Loose steering feels like it has play and drifts

[thecarps]

Generally speaking loose steering has little if anything to do with a solid axle vs IFS setup. Handling and ride yes, steering no, generally speaking. What I’m referring to is the “dead spot” in the Jeep JL steering system. While it is similar in away to the looseness of a worn steering box of yesteryear it is also significantly different in other ways, dangerous in some JLs’ and completely inexcusable. Saying that it’s a “Jeep Thing” is nothing more than excusing sloppy engineering and/or quality control, and that is what the “Jeep Thing” stands for to me. It also refers to the acceptance of something that is sub par especially by todays standards. Now if someone is willing to accept that, well, that’s up to them and I will not try to convince them otherwise.

Personally and quite frankly I find it an insult to pay $60K, considerably more than I did for my JK, take it in several times over manny months and then be told it’s a “Jeep Thing”. I know otherwise and my JL is proof of that.

You are absolutely correct about voting with our money, though. Not a penny of the cost of fixing the “Jeep Thing” in my JL went to FCA. Despite the fact that I really like my JL, now, look forward to driving it and keeping it for quite a while, I will not buy another FCA vehicle. That’s my vote

My old LX450 had solid axles and drove great. So did my JKs. This Jeep Thing is BS and need only apply to lifts, tires and removable doors/top. Sloppy factory steering is just sloppy engineering.

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[Axe]

Wow 2 years and 4 months later and still no fix.
FCA - you know the Broncos coming soon, right?

 

[californiajeeping]

Motor Trend confirms steering issue fix made to 2020 Jeep JL (gear valve tuning & pump calibration changes)

https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/fo...-valve-tuning-pump-calibration-changes.53885/

 

[EugeneTheJeep]

After reading through this and other threads and driving several JL/JTs (2018s to 2020s, all Rubis) I have a few conclusions with which you may or may not agree.

1. All the JLs and JTs (five total) I’ve driven (100s of miles) felt loose to me. Some were more loose than others. About 1/2 to 1 in of play (move wheel, nothing happens, moving or stopped).

2. Some feel lighter or heavier than others but still have the same dead spot.

3. All were aligned well and tracked straight.

4. All followed the road crown, bumps, pot holes, etc. requiring much more constant correction than a typical car.

5. The wind makes everything much worse, and in strong winds in certain directions the dead spot seems much larger.

6. Some people are really sensitive to the dead spot (me) while others drive the same Jeep and don’t seem to notice.

7. The steering on all of them has been absolutely amazing off-road! Turning while stopped is effortless. Bumps are absorbed while the Jeep continues straight. Just great.

8. My advice which is probably next to worthless, but I’ll give anyway: You must decide if what you are feeling is normal or if you have an issue that warrants braving the dealer and having a random service advisor and tech touch your Jeep. If it’s wandering in no wind, get an alignment. If it has a dead spot greater than an inch or so, get a new steering gear, the slop in the bushings fixed, or whatever else. If locking up, get it towed; don’t drive it. Otherwise, have fun driving your large go-cart.

***Bonus: A Sahara I had as a rental one day was much more responsive on the highway. I attribute this to the street tires and lower profile.

 

[JDM]

After reading through this and other threads and driving several JL/JTs (2018s to 2020s, all Rubis) I have a few conclusions with which you may or may not agree.

1. All the JLs and JTs (five total) I’ve driven (100s of miles) felt loose to me. Some were more loose than others. About 1/2 to 1 in of play (move wheel, nothing happens, moving or stopped).

2. Some feel lighter or heavier than others but still have the same dead spot.

3. All were aligned well and tracked straight.

4. All followed the road crown, bumps, pot holes, etc. requiring much more constant correction than a typical car.

5. The wind makes everything much worse, and in strong winds in certain directions the dead spot seems much larger.

6. Some people are really sensitive to the dead spot (me) while others drive the same Jeep and don’t seem to notice.

7. The steering on all of them has been absolutely amazing off-road! Turning while stopped is effortless. Bumps are absorbed while the Jeep continues straight. Just great.

8. My advice which is probably next to worthless, but I’ll give anyway: You must decide if what you are feeling is normal or if you have an issue that warrants braving the dealer and having a random service advisor and tech touch your Jeep. If it’s wandering in no wind, get an alignment. If it has a dead spot greater than an inch or so, get a new steering gear, the slop in the bushings fixed, or whatever else. If locking up, get it towed; don’t drive it. Otherwise, have fun driving your large go-cart.

