New (upcoming) EURO JLUR owner - questions, doubts...

[taram]

As i have already posted in "JL in Europe" thread - I've ordered JLUR in Cyprus in early July - ETA by Christmas. And here are some issues bothering me at the moment and i'd greatly appreciate any comments on them - maybe you will give me a better idea or correct my mistake in something. The reason why i post it here is because one must really know the EURO-specification of JLURs to reply…

BTW, what do you think about 3.0 V6 diesel engine - is there any possibility it will be available in Europe as well? I'd feel a bit pissed-off having ordered 2.2 instead of waiting several more month and having 3.0... My thoughts are that considering the price for the 2.2 diesel in Cyprus i don't think somebody will pay another several thousands euros for 3.0 - probably this will be just a single diesel option for North American market... my dealership says the same, but you never know what they really now...

I don't want to modify the car too much - it's very capable in stock already, i've test driven 2.0T Petrol JLUR in JEEP-territory park in Moscow - it's amazing, and i hope 2.2 diesel will be even better... BUT, as everybody here, i have a small wish-list, mostly for more aggressive look rather than performance. I'd prefer to go mostly with Mopar, even it's pricey, but i want to keep the warranty, and maybe i'll be lucky to push dealership for some discount for a total order. Also i've never had any experience with ordering anything from the US to Cyprus... So:
1. Tires LT315/70R17 BFG KO2 AT - definitely love the look of this size, especially on stock wheels - and i like that a lot of people enjoy this setup on full-stock suspension - don't want to go with any lift (at least at the moment) to keep the center of mass as low as stock. No rock-crawling planned yet
1.2. Maybe will have to use some spacers if some rubbing appears. What is the factory rake of the vehicle - i see people adding exactly 0.5"/1" on front/rear axles - to level the Jeep horizontally?
2. High-line MOPAR fender flares (black with LED) - following from clause 1 - as i understand this is the only thing that keeps me from installing that size of tires...
3. Tazer JL-mini - i think it's good to have this little guy to adjust tire size for the speedometer, TPMS warning level, disabling ESS system, etc...
4. MOPAR steel 3-piece front/rear bumpers - still have to figure out if they are legal in Cyprus... Definitely don't like the look of the stock plastic bumpers, but i saw people modifying them and even installing the winch with a little cutting of the plastic bumper... But steel sounds better anyway.
5. Front steel skid plate - as i understand this is a must have with steel bumper - MOPAR as well
6. Winch - i'm an absolute novice in off-road, but as i was told it's better to have than not to have, especially it's almost hidden inside the bumper, so i like the idea. There're so many of them, WARN are the most expensive (and the best?..) - what could you advise?
7. Side steps - still don't understand if i want/need them. The vehicle is quite high and they definitely make entering/exit easier, on the other hand they can become a problem during off-roading, and there're stock rock rails installed... MOPAR has 2 different models - one is plastic, i guess, and the other aluminum?... https://www.quadratec.com/p/mopar/side-steps-jeep-wrangler-unlimited-4-door-jl and https://www.quadratec.com/p/mopar/tubular-side-steps-jeep-wrangler-unlimited-jl - i like the aluminum more, honestly. But maybe will wait with them...
8. MOPAR DOOR SILL GUARDS - i think makes sense
9. MOPAR ALL-WEATHER FLOOR MATS.
That's it at the moment, probably some extra lights in the future, but not now. Hopefully i will post some of my build photos later here when the Jeep arrives…

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[lohr500]

I have the 2.2 diesel in the UK. Whilst it isn't as lively as the 2 litre petrol, I am pleased with it. I don't drive it like a sports car so the acceleration is fine for me. After a 2.2 litre diesel Defender it is positively quick Not sure if the 3 litre diesel will arrive in the UK, but it doesn't bother me.

I agree the stock bumpers (front in particular) are horrible.
I have a problem with my front park assist system which I am waiting for Jeep to fix.
Until this is done, I don't want to change the front bumper as I don't want any suggestion of the parking system warranty being invalid because I messed with the bumper. Once the system has been fixed, i'll start looking round for a better bumper. I haven't checked with my insurance company either yet.

As far as winches are concerned, whichever one you go for, as an absolute novice do make sure you get some good training on the correct use as they can be lethal if used incorrectly. Consider using a plasma type rope rather than steel cable as well. These are a bit safer if they snap, but still need to be used with care.
I would go for a quality brand, rather than a cheap Chinese copy as parts will be easier to obtain should anything go wrong in the future. That being said many on the Defender2 forum I follow don't like the quality of the newer Warn winches, especially the exterior finish which can flake badly when not very old. Also make sure you use the recommended thickness of wiring when installing to prevent power loss.

