhaps the OP falls into that, but he expressly stated that he wasn't crazy about the 4xe. What the OP did expressly state was that he looked upon the EcoDiesel favorably due to its fuel efficiency AND the higher torque. He was inquiring whether there were any shortcomings associated with the EcoDiesel, to which there are a few, but none that would apply to how he described his use case.

You, on the other hand, interjected with a statement (without any supporting facts) that the EcoDiesel was strictly a highway mile eater that doesn't like stop and go traffic. What I , and other EcoDiesel owners have been politely trying to say is HOGWASH!

 

[gerlbaum]

Horsepower is how quickly the engine can get the work done.

If you are doing more city driving then you are going to be accelerating a lot more. The higher HP benefits the engine more than torque in that it gets the job done quicker.

You have that exactly backwards. You want torque to get rolling. That’s why diesels excel at getting a heavy load going off the line or a Tesla gets off the line so fast. That’s stop light to stop light driving.

Horsepower is how fast or how much work you can get done. You want hp for high speed driving, such as at highway speeds.

This why you later on contradict yourself in saying the EV Jeep is the better option.

Regardless, you’re digging WAY WAY WAY too much into this subject and over analyzing someone else's decision. They’re all going to work absolutely fine.

 

[displayname]

I'm shocked at how heated this thread has become, especially with the forced political discussion. Overall, I think the diesel is the most interesting engine choice available right now, and it's absolutely worth considering.

The only thing I've seen come up in this thread or others that would give me pause is that it does seem like getting parts can take longer. I'd imagine over the next year that will become less of an issue as supply chains stabilize. But I wouldn't assume you're going to have a delay, or assume you're going to have a problem. I think each power train option has it's tradeoffs, and there have been some great discussions of those tradeoffs for the OP to consider.

 

[gerlbaum]

Taking longer to get parts is because of Covid. It has nothing to do with it being a diesel. There are folks on all the engine forums complaining about wait times and engine issues - including the 4xe.

 

[AZ-Chris]

The Casey 250 YouTube channel just posted a video entitled: "5 DIRTY SECRETS BEHIND the ECODIESEL JEEP WRANGLER & GLADIATOR"



Anyone considering an EcoDiesel Jeep should watch this video as it is very informative . . . though be prepared to convert Canadian/Metric measurements into US/Imperial measurements. Having participated on this forum since acquiring my Wrangler last year, I can say that Casey 250 is not alone in his experiences with the EcoDiesel, as many people that post here and on the Gladiator forums can attest.

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