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Modification needed if installing Genesis dual battery system in 4xe

Jeeperz Kreeperz

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Installing this now. Seems there are some hybrid coolant parts that mount under the OEM battery tray in the 4xe, which obviously don’t exist in the non-4xe version.

I checked with @Genesis Offroad before installation, and they said the engine compartment near the battery is the same as in the regular 2.0, and they‘ve sold their dual battery kit to 4xe owners and not heard of any issues, so I was hoping it would just drop in.

I’m working on repurposing the OEM metal bracket that sits between the OEM battery tray and the air box, and using that as a bracket back at the firewall to support the coolant parts that are now hanging in mid-air.

Anyone done this install yet? What did you do with that coolant valve and hoses, etc? (See pic below with blue circled items - those three threaded studs were previously attached to bottom of the OEM battery tray.)

Jeep Wrangler JL Modification needed if installing Genesis dual battery system in 4xe EDBDC2DD-F4AB-4362-913B-670EA37DFD1D
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Jeeperz Kreeperz

Jeeperz Kreeperz

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I couldn’t leave those coolant parts hanging - they were putting some tension on the flexible coolant lines, and it would have bounced its way into a problem had I not addressed it.

Here’s the approach I used, but maybe @Genesis Offroad can chime in if they are familiar with another way to do this, or maybe they can design a separate bracket so you don’t have to roll your own like I did.

Below is the approach I took - in case it helps anyone.

There is a steel OEM bracket that is “L” shaped, and has a couple tabs and holes that sit underneath the battery tray (horizontally), then there is a vertical side that resides between the battery tray and the air box. This bracket is removed, and discarded when installing the Genesis dual battery kit.

I repurposed this bracket to sit against the firewall - held in with a 1/8” screw, and a hole that hangs on one of the two studs used to mount the Genesis tray to the firewall. Once the Genesis tray is in place, it snugs it up against the firewall nicely.

Pics:

OEM Bracket:

Jeep Wrangler JL Modification needed if installing Genesis dual battery system in 4xe 3988E687-6B60-4F39-913C-7BB9A5AFA10F



A little snipping…

Jeep Wrangler JL Modification needed if installing Genesis dual battery system in 4xe E2081A37-6884-4D98-9FC8-47DAB65FED3F


A little bending, drilling, and spray painting…

Jeep Wrangler JL Modification needed if installing Genesis dual battery system in 4xe 29168FD7-D555-4061-9BEE-E7CAAF7C6447


Jeep Wrangler JL Modification needed if installing Genesis dual battery system in 4xe B91946AD-AD03-4EB7-AE46-CF91EB851FDA


Installed (before installing Genesis tray)…

Jeep Wrangler JL Modification needed if installing Genesis dual battery system in 4xe 222FDE9C-27C2-4237-8D55-3EB2FD1B9E7E


And then after tray is installed…

Jeep Wrangler JL Modification needed if installing Genesis dual battery system in 4xe 37AE2D23-C741-4E3B-8CD8-3D9B6538332B


Jeep Wrangler JL Modification needed if installing Genesis dual battery system in 4xe 09FA147B-10A7-4E0E-9A77-4018E489624E


As a side note, this dual battery kit is an absolute work of art. Beautiful build quality, and great attention to detail. Looking forward to putting it through its paces on a long trip next month. Thanks @Genesis Offroad !
 
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Genesis Offroad

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Thank you so much for the info! I really appreciate the feedback! Great job on the modification. I will see about getting one of these into our shop for measurements and see if we can produce a simple bracket to address this for the 4xe guys.
This is why I always say we have the best customers!
-Shane
 
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Jeeperz Kreeperz

Jeeperz Kreeperz

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Thank you so much for the info! I really appreciate the feedback! Great job on the modification. I will see about getting one of these into our shop for measurements and see if we can produce a simple bracket to address this for the 4xe guys.
This is why I always say we have the best customers!
-Shane
I used to install automotive electronics in a prior life, and having worked with a lot of gear over those years, I was truly impressed with the fit & finish and top notch build quality of your product. Really well done.

