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Toycrusher

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Ill grant that the livernois tune is done “right” and it seems like the majority of other ones on the market arent. Superchips/diablo seem to see a lot of problems. Same with pulsar, although supposedly the new motherboard has fix it. In any case, reflashing carries warranty concerns.

the v6 needs more power and imo is too high compression for 87. Not sure what im going to do with it yet. Super charging is expensive; and the prices charged for hemi conversions are absurd.

my need is more power down low. I rented a sahara this summer in co and averaged 24-25mpg. Mine is only getting 17-18, and it just doesnt have the power to turn the mud terrain tires even only 33” ones. Its constantly hunting down to 5, 6, and 7th gear. And taking a bunch of throttle to maintain speed on the highway, so mileage plummets.

the theory i have is the pcm update this last summer. I think they had to pull timing and add fuel to stop the pinging on 87. Just my guess though. People are reporting big drops in mpg after the reflash.
Sell it, buy a manual JL, swap in a heavier Centerforce clutch and flywheel, and your low rpm torque sensation needs will be satisfied
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Kurt0

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Sell it, buy a manual JL, swap in a heavier Centerforce clutch and flywheel, and your low rpm torque sensation needs will be satisfied
its not a “sensation”. Its needing the motor to be able to turn the wheels at highway speeds without dropping 2 cogs and running the throttle to opwn loop map tables.
 

AnnDee4444

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its not a “sensation”. Its needing the motor to be able to turn the wheels at highway speeds without dropping 2 cogs and running the throttle to opwn loop map tables.
I haven't driven a 3.6 JL, but I've noticed that the 8-speed is constantly choosing a RPM higher than I would like when accelerating, and far too quick when deciding to downshift. Manually shifting it tells me that the motor has enough power in the lower RPM range, but the default transmission logic is to make it rev.

Hopefully I'm not the only one that feels this way, and that some of the tunes also address the transmission tuning.
 

Toycrusher

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its not a “sensation”. Its needing the motor to be able to turn the wheels at highway speeds without dropping 2 cogs and running the throttle to opwn loop map tables.
Play around shifting it manually. You will probably be surprised to find that it gets better instant mpg at 3k rpm than it does at 2k rpm. It's just the way the engine is made, don't be afraid to let it rev.

Coming from a 4.0 I6 5-speed TJ I was super disappointed with the power band of my 3.6, but I now realize it's making more power than the 4.0 did at low rpm and WAAAY more power up high than the 4.0 ever dreamed of.
 

Livernois Motorsports

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I called about this to order it the other day.

over $200 for them to open your ecu, another $5-600 to tune the engine and another $5-600 on top of that if you want the trans flashed too.

priced way too high. $7-800+ for an ecu tune is absurd. I cant believe people are actually paying it.

I am not sure where the misinformation came from, but as mentioned throughout this thread there are 2 things you "need" to purchase to get our engine and transmission tuning:

https://www.livernoismotorsports.com/product/LPP621154

and

https://www.livernoismotorsports.com/product/LPP621000

That's it

Now, of course if you want a spare ECM that is an additional cost, but $745 + shipping for the ecm unlock, tuner, bypass cable, and tuning, I am not sure how that is priced "way too high"

Take into account what others mentioned, and even your own mentioning of how every other option in the marketplace has mediocre, or actually negative reviews for their results, and I can't find the dots to connect.

Is there something else under $6500, let alone under $800 that can add 50+ HP on these that I am unaware of?

Everyone is welcome to their opinion, BUT If you are expecting all of this for half the money, I would say it's time to get out of the 1990's for tuning prices.
 

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I put a Ripp Supercharger on my 2017 Wrangler JKUR. I took it to a custom tuner to get it running correctly (and I only had the manual, so no transmission tune). Tune was great, but that one trip cost me almost $500, and I was without my Jeep for a week. Tunes cost money. If a company delivers what is promised, I’ll pay.
 

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Tunes are expensive. I paid $400 for a custom dyno tune 10 years ago and $600 was not unheard of for some shops. And honestly, they did not do a great job. All they focus on is top end for big dyno number. No emphasis on drivability or a street tune. Hell, I can't even turn on the AC in my Trans Am or it will stall.
 

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I could just be out of touch on how much this stuff should cost.
 

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Livernois Motorsports

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I called about this to order it the other day.

over $200 for them to open your ecu, another $5-600 to tune the engine and another $5-600 on top of that if you want the trans flashed too.

priced way too high. $7-800+ for an ecu tune is absurd. I cant believe people are actually paying it.
I will counter act this well stated argument, as one of the first Livernois/Wrangler guinea pigs,......just buy it. It's great.
 

Kurt0

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Especially since the 3.6 doesn't go into enrichment stock until almost 5K RPM, LOL
Thats about when I’d expect it to with a factory program. Doesnt make sense, but it’s what they do.
 

Livernois Motorsports

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Thats about when I’d expect it to with a factory program. Doesnt make sense, but it’s what they do.
This is done for a bunch of reasons, but mostly it's CAFE and Emissions related. since trucks take far more throttle input to get going, they're more likely to go into enrichment if they were calibrated like a car. Because of this, they would likely fail an EPA drive cycle as that's actually a mandate that you cannot go into enrichment unless it's protecting the engine, or emissions components. So they delay the enrichment based on time, speed, rpm, or modeled catalyst temp.

So it makes sense, but not from a performance standpoint.
 

Kurt0

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This is done for a bunch of reasons, but mostly it's CAFE and Emissions related. since trucks take far more throttle input to get going, they're more likely to go into enrichment if they were calibrated like a car. Because of this, they would likely fail an EPA drive cycle as that's actually a mandate that you cannot go into enrichment unless it's protecting the engine, or emissions components. So they delay the enrichment based on time, speed, rpm, or modeled catalyst temp.

So it makes sense, but not from a performance standpoint.
i know. thats what i meant. You usually dont see conversion to open loop tables until a certain rpm or engine load.

were you guys able to ascertain any reason why the JL tune is detuned from the GC or Charger tunes?
 

AnnDee4444

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This is done for a bunch of reasons, but mostly it's CAFE and Emissions related. since trucks take far more throttle input to get going, they're more likely to go into enrichment if they were calibrated like a car. Because of this, they would likely fail an EPA drive cycle as that's actually a mandate that you cannot go into enrichment unless it's protecting the engine, or emissions components. So they delay the enrichment based on time, speed, rpm, or modeled catalyst temp.

So it makes sense, but not from a performance standpoint.
Interesting... Do you know if this is why the 2.0 doesn't appear to be restricted as much when compared to the car versions, in that due to its small size it's working harder and therefore needing to enter enrichment earlier to protect the engine/cat? Wouldn't being in boost require enrichment anyway?

Thanks for taking the time to explain all this... It's a complicated topic.
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