RESOLUTION!!!! Dealership messed up oil change worried about serious damage

[Bomfy]

Hi all,

Sorry for posting this in General JL and not 3.6 issues, I am looking for advice/guidance on this. Also sorry for being very wordy, I am trying to relay all the facts and am quite concerned about our 9,600 mile dream vehicle of my wife.

To preface this story at no point did any dash light or any notifications came up in the dash. Nothing out of the ordinary on the dash.

Today we went in for Jeep Wave Service. Things seemingly went well at the start. We left the dealership and went to Costco. After Costco we headed home. A few miles into the drive we smelled burning oil and we saw slight smoke on coming from the rear (at this point we are 5 or 6 miles total from the dealership). We slowed down (from 65 to about 35, I'm glad there was a semi putting along to follow in the right lane) and the smoke came from the front as well (I called the dealership and they said come back), and pulled off as soon as we could. When we exited the highway and found a parking lot to turn around in turned in there was a couple metallic clunks and screeches. This is when I got very concerned and we stopped and shut down.

I got under the Wrangler and there was a small puddle of oil (that was growing) and the entire undercarriage, especially the transmission, was covered in oil. There is even some drops/haze on the rear. I checked the dipstick, completely dry, and then I checked 5 more times. Still dry. I called the service department at the dealership. They wanted me to drive back and I told them I was pretty confident that there was no more oil in the engine and that wasn't happening. To their credit after a brief hold the advisor I dealt with earlier only asked two questions, where are you, and what's your cell. A tech with quite a lot of gear was dispatched in JL to see what was going on.

Tech arrives and looks at our Wrangler for a .5 seconds from 10 feet away before he says he knows what is wrong. walks to the engine and literally takes the oil filter cover off the top of the engine in about half a turn. He sighs and says some choice profanities. He flipped the oil filter over and puts it into the cap then clicks it in and wrenches it down. I asked him what caused that, and he leads with, I didn't say this, they screwed up the oil change. He asked if the dipstick was dry, I said yes. He says, that only tells you it's 3 quarts low so nothing in damaged and he was sure there was at least 2 quarts in there. He then put in 3 quarts, checking the dipstick after each one, and then a 4th. This part concerns me and is burned into my mind since he started talking a lot more and after a moment he went for quart 4. Almost like he wanted me not to notice that, it just seemed a bit weird. He checked the dipstick again. I never say it since I was on the driver's side.

He says we are almost ready to start it and I should move my stuff I needed over to our rental JL. I do not know if a 5th quart went in or not.

Before he starts our JL I ask him what are the odds it's damaged, because the clunks and screeches were very concerning. He says there is a zero percent chance of damage and modern engines can go at least hundred miles without oil and be okay. He then reaffirmed several times that he was going to drive ours back to the dealership and check it out in the morning to confirm there was no damage, but there is no chance there is.

I understand things like this can occur, but I have this creeping feeling that I'm going to get a call an hour or so after service opens tomorrow and they are going to say everything is pristine and perfect because they checked it out and redid the oil change correctly and we are good to go. I like the dealership and haven't had issues with them before, but I am concerned they may say things are great even if they aren't.

So, almighty JL Forums, please tell me I am overly concerned or what you all recommend I should do/say/see to make sure there isn't something that could come back to haunt us later?

Thank you very much for your time!

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[aldo98229]

Ouch!

Sorry man.

All you can do for now is take a shot of scotch and wait for that morning call.

There is no point in jumping to conclusions until you know more. That call will be the big fork on the road.

Good luck!

 

[word302]

Uh. I'd be very worried that he thinks a motor can go 100 miles without any oil in it. I beg to differ. You had less than 1 qt of oil in your motor and you heard bad sounds. I would demand a new motor or a free lifetime power train warranty. This is why I won't let anyone touch my rig, not even to change the oil or rotate the tires.

 

[Fonzilla85]

I’d recommend you wait for the call, no sense in pumping hypothetical scenarios into your head. I will say that after pick up if you notice anything of concern, take it back to the dealership immediately. Also be sure to get everything documented as this will be important if at a later time you need to refer back to this issue. Best of luck.

 

[sf5211]

I’d be concerned but don’t forget your power train is warranted for quite a while. If there’s any engine damage it should show within 5 years or 50,000 miles.

 

[JIMBOX]

Well, if you get the call in the morning, saying that EVERYTHINGS AOK !

Demand a DEALER SERVICE INVOICE COPY, with details about your call and their actions from that initial point, with a service managers signature after the CONDITION SATISFACTORY REPORT !!