Also, your YouTube install video was incredibly helpful!

I have a suggestion for an easy-to-manufacture accessory that you guys could offer: A simple bracket that mounts on one or two of the top bolts that hold your kit down (the two bolts nearest the fender). It could fit between your kit and the fender. Customers could mount fuse holders, circuit breakers, switches, on-board battery tenders, etc.

In my last pic above, I was looking for a place to mount that ANL fuse holder. I found a piece of aluminum in my garage, but it’s a temp fix, as it is just squeezed between your top bracket, and your tray.

Even just a simple black rectangular piece of aluminum or steel with a few mounting holes in it - and a strategically placed hole to fit under the bolt on your kit. If done right, customers could just flip it over and use it on the other bolt, or purchase two - one on each side - like so:

Jeep Wrangler JL Modification needed if installing Genesis dual battery system in 4xe 16FAB116-B1AF-4E23-AB42-2764AAA77E93
 
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Black96z

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I was going to put a Genesis kit in my 4XE, but after doing some testing, I'm not sure its needed. I had one in my JK, and the OP is correct, they make some great kits. I think in the 4XE I am just going to swap the factory battery for a deep cycle battery. The 4XE needs no starting load from a battery, and running down the 12V is really not an issue because all the power it needs is to boot the computer and close the contactor for the HV battery. Once this happens, the DC-DC converter will kick on and power the 12V and charge it back up is its run down. If you replace the factory 12V for a deep cycle, you essentially have a dual battery setup.

To the OP, after you get the kit installed, can you do some testing? Put in a fridge or just a load with an inverter and draw the house battery down a bit (like 50%) and then start the Jeep and drive it around for a but and see if it properly charges the house battery without an alternator. The DC-DC converter works a bit different and I am not sure that the house battery will charge properly. When watching the 12V page while driving, it doesn't spend a lot of time boosted above the FlexMod reconnect voltage of 13.2V, especially if the starting battery is not drawn down very much. I don't know that without the G Screen to force the contactor to close that it would even have the voltage high enough long enough to trigger the FlexMod.
 

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Jeeperz Kreeperz

Jeeperz Kreeperz

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@Black96z , I had some of the same questions you asked. In fact, I might have even tried just swapping to a deep cycle, if I didn’t already have this kit and two batteries on hand. I’m also headed on a 6,000 mile trip in a couple days, and just wanted to have the redundancy of the dual battery system - since the two batteries I’m using are NOT brand new, but are 2.5 years old.

I’m 30 hours into a fridge test right now. Dometic CFX50. Half-full of groceries and beverages. I open it up for 60-seconds a few times per day. Jeep is in garage - roughly 80 degrees ambient temp. Fridge temp is set for 37F, and not keying the Jeep on during the test. Fridge temp is swinging from 34F on low end, to 39F on high end.

Just tested voltage. Cranking battery at 12.76V, house battery at 12.36V. I don’t want to drain below 12.2V, so I will be stopping the test within the next few hours. Taking a test drive, and watching screen and taking my own measurements.
 

Black96z

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@Black96z , I had some of the same questions you asked. In fact, I might have even tried just swapping to a deep cycle, if I didn’t already have this kit and two batteries on hand. I’m also headed on a 6,000 mile trip in a couple days, and just wanted to have the redundancy of the dual battery system - since the two batteries I’m using are NOT brand new, but are 2.5 years old.

I’m 30 hours into a fridge test right now. Dometic CFX50. Half-full of groceries and beverages. I open it up for 60-seconds a few times per day. Jeep is in garage - roughly 80 degrees ambient temp. Fridge temp is set for 37F, and not keying the Jeep on during the test. Fridge temp is swinging from 34F on low end, to 39F on high end.

Just tested voltage. Cranking battery at 12.76V, house battery at 12.36V. I don’t want to drain below 12.2V, so I will be stopping the test within the next few hours. Taking a test drive, and watching screen and taking my own measurements.

So you are using the standard JL kit?
 

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Interesting 4xe with dead/bad 12v battery test by Brandon (love this guy!)