A winch kit is also a good investment and most of these come with a doubling up pulley block that will give you greater pulling power at the expense of shorter travel. Remember as well that a winch on the front is no use if you get stuck driving into something with no way out forwards or nowhere to anchor the winch to. Winches are best used when in convoy so there is always one winch equipped vehicle on good ground able to pull a stuck vehicle out in the opposite direction to the way it was travelling when it got stuck

I'm also happy with the stock tyres. Plenty of ground clearance as standard and reasonable on road manners. Anything that raises the body height will just cause more roll unless the sway bars are beefed up. Unless you plan to do some serious rock crawling, I would leave as standard.

I got a set of the all weather mats with mine and they are great when you are jumping in and out wearing muddy boots. Also great when you open the door in the rain and a stream of water runs from the roof gutter inside the car due to the bad design of the gutter/door seal!!

I wouldn't bother with side steps if you are planning to do any serious off roading because they will get hit. Unless you can source a set of very strong aftermarket ones that combine the rock sliders with a step.

Tazer seems like a nice tool but not essential unless you do start changing the tyre sizes.

I'm sure you will enjoy the Jeep when it arrives. Post some pictures.

 

[Rudolph Hart]

At the European launch of the Gladiator they listed the engine options as the 3.6 V6 petrol and the 3.0 diesel (it’s a straight 6 not a V6) these are due in Europe ‘in the autumn’ so maybe we will get the 3.0 diesel in the Wrangler. However there doesn’t seem to be any date for it’s launch on the US so read into that whatever you like!

You can go with the 315/35 inch tyres without a lift but you will definitely need the high top fender flares and you may still experience some rubbing off road. My personal view is that I wouldn’t want to use spacers so you might want to consider different wheels. In the U.K. having the tyres extend outside the fender flares is a ‘no’ ...maybe your laws are different? I’m looking at 285/75r17 tyres as a compromise.

Tazer is up to you, your dealership can make the adjustments/do the reflash you need for the increased tyre size. They might start being difficult about your warranty if you use a Tazer though. I think this probably depends on the individual dealership and your relationship with them.

In the U.K. the legality of steel bumpers is a grey area, they don’t have appropriate safety ratings, again your laws may be different. I’m putting some on A. because they are not part of our MOT test (the annual safety/road worthiness test) and B. because my insurance company have no problems with covering the Jeep with these or a winch.

Side steps don’t appeal to me on a subjective basis.

Tony, above, has given good advice about winches.

Enjoy.

Edit to add..

If you do go with the 315’s you will probably want to look at reinforcing the tailgate and a different bracket to mount the tyre.

 

[Rudolph Hart]

If you want to buy stuff from US companies who don’t want to ship outside the States have a look here...
https://www.stackry.com
They give you a US address.
They will also consolidate multiple items into one shipment to save money.

 

[taram]

If you want to buy stuff from US companies who don’t want to ship outside the States have a look here...
https://www.stackry.com
They give you a US address.
They will also consolidate multiple items into one shipment to save money.

Thank you very much for the info, will check. Still thinking of ordering through the dealership, which is strongly not recommended by forum mate who also from Cyprus but he says there’s a local shop that can deliver some parts - also will check with them.

 

[taram]

Thank you guys for your attention and such detailed replies, wow!
Will go through shortly if you don’t mind.

Ok, for the 3.0 Diesel engine I really should relax... IMO 3.0 6-cyl diesel is a perfect match for such a vehicle, but as Tony @lohr500 wrote and what i’ve heard from other 2.2 diesel owners - everybody is quite happy with it. It’s not going to be my everyday car, so acceleration is not THAT crucial, and for off-roading - 450 Nm of torque together with 3.7 rear axle ratio is quite enough, i guess... most probably we will see 3.0D in Wrangler, but WHEN and for HOW MUCH...

For to the bumpers - i was told that there should me no problem with steel bumpers and larger tires in Cyprus, so 99% i'd go with Mopar stock US Rubicon steel bumpers - but i still do not understand how to deal with park assist sensors - are there openings in the steel bumpers for them?

Regarding the winch - surely i will take some safety course and i think we will go on the trails together with more experienced friend of mine who has LR Defender 90 with the winch as well. What is a "winch kit" - is it some set of winch accessories or a standalone device. e.g. hi-lift jack? I'd appreciate your explanation.

