Lemon Law Arbitration vs. Litigation

[Notorious]

Well after waiting for 7 weeks for taking the next steps to litigation, the attorney (in so many words) said it’s not worth their time to pursue further. 7 weeks for that... so after 6 months of dealing with this process start to finish...I move on, lose my ass on trade in, and get into something I actually will drive.

Is this the first time you’ve threatened legal action, followed thru only to be told after much time later that the lawyers don’t feel like your case is or was worth their time?

Too many people these days with big mouths who love to threaten people who work for businesses with legal action over when they don’t get their way.

I am by no means saying that this is or was you.

Any words for those people? In light of your entire experience, I’m curious what your takeaways are and what you’d say to people who have found themselves in a similar situation as you and are considering taking the same route you took.

Kudos to you on whatever your next vehicle ends up being.

Sponsored

 

[viper88]

Is this mainly an issue for some 2018/19 owners? Or are some 2020 model owners still encountering steering issues?

I think some JLs do drive outside of the designed specifications. In other words not normal. I think the actual number is probably very low. There have been recalls and updates. The newer the build the better chances the recalls were done.

I own a '19 JLR that is totally stock with no modifications. The only thing I had done was the steering stabilizer recall. It felt fine but I was in for a oil change and did it out of convenience. The only thing I noticed after the new steering dampener was slightly stiffer steering feel. Nothing life altering. Lowering the tire pressure made a much more noticeable difference.

I have also owned a stock TJ and JK and my JLR is BY FAR the best driving Wrangler I had owned. No issues at highway speeds of 80-85 mph and over bumps. My JLR is MUCH better then my previous TJ and JK.

I think the majority of Wranglers drive within specifications. They drive like they should. The issue is a normal feeling Wrangler will never feel like a car. I think this might be the issue for some complaints? A perfectly flawless Wrangler will not have steering feel or ever drive like another vehicle or car. This is intentional by design. A lot of things contribute to the difference in steering feel between a Wrangler and most vehicles. A Wrangler has a much higher suspension, slower ratio steering box, solid axles, etc. 98% of cars have quicker ratio rack-in-pinion steering and independent front suspension, etc. Most Wrangler tires have a LOT of sidewall height and thicker treads that can contribute to slower steering response and squirm. Most cars and sport SUVs have much lower profile tires. The lower profile has a lot less squirm creates a quicker steering response. The exact opposite of the Wrangler's higher sidewalls. Mix in the difference in steering box / rack-in-pinion design and ratio speed and it will feel drastically different. I guess what I am trying to say is it is unreasonable to expect a Wrangler to feel like a sport SUV or vehicle with rack-in-pinion with lower profile tires.

Then there are the Wranglers that have been lifted and modified improperly. Some of the complaints might be from this group.

My strong advice is to test drive as many Wranglers as you can and see if the unique steering feel is something you can adjust to and get used to. Know that a perfect Wrangler will NOT feel like most other cars and truck. A Rubicon will never feel like a BMW SUV. Again, this is intentional and by design.

I would not hesitate recommending a JL of any year. Just check the tire pressure and test drive it. Hope to see you in the Jeep family one day.

 

[Notorious]

...I have also owned a stock TJ and JK and my JLR is BY FAR the best driving Wrangler I had owned... Lowering the tire pressure made a much more noticeable difference.

I think the majority of Wranglers drive within specifications. They drive like they should.

Frame of reference is everything! Coming from a YJ, currently have a TJ, sat out the JK and jumping into the JL, I was amazed at how refined and well built the stock Wranglers were during my test drive.

For every vehicle made, there will always be some bad apples. It’s unfortunate but it’s inevitable. No one likes to have issues and with the amount of hands that touch the vehicle, things can happen. in instances like this, that’s why there’s the lemon law and buyback measures in place.

But then there’s a whole other group of people who are highly suggestible, exhibit symptoms of OCD and find problems where there are none. Sometimes these people post, sometimes they never log in. But if you suggest that the your perfectly good Wrangler has steering issues, then theirs does too because you said it, it’s on the internet and it must be true! Fake news!

These people’s fake claims take away from legit owners who DO have problems and who DO need to enact the lemon law.

 

[Indio]

I think some JLs do drive outside of the designed specifications. In other words not normal. I think the actual number is probably very low. There have been recalls and updates. The newer the build the better chances the recalls were done.

I own a '19 JLR that is totally stock with no modifications. The only thing I had done was the steering stabilizer recall. It felt fine but I was in for a oil change and did it out of convenience. The only thing I noticed after the new steering dampener was slightly stiffer steering feel. Nothing life altering. Lowering the tire pressure made a much more noticeable difference.