 
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Jeeperz Kreeperz

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Multi-Day Genesis Dual Battery Test Results

Results from dual battery test (TLDR: Just skip to end for conclusions)

7/26 8:00 AM Start test

Test Conditions:
  • 2021 Rubicon 4xe
  • Genesis Dual battery kit for JL
  • Two (2) Odyssey Group 25 PC1400T AGM deep cycle batteries
  • Dometic CFX50 fridge set at 37F
  • Half-full of groceries
  • Occasional open/close
  • No key-on during first part of test - until voltage drops below 12.2V
  • Vehicle inside garage for first day, outside for next two days
  • Ambient temp: 80F during days, 60F at night
  • Not a true scientific test, but I did have a voltmeter out, and squinted at it pensively from time to time 🤔 to make it appear as if I knew what I was measuring
7/27 8:00am (24 hours)
12.78V Cranking Battery
12.62V House Vattery

NOTE: Genesis system separates batteries when voltage drops below 12.7V. This appears to have happened just prior to the 24 hour mark.

7/27 2:00pm (30 hours)
12.76V Cranking Battery
12.36V House Battery

7/27 3:00pm (31 hours)
12.60V Cranking Battery
12.18V House Battery

End “no key-on” portion of test

7/27 3:08pm
Accessory on: dash voltage climbs to 14.3V
Move to “Run”: dash voltage climbs to 14.4V
Start ICE
Pop hood, and measure:
14.28V Cranking Battery
14.22V House Battery

Wait 5 minutes with ICE running:
14.24V Cranking Battery
14.21V House Battery

Drive 20 minutes at 40+/- MPH on Electric drive mode only and re-measure:
14.19V Cranking Battery
14.17V House Battery

Leave ICE running for 10 minutes:
14.26V Cranking Battery
14.25V House Battery

Shut vehicle off.
45 minutes later, with fridge still running
12.80V Cranking Battery
12.80V House Battery

Re-start vehicle:
Within first 5 seconds, voltage on dash jumps from high 12s to 14.1v
Re-measure actual voltage:
14.23V Cranking Battery
14.22V House Battery

7/28/2021
Commuted about 20 miles to work using ICE only
Keyed up Jeep once mid-day.
Commuted home from work using electric only
Arrived home with <1% charge. Did NOT plug in PHEV battery overnight.
Too busy today. No voltage measurements taken.
Fridge never shut off, and remained in range.

7/29/2021 8:00am (72 hrs since start of test, 14 hrs since Jeep was last keyed on)
12.84V Cranking Battery
12.56V House Battery

7/29/2021 6:00pm (82 hrs since start of test, 24 hrs since Jeep was last keyed on)
13.06V Cranking Battery
12.45V House Battery
Fridge has worked flawlessly since start of test

Conclusions:
  1. Genesis system seemed to work exactly as designed: When voltage fell to 12.7V, the batteries separated, and I would see a difference between measured voltage on the two batteries. At levels above 12.7V, the two batteries measured nearly identical voltage.
  2. For me, it appears to have taken roughly 23 or 24 hours into the “no key-on” portion of the test before the voltage dropped to 12.7V. Since I was pulling from two deep cycle batteries for the first 24 hours, we can assume that if you were using a single, deep cycle battery, your time to drop to 12.7V would be reduced (would it be exactly half of 24 hours?). Keep in mind, these are 2.5 year-old batteries. I would expect better performance from new batteries.
  3. A 4xe owner needing the benefits of a deep cycle battery, might want to purchase a single deep cycle battery first, and swap it out with the OEM battery. Run some torture tests in your driveway. If the single battery gives you the run times you require, maybe that’s all you need. Since the 4xe high voltage battery under the rear seats “tops up” the low voltage battery under the hood when the Jeep is keyed on, you could achieve some of functionality/benefits/run-time of a dual battery system for a net cost of $300+/-. However, if you’re looking for longer run times, and/or if you have concerns that you might drain the deep cycle battery to a level where it can’t be restored (and Jeep won’t start), then the redundancy of the dual battery system might be for you. At that point, you’d already have one deep cycle battery from your test. You’ll “only” need to buy a second deep cycle battery and dual battery kit.
Note: These Odyssey batteries are rated to cycle down to 10.27V (80% of full state of charge of 12.84V). If you were to drain a single deep cycle battery down below 10V, what would happen? Would it still work out in the field? Would you be stranded like Brandon Haneline in the video above when he tested a bad battery? I assume it would take multiple deep drain events to kill it? Not certain.

