Locker Options for Sport

lightsout

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You’ve obviously never driven with a rear locker before. Yes, on ice and snow at speed an LSD is better. My wrangler is the last vehicle I’d use on ice and snow, I’d rather drive my wife’s civic. Mud? Not so much. The lockers will perform better in the mud all day. The LSD that Jeep uses is literally the worst one ever built. I know you want to think that a rear LSD is better than a locker. Nobody that does any kind of wheeling will agree with you.

Good to know we know it all experts on this forum that cannot fathom anything out performing a Rubicon in ALL circumstances. That's OK though. Good to know there are civic experts as well. I am sure that all the snow country members will run out and buy a civic now that you have spoken...

So you say DANA builds the worst LSD ever? HUH, does Dana Know this? maybe you can advise them...

What a tool...
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word302

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Good to know we know it all experts on this forum that cannot fathom anything out performing a Rubicon in ALL circumstances. That's OK though. Good to know there are civic experts as well. I am sure that all the snow country members will run out and buy a civic now that you have spoken...

So you say DANA builds the worst LSD ever? HUH, does Dana Know this? maybe you can advise them...

What a tool...
Yes, when people are wearing out the clutches in less than 5000 miles that pretty much makes it a terrible as they come. I’m not talking about just rubicon vs non-rubicon. I’m talking about lsd vs lockers. Again, do you have any experience using lockers, or are you just talking out your ass?
 

Spaffy

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Where is the OX locker for the rear dana44 for sport axles
I just ordered mine! They are up on the website now; covers are still waiting to be powder coated so they're fresh.

I called to verify if it was for a Sport M220 narrow axle as it doesn't specifically specify online, and they said it was.
 

lightsout

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Yes, when people are wearing out the clutches in less than 5000 miles that pretty much makes it a terrible as they come. I’m not talking about just rubicon vs non-rubicon. I’m talking about lsd vs lockers. Again, do you have any experience using lockers, or are you just talking out your ass?

You are constantly blowin smoke up everyone's ass. Lets see the data... So FCA is installing Dana LDS rear axels, knowing that every 5000 miles they will fail or need service, so over the typical 3 year warranty and the average driving of 15K per year, FCA will have to provide warranty fixes for the LSD's up to 9 times. Who hear is experiencing that service rate? So FCA is loosing a tone of $$$ on warranty service of the LSD yet they still keep offing it, in fact offering on all models now (except Rubicon). FCA is absolutely genius..... What a crock I am at 26K miles no issue am I just the exception to the rule. No one is denying that LSD many require maintenance it is still far $$$ over all then buying a rig with lockers considering that 90% of jeep owners will never need lockers, whereas LSD provides the best solution for that 90% in terms of usability. My $500 winch will get me out of more jams then lockers. Look In currently have LSD rear and Lockers front making my rig far more versatile that and front-rear locker rig. If folks are worried about a little maintenance then a Wrangler is the WRONG vehicle for you...
 

word302

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You are constantly blowin smoke up everyone's ass. Lets see the data... So FCA is installing Dana LDS rear axels, knowing that every 5000 miles they will fail or need service, so over the typical 3 year warranty and the average driving of 15K per year, FCA will have to provide warranty fixes for the LSD's up to 9 times. Who hear is experiencing that service rate? So FCA is loosing a tone of $$$ on warranty service of the LSD yet they still keep offing it, in fact offering on all models now (except Rubicon). FCA is absolutely genius..... What a crock I am at 26K miles no issue am I just the exception to the rule. No one is denying that LSD many require maintenance it is still far $$$ over all then buying a rig with lockers considering that 90% of jeep owners will never need lockers, whereas LSD provides the best solution for that 90% in terms of usability. My $500 winch will get me out of more jams then lockers. Look In currently have LSD rear and Lockers front making my rig far more versatile that and front-rear locker rig. If folks are worried about a little maintenance then a Wrangler is the WRONG vehicle for you...
You shouldn't drink before posting man. Sorry I hurt your feelings.
 

Spaffy

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Starting to prep for my locker installs.

In case anyone is wondering size difference between the m186 front and the m220 (narrow) rear; here it is!

20210510_090157.jpg


These Ox lockers feel and look beautifully machined!

Before anyone asks; I'm going to lock the m186 because I really don't plan on going bigger than 32/33 inch tires. I initially had plans to buy a Dynatrac 44 for the front, but I tend to go overkill. Would have been a $6,500 axle all said and done. Locker, gears, and install kit I'm around $1,600 for the m186. Don't want Rubi takeoffs because I don't want to swap in another FAD axle, and I wanted ARB or OX lockers. (Just a personal choice- nothing against E lockers.) Would the 44 be stronger than the m186? Yep!! If 32/33 inch tires end up being too big for the m186 and it breaks, I'll still go that route. Or if I just feel like it in a few years I'll go that route! I'm going to put this thing to the test first though!
 