***Bonus: A Sahara I had as a rental one day was much more responsive on the highway. I attribute this to the street tires and lower profile.

You’re pretty much right on.

1 &2 : Agree.
I did have the TSB update done to my 2018 JLU and while it made the steering lighter it did nothing for the dead spot.

3 & 4: Agree.
Point 4 kind of mitigates point 3 but all in all that’s splitting hairs. For tracking get adjustable LCA’s and set the caster to 6.5*+ -7*+ with a cross caster of .5*+. Did that no wandering at all, zip, zero, none, nada. Mine is stock height. Some have expressed concerns about that much + caster in a lifted Jeep because of the effect on the pinion angles. If that is a concern there are options; double cardan or a high angle rzeppa are possible options.

5: Agree
Falcon 2.2 adjustable firm/soft setting shocks eliminated that issue. These are digressive shocks and for some may not be the best option, for me they’re the ticket.

6: Agree

7: Agree

8: “Get new steering gear”: Agree
PSC, SK500.

Not everyone may agree but my findings after spending the money confirm your thoughts after you read the posts. Interestingly I also rented a Sahara JLU. For the most part I would agree with your findings but to me it felt like a wet noodle on the HWY. Couldn’t wait to get mine back.

 

[Quigley]

https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/fo...as-play-and-drifts.3691/page-405#post-1132084

Tried the fuse pull/reset 4 step program. Did nothing for my 2020 Rubicon 2 dr.

 

[Rodeoflyer]

Trackbars..huge.. heavier adjustable lower control arms, upgraded/stronger tie rod and draglink. finally a good steering stabilizer.

 

[rid34fun]

My old LX450 had solid axles and drove great. So did my JKs. This Jeep Thing is BS and need only apply to lifts, tires and removable doors/top. Sloppy factory steering is just sloppy engineering.

All of the F250's I have used all wandered a bit especially over bumps and crowns in the road.

Generally speaking loose steering has little if anything to do with a solid axle vs IFS setup. Handling and ride yes, steering no, generally speaking. What I’m referring to is the “dead spot” in the Jeep JL steering system. While it is similar in away to the looseness of a worn steering box of yesteryear it is also significantly different in other ways, dangerous in some JLs’ and completely inexcusable. Saying that it’s a “Jeep Thing” is nothing more than excusing sloppy engineering and/or quality control, and that is what the “Jeep Thing” stands for to me. It also refers to the acceptance of something that is sub par especially by todays standards. Now if someone is willing to accept that, well, that’s up to them and I will not try to convince them otherwise.

Personally and quite frankly I find it an insult to pay $60K, considerably more than I did for my JK, take it in several times over manny months and then be told it’s a “Jeep Thing”. I know otherwise and my JL is proof of that.

You are absolutely correct about voting with our money, though. Not a penny of the cost of fixing the “Jeep Thing” in my JL went to FCA. Despite the fact that I really like my JL, now, look forward to driving it and keeping it for quite a while, I will not buy another FCA vehicle. That’s my vote.

All the F250's I have used wandered a bit. IFS make a big difference because each wheel can independently track on the road and they can be setup in so many more ways. Solid axles are not really good at doing that. But, that is neither here nor there, it is important to get a vehicle to drive the best it can. I probably lowered my expectations, so I could talk myself into one!

 

[JDM]

All of the F250's I have used all wandered a bit especially over bumps and crowns in the road.



All the F250's I have used wandered a bit. IFS make a big difference because each wheel can independently track on the road and they can be setup in so many more ways. Solid axles are not really good at doing that. But, that is neither here nor there, it is important to get a vehicle to drive the best it can. I probably lowered my expectations, so I could talk myself into one!

As I said before thats handling not steering.

If we’re talking about rack and pinion vs gear box pitman arm drag link systems, then yes there will be a difference. But neither should have looseness or a dead spot in the steering system, how much one has to turn the steering wheel to get a response from the tires. Gear box systems of today can and should be designed and built to far tighter tolerances with far better quality control. Otherwise why are we paying more, much more?!?!? They tell us that it costs more because they made it better. That’s what I was told when I bought my JLU. They made it different, but better? Mine sure wasn’t.