Hopefully my measurements and musings help others contemplating a dual battery setup in the 4xe!
 

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Is there any way to change the accessory timeout? I think Brandon in one of his videos managed to eliminate it by disconnecting the driver's door wiring harness. Although I'm not sure why that worked.
 

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I was going to put a Genesis kit in my 4XE, but after doing some testing, I'm not sure its needed. I had one in my JK, and the OP is correct, they make some great kits. I think in the 4XE I am just going to swap the factory battery for a deep cycle battery. The 4XE needs no starting load from a battery, and running down the 12V is really not an issue because all the power it needs is to boot the computer and close the contactor for the HV battery. Once this happens, the DC-DC converter will kick on and power the 12V and charge it back up is its run down. If you replace the factory 12V for a deep cycle, you essentially have a dual battery setup.

To the OP, after you get the kit installed, can you do some testing? Put in a fridge or just a load with an inverter and draw the house battery down a bit (like 50%) and then start the Jeep and drive it around for a but and see if it properly charges the house battery without an alternator. The DC-DC converter works a bit different and I am not sure that the house battery will charge properly. When watching the 12V page while driving, it doesn't spend a lot of time boosted above the FlexMod reconnect voltage of 13.2V, especially if the starting battery is not drawn down very much. I don't know that without the G Screen to force the contactor to close that it would even have the voltage high enough long enough to trigger the FlexMod.
This has me wondering why the 4xe comes with a standard battery. I would think a deep cycle battery is a better fit since there is no starter motor.
 
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Jeeperz Kreeperz

Jeeperz Kreeperz

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Is there any way to change the accessory timeout? I think Brandon in one of his videos managed to eliminate it by disconnecting the driver's door wiring harness. Although I'm not sure why that worked.
I watched that video too. I think the accessory normally shuts off at 30 minutes, and Brandon showed that having the door wire harness unplugged overrides that. I didn’t understand why either - or how he figured that out! Maybe if the Jeep computer sees a door open, it assumes you’re still coming, going, about to start up the Jeep, using the 120v inverter, or something similar, so they do away with the 30-minute shut-off?

I would guess Tazer or some other after-market mfgr will find a way to override that with a program.

This has me wondering why the 4xe comes with a standard battery. I would think a deep cycle battery is a better fit since there is no starter motor.
Cost? An auto manufacturer has no obligation to provide deep cycle batteries to cover our after-market accessory needs. Although a lot of us with Jeeps would like that if they did!
 

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I thought afterwards and (besides cost) another reason could be for jump starting other vehicles. I don't think the DC/DC converter is always active. But I'm sure it's just cost, whatever can be shared helps with volume costs.
 

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If I were to just throw a good single deep cycle in there (looks like you can get a group 94 size in there as a single battery) could I still hook a solar charger up to it the same as with the genesis kit?

I don't want to kill the efficiency of the Jeep by forcing the high voltage system to do all the keeping up with the fridge or electric blanket. I want to use as much of that power as possible for hybrid stuff rather than camping stuff.
 

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I watched that video too. I think the accessory normally shuts off at 30 minutes, and Brandon showed that having the door wire harness unplugged overrides that. I didn’t understand why either - or how he figured that out! Maybe if the Jeep computer sees a door open, it assumes you’re still coming, going, about to start up the Jeep, using the 120v inverter, or something similar, so they do away with the 30-minute shut-off?

I would guess Tazer or some other after-market mfgr will find a way to override that with a program.


Cost? An auto manufacturer has no obligation to provide deep cycle batteries to cover our after-market accessory needs. Although a lot of us with Jeeps would like that if they did!

There is a setting in Uconnect this turns off the Accessory Timeout when the doors have been removed.
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