You want this problem on record/w mileage and actions !

Be aware of your mileage/time WARRANTY and don't go past that point if you have even small engine problems !

Good luck

JIMBO

 

[Bomfy]

Thank you all. I appreciate it.

I'm doing my best to not jump to conclusions. I'm staying cautiously optimistic. I just found the start with quite a bit of profanities about it from the tech, to the certain statement that there was at least two quarts of oil that was not quite right, and ending with the absolute statement that there is a "zero percent chance" of there being a problem to make me go from very concerned to incredibly concerned.

I felt like it went from oh &$^#, to downplaying it, and ultimately ending with it's really nothing and never was. That feeling is what has been nagging me. I would have been much happier with him saying I think it will be okay, and not saying it as a certainty. Does that make sense?

I think I'm looking for guidance to what I need to ask how they diagnosed it being all fine and dandy. I feel like it's okay to ask, how did you get to that conclusion? Then when they say ________ I want to be a bit more knowledgeable than I am at this point. Funny thing is I've built engines, but never actually deal with anything like this before.

Jimbo - Thank you for the reply. Is a Dealer Service Invoice something different than the usual print out that goes over why the vehicle came in and what was done? Second the Service Manager as in the guy that is the be all and end all in service or the Advisor?

Thank you again, all.

 

[blnewt]

Well there are a couple things in your favor, the fact that that oil puddle was growing when you pulled over, that would tell me that the motor wasn't bone dry, and hopefully not much drained out from the dealer to Costco, and Costco to your parked location. And the fact that the dealer sent a tech pretty much immediately after the JL was serviced, so they are in the equation rather than just hearsay where they can deny that they did nothing wrong.

So the tech showed you that the filter cover wasn't properly secured, or the filter was in upside down and the cap just snugged down on top of an upside down filter??

Like others mentioned, be sure to have everything notated, and be sure the dealer is shown as being at fault for this service mistake. I'd also get @JeepCares in on the loop just to have another rung on the ladder covered.

And yeah, 100 miles w/ no oil??? Ask that guy what he'd do if his vehicle had no oil for 100 miles!

Oh, but they probably filled it with 6 quarts so you probably had an extra quart to lose as well

 

[sf5211]

Thank you all. I appreciate it.

I'm doing my best to not jump to conclusions. I'm staying cautiously optimistic. I just found the start with quite a bit of profanities about it from the tech, to the certain statement that there was at least two quarts of oil that was not quite right, and ending with the absolute statement that there is a "zero percent chance" of there being a problem to make me go from very concerned to incredibly concerned.

I felt like it went from oh &$^#, to downplaying it, and ultimately ending with it's really nothing and never was. That feeling is what has been nagging me. I would have been much happier with him saying I think it will be okay, and not saying it as a certainty. Does that make sense?

I think I'm looking for guidance to what I need to ask how they diagnosed it being all fine and dandy. I feel like it's okay to ask, how did you get to that conclusion? Then when they say ________ I want to be a bit more knowledgeable than I am at this point. Funny thing is I've built engines, but never actually deal with anything like this before.

Jimbo - Thank you for the reply. Is a Dealer Service Invoice something different than the usual print out that goes over why the vehicle came in and what was done? Second the Service Manager as in the guy that is the be all and end all in service or the Advisor?

Thank you again, all.

Bom, I think no matter what way you slice it or dice it the dealership is gonna B.S. you and tell you what you want to hear. You sound mechanically inclined. Just take back the vehicle and keep your ears tuned in for a while. If there was metal binding from a lack of lubricant they aren’t hiding it! It will show itself. Plus you’re right Jimbo’s post was spot on but I don’t know the answer to the “dealer service invoice “ question.

 

[Pig-Pen]

100 miles with no oil?? Lolol

i would not be satisfied with an everything ls fine after hearing metal on metal sounds. Slight marring could shorten the overall lifespan of the motor.

similar issue happened to my buddys daughters scion thanks to pep boys. Him being 30 year engineer he wasnt buying their reassurances. He demanded they have the dealership mechanic inspect it with a boroscope. Dealer said they could not guarantee there was no long term damage done. They wanted like $5k to replace the motor iirc. Pep Boys ended up cutting a check for about $3500 or so.

id say give me a lifetime warranty or a few years beyond what you have now at least. If theyre so sure nothing happened then they have nothing to worry about. The warranty doesnt cost them anything.

 

[JIMBOX]

Thank you all. I appreciate it.