We forget about steps for now, I agree that they might be an issue on the trails.

OK, now to the main dilemma of mine - the TIRES look, my point is as follows: tires coming out the fender flares is not an issue in Cyprus (at least i was told it is not) and i will definitely go with high fender flares. SO, if we consider that US stock wheels are 285/70R17 and i want to go with 315/70R17 we have around 4 cm difference between the overall wheel size and some more width. Here's a very useful thread for the tire sizes and their comparison - https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/popular-jeep-tires-size-weights-specs-pics.8603/ .
As you might have already noticed a lot of US owners go with 35"x12.5" tires on stock rims and with no suspension modification (which are even a bit bigger since 315/70 are 34.4"x12.7"). I really like how they look and fill the wheel wells, check this post: https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/fo...ze-weights-specs-pics.8603/page-2#post-266176 - they guy didn't install any lift/spacers/bump stops . If i will suffer from any rubbing during off-road articulation i might add some reasonable size wheel spacers (NMT 0.5"-1") to compensate for the wider tire AND/OR 0.5"-1" leveling spacers kit just to remove the factory rake and compensate heavier bumpers/winch. But reading tons of posts like "35 inch wheels on full-stock JLUR - no rubbing even with disconnected sway bar" - makes me think i might be fully fine with this setup without adding any spacers anywhere.
Considering the spare wheel carrier - again, let's see the stock tire weight - it's 51 lbs. If i go with C-rated BFG KO2's - the tire weight increases to 65 lbs, so we have 14 lbs difference - which is roughly 6 kg. Considering the overall wheel weight together with the rim around 30 kg (i don't know the exact weight of the stock rim) - i don't think additional 6 kg will be an issue. Again, from many posts i can see that people really start modifying suspension, spare tire carrier and etc. starting from 37" wheels and above. You all know that stock carrier can be height adjusted exactly up to 35" wheel
Also i've seen that there is a rubber support on the lock side of the back-door and when you close it - this support takes part of the weight load, so it's not only the hinges to carry the spare tire weight. And correct me, but Mopar reinforcement kit doesn't actually enforce hinges - it's an additional metal plate on the door, nothing more...
So OK, it's very personal and i fully agree that JLUR is very capable with stock tires, but personally i really love the look of 315/70, so i'd go with them, and if i face any troubles - i will solve them to have this beefier look
Certainly i will have to adjust the speedometer , but i'm thinking of purchasing Tazer for many reasons, so this is not an issue. And i think i will do much better job than dealership who seems to see this car for the first time together with me

 

[Rudolph Hart]

For to the bumpers - i was told that there should me no problem with steel bumpers and larger tires in Cyprus, so 99% i'd go with Mopar stock US Rubicon steel bumpers - but i still do not understand how to deal with park assist sensors - are there openings in the steel bumpers for them?

Regarding the winch - surely i will take some safety course and i think we will go on the trails together with more experienced friend of mine who has LR Defender 90 with the winch as well. What is a "winch kit" - is it some set of winch accessories

OK, now to the main dilemma of mine - the TIRES look, my point is as follows: tires coming out the fender flares is not an issue in Cyprus (at least i was told it is not) and i will definitely go with high fender flares. SO, if we consider that US stock wheels are 285/70R17 and i want to go with 315/70R17 we have around 4 cm difference between the overall wheel size and some more width. Here's a very useful thread for the tire sizes and their comparison - https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/popular-jeep-tires-size-weights-specs-pics.8603/ .
As you might have already noticed a lot of US owners go with 35"x12.5" tires on stock rims and with no suspension modification

Considering the spare wheel carrier - again, let's see the stock tire weight - it's 51 lbs. If i go with C-rated BFG KO2's - the tire weight increases to 65 lbs, so we have 14 lbs difference - which is roughly 6 kg.

Hi Marat

I’ll try to add a bit to the above bits of your reply.

The OE bumper will almost certainly come without the holes for the front parking sensors as they don’t have these on the US Rubicon. You will need to drill the holes and reuse the sensors, these will come away if you heat them up. If you get the halogen fog lights (like we do in the U.K.) they can also be reused.

A winch kit is a set of accessories, usually a tree protector, gloves, shackles and an extension strap maybe, they vary. Search online.

The tyres...I think you’re probably right in your assumptions BUT...we get narrower axles than the US Rubicon, so you may run into issues that they don’t have.

