Yeah they didn't work in the desert on rocks in stock form....same thing...hot knife, lots of grooving and they sorta wrapped to an extent.It's still TSL rubber compound so they could be made to grab, but you needed to hot knife the shit out of them. Army buddy of mine had them on a Super Duty with the V10, argued to death that they were the bomb. Till he got his truck stuck like chuck in his own pasture. His only experience was the Mohave desert around Ft. Irwin. And I guess they would kinda work out there.