I have also owned a stock TJ and JK and my JLR is BY FAR the best driving Wrangler I had owned. No issues at highway speeds of 80-85 mph and over bumps. My JLR is MUCH better then my previous TJ and JK.

I think the majority of Wranglers drive within specifications. They drive like they should. The issue is a normal feeling Wrangler will never feel like a car. I think this might be the issue for some complaints? A perfectly flawless Wrangler will not have steering feel or ever drive like another vehicle or car. This is intentional by design. A lot of things contribute to the difference in steering feel between a Wrangler and most vehicles. A Wrangler has a much higher suspension, slower ratio steering box, solid axles, etc. 98% of cars have quicker ratio rack-in-pinion steering and independent front suspension, etc. Most Wrangler tires have a LOT of sidewall height and thicker treads that can contribute to slower steering response and squirm. Most cars and sport SUVs have much lower profile tires. The lower profile has a lot less squirm creates a quicker steering response. The exact opposite of the Wrangler's higher sidewalls. Mix in the difference in steering box / rack-in-pinion design and ratio speed and it will feel drastically different. I guess what I am trying to say is it is unreasonable to expect a Wrangler to feel like a sport SUV or vehicle with rack-in-pinion with lower profile tires.

Then there are the Wranglers that have been lifted and modified improperly. Some of the complaints might be from this group.

My strong advice is to test drive as many Wranglers as you can and see if the unique steering feel is something you can adjust to and get used to. Know that a perfect Wrangler will NOT feel like most other cars and truck. A Rubicon will never feel like a BMW SUV. Again, this is intentional and by design.

I would not hesitate recommending a JL of any year. Just check the tire pressure and test drive it. Hope to see you in the Jeep family one day.

Yes I think front live axle and other vehicle factors, can lead to some unrealistic expectations. Trying to control that big heavy front live axle is generally not going to feel the same as an IFS or car suspension.

Also unlike vehicles with highly adjustable suspensions, only toe-in is adjustable on the Jeep? That means Jeep has to get camber/caster etc right every time from the factory. A little off on the axle or other mounting/frame geometry, perhaps throw in some unexpected behavior from the new electric steering system under certain conditions, maybe some folks experience some issues.

I used to own a 1970 CJ-5 with the relatively crummy (and worn) ross roller/cam steering setup. While driving straight down the road, I could turn the wheel back and forth quite a bit, without the Jeep changing direction. Perhaps I got used to it - but in terms of steering I was fine driving slow or at high speed with that CJ5. My CJ7 with power assist saginaw gearbox was fine as well - even 70 mph and no steering shock.

Probably my current TJ is the worst feel, due to having mud terrain 33s. Short of getting a bad egg, I bet JL steering would be fine

 

[Maverick909]

Im sorry for the OP. but i would take that 5 grand and have PSC install the hydro steering kit and get a nice lift changing all the components on the money form jeep that way you dont loose on the trade in and you get much better parts. but thats just me. i hope everything works out of you though

 

[viper88]

Frame of reference is everything! Coming from a YJ, currently have a TJ, sat out the JK and jumping into the JL, I was amazed at how refined and well built the stock Wranglers were during my test drive.

You will LOVE your JL!

It was a HUGE jump in refinement and drivability going from the TJ to the JK. The JK felt like a luxury SUV compared to the TJ. More power, smoother, quieter, etc. In my opinion the jump from JK to JL was huge also. Mostly due to the 8-speed automatic and additional engine choices. Everyone will have their personal engine preference. All are good. I own the 2.0T with eTorque. It's lightyears better and more powerful feeling then my 3.6 JK with the 5-speed automatic. MPG is noticeably improved also. Who would have ever imagined 26 mpg highway from a Rubicon and it's gears?

Hope to see pics of yours soon!

 

[Chance_P]

The "wandering" effect/feeling IS result of the slight "play" in the steering. Jeep characteristic.

Good luck dude

Your posts in this thread did not age well.

 

[Clodmiran]

I think in your case, arbitration will be the correct solution. Because even though it takes more time, the case is studied comprehensively, and the right decisions are made. I also recommend contacting a lawyer who has extensive experience with such cases. Recently found an article https://www.hg.org/legal-articles/4-defense-strategies-with-an-insider-trading-defense-lawyer-62279 and I think the guy who wrote it could tell me what if you turn to him. Good luck!

Sponsored