I'm doing my best to not jump to conclusions. I'm staying cautiously optimistic. I just found the start with quite a bit of profanities about it from the tech, to the certain statement that there was at least two quarts of oil that was not quite right, and ending with the absolute statement that there is a "zero percent chance" of there being a problem to make me go from very concerned to incredibly concerned.

I felt like it went from oh &$^#, to downplaying it, and ultimately ending with it's really nothing and never was. That feeling is what has been nagging me. I would have been much happier with him saying I think it will be okay, and not saying it as a certainty. Does that make sense?

I think I'm looking for guidance to what I need to ask how they diagnosed it being all fine and dandy. I feel like it's okay to ask, how did you get to that conclusion? Then when they say ________ I want to be a bit more knowledgeable than I am at this point. Funny thing is I've built engines, but never actually deal with anything like this before.

Jimbo - Thank you for the reply. Is a Dealer Service Invoice something different than the usual print out that goes over why the vehicle came in and what was done? Second the Service Manager as in the guy that is the be all and end all in service or the Advisor?

Thank you again, all.

The service invoice has the DEALER NAME/TYPE/ADDRESS USUALLY UPPER LEFT CORNER and your vehicle VIN/date in/out/mileage and ADVISOR NAME/TAG #--

Then a description of ALL SERVICE/W costs/warranty mention/w a signature space at the bottom--there should be a space for YOUR SIG AT THE LAST PAGE and that will mean/show your acceptance of the service !

If they don't provide you a SERVICE COPY of this incident--then everything is WORD OF MOUTH and you don't have a chance if they refuse to admit to any more problems-

If that happens--notify JEEP CARES(beginning of this forum) immediately for the start/record --

Good luck

JIMBO

 

[aldo98229]

OP: you are entitled to ask as many questions and for as much evidence as you feel necessary to put your mind at ease, and the dealer owes you that much...and then some.

 

[Bomfy]

Well there are a couple things in your favor, the fact that that oil puddle was growing when you pulled over, that would tell me that the motor wasn't bone dry, and hopefully not much drained out from the dealer to Costco, and Costco to your parked location. And the fact that the dealer sent a tech pretty much immediately after the JL was serviced, so they are in the equation rather than just hearsay where they can deny that they did nothing wrong.

So the tech showed you that the filter cover wasn't properly secured, or the filter was in upside down and the cap just snugged down on top of an upside down filter??

Like others mentioned, be sure to have everything notated, and be sure the dealer is shown as being at fault for this service mistake. I'd also get @JeepCares in on the loop just to have another rung on the ladder covered.

And yeah, 100 miles w/ no oil??? Ask that guy what he'd do if his vehicle had no oil for 100 miles!

Oh, but they probably filled it with 6 quarts so you probably had an extra quart to lose as well

Thank you for the reply, and for tagging JeepCares.

The tech said the cap was not tightened enough (maybe 1/2 turn to remove it and there are a lot of threads on it) and that the filter was upside down. I watched him remove the cover very easily, flip the filter over, replace it, and tighten things back up.

Interesting that you ask about what he would do with a car that had no oil in it for 100 miles. He said a tech at the dealership bought an high mileage wholesale car that came in with no oil sat in the storage lot for 6+ months and the guy drove it nearly 30 miles home put in oil in it and then drove it another 200K miles. I honestly thought that was royal BS and far too convenient to bring up, so I pretty much discounted that "story."

 

[Bomfy]

Bom, I think no matter what way you slice it or dice it the dealership is gonna B.S. you and tell you what you want to hear. You sound mechanically inclined. Just take back the vehicle and keep your ears tuned in for a while. If there was metal binding from a lack of lubricant they aren’t hiding it! It will show itself. Plus you’re right Jimbo’s post was spot on but I don’t know the answer to the “dealer service invoice “ question.

Thank you. I'm thinking there will probably be some BS. I'm still thinking it already started.

 

[Bomfy]

100 miles with no oil?? Lolol

i would not be satisfied with an everything ls fine after hearing metal on metal sounds. Slight marring could shorten the overall lifespan of the motor.

similar issue happened to my buddys daughters scion thanks to pep boys. Him being 30 year engineer he wasnt buying their reassurances. He demanded they have the dealership mechanic inspect it with a boroscope. Dealer said they could not guarantee there was no long term damage done. They wanted like $5k to replace the motor iirc. Pep Boys ended up cutting a check for about $3500 or so.

id say give me a lifetime warranty or a few years beyond what you have now at least. If theyre so sure nothing happened then they have nothing to worry about. The warranty doesnt cost them anything.

Thank you! I was thinking thinking boroscope. I just wasn't sure, if that would be the right thing to say.

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