Therby

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Starting to prep for my locker installs.

In case anyone is wondering size difference between the m186 front and the m220 (narrow) rear; here it is!

20210510_090157.jpg


These Ox lockers feel and look beautifully machined!

Before anyone asks; I'm going to lock the m186 because I really don't plan on going bigger than 32/33 inch tires. I initially had plans to buy a Dynatrac 44 for the front, but I tend to go overkill. Would have been a $6,500 axle all said and done. Locker, gears, and install kit I'm around $1,600 for the m186. Don't want Rubi takeoffs because I don't want to swap in another FAD axle, and I wanted ARB or OX lockers. (Just a personal choice- nothing against E lockers.) Would the 44 be stronger than the m186? Yep!! If 32/33 inch tires end up being too big for the m186 and it breaks, I'll still go that route. Or if I just feel like it in a few years I'll go that route! I'm going to put this thing to the test first though!
Lockers will get you further than big tires, most of the time

Keep us updated! Looks good
My ARB rear is coming shortly
 

lightsout

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Lockers will get you further than big tires, most of the time

Keep us updated! Looks good
My ARB rear is coming shortly
And a winch will get you even further...
 

Spaffy

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And a winch will get you even further...
Done! Im also one of those weirdos with a 2 door JL, so I'm not as concerned with throwing 37s at it. The stock 32s will get me most places I'm looking to go!
20210507_140738.jpg


Just because I thought this was a good comparison too: m186, m220, AAM 11.5 full Detroit locker that's going in my Ram. The Jeep has such cute little carriers....
20210510_121021.jpg
 

JLTruman

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Starting to prep for my locker installs.

In case anyone is wondering size difference between the m186 front and the m220 (narrow) rear; here it is!

20210510_090157.jpg


These Ox lockers feel and look beautifully machined!

Before anyone asks; I'm going to lock the m186 because I really don't plan on going bigger than 32/33 inch tires. I initially had plans to buy a Dynatrac 44 for the front, but I tend to go overkill. Would have been a $6,500 axle all said and done. Locker, gears, and install kit I'm around $1,600 for the m186. Don't want Rubi takeoffs because I don't want to swap in another FAD axle, and I wanted ARB or OX lockers. (Just a personal choice- nothing against E lockers.) Would the 44 be stronger than the m186? Yep!! If 32/33 inch tires end up being too big for the m186 and it breaks, I'll still go that route. Or if I just feel like it in a few years I'll go that route! I'm going to put this thing to the test first though!
What's the ball park cost for the rear if you dont mind? I'm considering a rear locker for when my lsd give out eventually
 

Spaffy

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What's the ball park cost for the rear if you dont mind? I'm considering a rear locker for when my lsd give out eventually
It was about $1100 for each of the lockers with the shifter and cable (900 locker alone), front or rear. About 480 for the rear gears and install kit.
 

JLTruman

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It was about $1100 for each of the lockers with the shifter and cable (900 locker alone), front or rear. About 480 for the rear gears and install kit.
Cool, thanks for the quick reply
 

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FWIW, factory clutch driven LSDs are only marginally useful off road. The main reason is the built in bias ratio. A good gear driven LSD like a Truetrac has about a 3-1 ratio. Factory LSDs, even a gear driven unit, are usually not over 2-1. Decades ago when lockers weren't nearly as common, we used to add clutches to the old PowerLoc LSD. This made it much more capable but almost acted like a spool until the clutches wore down. We would rebuild yearly.
If you must go to an LSD, go Truetrac.
 

entropy

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Yes, when people are wearing out the clutches in less than 5000 miles that pretty much makes it a terrible as they come. I’m not talking about just rubicon vs non-rubicon. I’m talking about lsd vs lockers. Again, do you have any experience using lockers, or are you just talking out your ass?
theyre not THAT bad. My clutches are still good (knock on wood). But yeah, the LSD that Jeep uses is trashy. trash loc people call it. And in no way can it compare to an actual locker. Heck even BLD is better.

LSD > OPEN DIFF
BLD > LSD
BLD + LSD > BLD
LOCKER > ANYTHING

LSD made sense back in the day before Jeep got BLD in their traction control systems. Nowadays I am clueless why they don't offer a locker instead of the LSD option, specially for the willys. It is a jeep, jeep excel at crawling, if I wanted to drive dirt roads I would've gotten a different vehicle.

I didn't know any of this. But now I do, as I navigate waters to get a front locker on my Jeep I am keeping the LSD till it breaks, then I'll have to get a locker back there. Next time I am just buying the Rubicon.
 
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