The tyre carrier may be an issue because of the size of the tyre rather than the weight.

 

[taram]

OK, yes, i thought that with parking sensors some DIY is needed, but hopefully at least the rear bumper will have the holes. For the fog lights i'm not sure, i have ordered LED-package, and it says LED fog lights there...

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LPX Headlamps - LED w/ Round Signature
JKJ Automatic Headlamp Leveling System
LPY Daytime Running Lamps - LED
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XHU Front Park Assist (IF ECE W/ PED PRO MARKET SPEC GROUP)

The tyres...I think you’re probably right in your assumptions BUT...we get narrower axles than the US Rubicon, so you may run into issues that they don’t have.

Oh, this is something new again for me... Are you sure about the axles? It's not the same DANA-44? Damn, why so many differences with 1 model?! I wonder where i could get a 100% info on this, as i wanted to order most of the upgrades before the car arrives to have them ready to install upon delivery. Do you know the source of this info or exact technical details?

The tyre carrier may be an issue because of the size of the tyre rather than the weight.

Well, OK, if we don't get something different from US Rubicon again - people say only some of them experience some rubbing of the spare tire with steel bumper, but on the other hand it's supporting the tire thus unloading the hinges from the load. But if you're right about the axles - this is the smallest problem

 

[Rudolph Hart]

Hi Marat

The axles on our UK Rubicons are...

front - Dana M210HD
rear - Dana M220HD

I assume these are the same for all export Rubicons.

They are definitely narrower than US Rubicons.

 

[taram]

Hi Marat

The axles on our UK Rubicons are...

front - Dana M210HD
rear - Dana M220HD

I assume these are the same for all export Rubicons.

They are definitely narrower than US Rubicons.

“Great” news... do you think wheel spacers could solve this problem?... will try to find exact dimensions of the US/Export axles to see the difference.

 

[taram]

Hi Marat

The axles on our UK Rubicons are...

front - Dana M210HD
rear - Dana M220HD

I assume these are the same for all export Rubicons.

They are definitely narrower than US Rubicons.

Wait, John, but I chatted recently with another forum mate from UK as well - and he installed 315/70 on his Jeep without any issues (he has 2.5” lift kit installed as well, but this doesn’t deal with the width of the axles, correct?). I will PM him to get more accurate info. I hope i will find someone else from Europe who has installed bigger tires on his euro-spec Rubi.
It looks like a quest game prepared for us by FCA

 

[Rudolph Hart]

Wait, John, but I chatted recently with another forum mate from UK as well - and he installed 315/70 on his Jeep without any issues (he has 2.5” lift kit installed as well, but this doesn’t deal with the width of the axles, correct?). I will PM him to get more accurate info. I hope i will find someone else from Europe who has installed bigger tires on his euro-spec Rubi.
It looks like a quest game prepared for us by FCA

Ok, well I’m not saying they won’t fit. I’m just voicing some of the concerns/considerations that I’ve had.

Because of the legalities around the tyre being wider than the fender flares and because I want to gain some height I’m going to go with 285/75r17 on the OE wheels...it’s not a common size but it seems a reasonable compromise.

 

[taram]

Ok, well I’m not saying they won’t fit. I’m just voicing some of the concerns/considerations that I’ve had.

Because of the legalities around the tyre being wider than the fender flares and because I want to gain some height I’m going to go with 285/75r17 on the OE wheels...it’s not a common size but it seems a reasonable compromise.

Yes, thanks for sharing your opinion, really. I have time before delivery and it’s better to analyze all pros and cons in advance. Your preferred tire size sounds reasonable, especially 75 profile - you will gain some more height indeed. I will keep in mind this option as well.

 

[KIVO]

If you want to buy stuff from US companies who don’t want to ship outside the States have a look here...
https://www.stackry.com
They give you a US address.
They will also consolidate multiple items into one shipment to save money.

Great tip Rudolph!

I'm after rock sliders, but cannot find a single seller who wants to ship them to Europe.
I'll have to try this

 

[taram]

Great tip Rudolph!

I'm after rock sliders, but cannot find a single seller who wants to ship them to Europe.
I'll have to try this

Hey Kid,

Have you tried checking those rock sliders on Quadratec? They ship internationally and have nice discounts for the forum members. I've had absolutely great experience with them, though the shipping is pricey, but they ship with UPS expedited and you get your stuff literally in 10 days. I have used a third-party shipping company to bring all the Mopar parts and cost me as hell in the end of the days...

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