Of course if the linkage and/or related connecting points (tie rod ends, ball joints etc.) between tires and steering system are loose due to wear or poor design and/or quality control that will contribute to loose steering AND to tracking. But that applies to both IFS And solid axle as well as rack and pinion and gear box systems.

Given that all the above mentioned items are designed, executed with good quality control and in good shape the IFS system will have on road advantages and an over all better feel. The solid axle, gear box system is more demanding. But in todays world thats no excuse whatsoever for the type of slop in the JLU steering system or for that matter the linkage.

 

[rrwoodward]

As stated throughout this 413 page thread, there is no simple and effective fix. This method has worked for some and other's it was only a temporary fix; me being one of them. You may feel an immediate response when the adjustment is made but for me my slop returned after about a thousand miles. Welcome to the club...

Ok, I'll keep that in mind and report back. Of course, as it stands now with my essential house-arrest...I'm not getting much driving in right now.

 

[rid34fun]

As I said before thats handling not steering.

If we’re talking about rack and pinion vs gear box pitman arm drag link systems, then yes there will be a difference. But neither should have looseness or a dead spot in the steering system, how much one has to turn the steering wheel to get a response from the tires. Gear box systems of today can and should be designed and built to far tighter tolerances with far better quality control. Otherwise why are we paying more, much more?!?!? They tell us that it costs more because they made it better. That’s what I was told when I bought my JLU. They made it different, but better? Mine sure wasn’t.

Of course if the linkage and/or related connecting points (tie rod ends, ball joints etc.) between tires and steering system are loose due to wear or poor design and/or quality control that will contribute to loose steering AND to tracking. But that applies to both IFS And solid axle as well as rack and pinion and gear box systems.

Given that all the above mentioned items are designed, executed with good quality control and in good shape the IFS system will have on road advantages and an over all better feel. The solid axle, gear box system is more demanding. But in todays world thats no excuse whatsoever for the type of slop in the JLU steering system or for that matter the linkage.

That would be a good conversation over a drink on the driveway one day I like my solid axle now, it drives like my other 15 or so solid axle vehicles from my past, so it is an improvement and I hope everyone get's some resolution. My expectations are closer to being met with this fix.

 

[JDM]

That would be a good conversation over a drink on the driveway one day I like my solid axle now, it drives like my other 15 or so solid axle vehicles from my past, so it is an improvement and I hope everyone get's some resolution. My expectations are closer to being met with this fix.

Sounds like a plan!

 

[VKSheridan]

This helped a bunch. Need the synergy trackbar brace in addition to new stabilizer but this helped the wandering. My wife also thinks its so much safer to drive. Whoever originally posted this.. think it was CaliforniaJeeping but this was a lemon law saving post. Not sure If the software will revert to crap like before but seems so much better now.

Sorry fellas. I put the Jeep on the freeway and it went right back to what it was doing before the fuse pull. Wandering like a drunk on the side of a hill of ice. I didn’t say anything to my wife to see if I was finding a problem because I was purposely looking for one. Unsolicited, she came in and said, “It’s broke again” and told me she would prefer driving a semi on bald tires pulling doubles in a snow tornado.......

Back to the drawing board.....

 

[JDM]

Sorry fellas. I put the Jeep on the freeway and it went right back to what it was doing before the fuse pull. Wandering like a drunk on the side of a hill of ice. I didn’t say anything to my wife to see if I was finding a problem because I was purposely looking for one. Unsolicited, she came in and said, “It’s broke again” and told me she would prefer driving a semi on bald tires pulling doubles in a snow tornado.......

Back to the drawing board.....

“Can’t stop laughing”... Not that I’m happy to see you having to deal with this, wen’t through it myself, so I can empathize. But.. this may be the best the best description of what I think of as an “FCA Thing”.

 

[znakos]

I got my adjustable front track bar installed as close as I can with a tape measure in my garage. I also got the steering wheel centered. I took a few test drives and I notice a large improvement over the stock bar. little to no pull or drift and it feels much smoother over bumps. I need to get it on an alignment rack but I am very pleased and feel i have solved my issue. I will report back in a few days with some more miles on it.

Any update on how your wandering has been with your new track bar install? Have you gotten it aligned?

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