Just got home from Bronco event...

[GoldenKnight]

I've heard similar stories. Sounds like it might even be awhile before I can get a test-drive.

Mannequin units have already arrived at dealers for test drive purposes.

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[HungryHound]

I can see that, the problem is the massive up charge for those engines. The Broncos will come with better engines standard and once this first run comes out wouldn’t be surprised to see the 3.5 twin turbo/ diesel/ and electric all following suit. I think the better value of the engines trumps the niche wildly expensive other options for the Jeep. Either way like I said I’m sticking with my slow a$$ six speed rubicon as I bought my Jeep to off road not to mall creep or be at Jeep jamborees, which unfortunately is becoming a smaller and smaller part of the jeep purchases.

With the tax credit, the 4xe is cheaper than the regular 2.0 turbo.

 

[Notorious]

Why does it ALWAYS have to be a “competition”? Why not appreciate both very different vehicles for exactly what they are?

will sell for thousands over sticker price for the first couple of years.

Excellent. I hope Ford marks up the shit out of these initially.

 

[Zotch]

 

[Spank]

I'm not an experienced off-road driver, but I've done it before in Land Rovers, Jeeps and, just recently, Nissan Pathfinders. I've gotten used to the apparently physics-defying capabilities of a good four-wheel-drive system and proper off-road tires. But the Bronco seems to genuinely be on another level. It can do things a sane person would never think a four-wheeled vehicle could.

 

[multicam]

“We also drove a variety of Broncos with both optional turbocharged V6 engines, the 270 horsepower base motor and the larger 310 horsepower engine. Both come with standard four-wheel-drive, and, with the smaller engine, a manual transmission is also available with seven speeds, including a low-speed "crawler" gear for off-road.”

???

 

[Nerobergstr]

Not a stupid question at all, yes can handle upgraded wheels and tires. 375hp and 470tq and 33mpg average so far with a fairly loaded Rubicon. With Fed and State rebates I paid $43K before tax and fees.

Someone let me know when a Bronco can beat all those specs for that price and I will buy one.

Actually was thinking about exploring 4xe as well. Tax rebate sweetens the deal quite a lot.

 

[JGlanton]

Reads like he took a Ford marketing highlight sheet handout for journalists and added in a sprinkle of his own experience and a dash of inexperience to bake this sweet cake of Bronco love.

Doesn't the title say it all about what's coming in the body text?

 

[viper88]

Some reviews are trickling in.

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a36856440/2021-ford-bronco-drive/

"CNN Business)The Jeep Wrangler has cornered a very nice slice of the auto market for a long time. But that appears to be over now that the new full-size Ford Bronco has arrived. Based on test drives on road and off, Jeep should be worried." This author admits he is not an experienced off-road driver so take what he reports for what its worth.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/06/28/success/ford-bronco-off-road/index.html

 

[viper88]

Actually was thinking about exploring 4xe as well. Tax rebate sweetens the deal quite a lot.

There might even be a larger tax credit Jan 2022.

 

[multicam]

Didn’t Lordstown Motors have over 100k pre-orders? Pre-order numbers don’t mean shit. Case in point:

I put a deposit on a Bronco. Dealer called a couple weeks ago to tell me it would be 2023 before I got it. Cancelled that deposit and ordered a 4xe.

Using 150k pre-orders as evidence of some level of mystique is a joke. There’s a large portion of the general public who associate jeep with helping to win a fucking World War. People associate the Bronco with OJ Simpson. That ain’t mystique.

The Bronco will sell well- probably for half a decade or more- but I stick by my 2019 prediction: it’ll go the way of the Xterra and FJ eventually. Maybe after the second (reboot) generation.

 

[FJL40]

One needs to ask, “how is it that the Wrangler has been in production since inception without a hiccup?” A Jeep is in a class of it’s own…and nothing in the market right now can compete with it. There use to be several competitors back in the day, but as soon as other manufacturers began dropping body-on-frame designs and solid axles, Jeep kept chugging along. Put reliability aside (as Ford isn’t any better or any worse), there still isn’t a “true-hardcore” 4x4 on the market like the Wrangler. Many have tried, few have prevailed. I’m a first time Wrangler owner, and I wouldn’t look anywhere else. Think it over carefully.

 

[aldo98229]

Jeep dealers, particularly as it relates to the Wrangler, are in a very difficult position.

Think about it. The Wrangler went from a single, proven reliable engine (3.6) sold from 2012-2018 in the JK to:

2.0L with/without eTorque
3.6L with/without eTorque
3.0 Diesel
2.0L + Hybrid (4Xe)
6.4L Hemi V8

Speaking to a very good dealer service manager, they have received virtually no specialized training, and have to learn on the job.

Stelantis dealer support systems is way, way, way behind on the Wrangler.

Indeed.

Add to that, the fact that different JL trims use different grilles, bumpers, fenders, hoods, seats, door trim panels, turn signals, dashboard covers, cup holders, etc., etc., etc. This means dealers have 3 or 4 times as many parts to order from and/or stock in inventory.

Such unnecessary proliferation adds complexity, room for errors, time and cost, and provides little discernible benefits to customers.

Is it any wonder Jeep dealers now need weeks to get parts in...?

My guess is Stellantis is going to streamline much of this nonsense.

 

[gregus73]

IMO the best case scenario is that the Bronco sells gangbusters, prompting GM to enter the fray with basically a smaller version of their new Tahoe, but with actual off-road chops.

Then the three of them spend the next ~5 years competing with each other to make the best off-road capable SUV at the best price.

Ford brings the in-car tech and intelligence and the saddle leather from the King Ranch Edition, Chevy brings actually nice paint options and the comfort/toughness of the Silverado lineup, and Jeep brings the off-road knowhow.

All that for Rubicon-esque package $40K starting and I'm in like sin.

It would be interesting for Chevy or GMC to be in the competition too.
A smaller Tahoe or Jimmy with the half convertible top or full convertible would be nice.
I still prefer the Wrangler over the new Bronco.

 

[DanW]

Indeed, Bob Lutz has the worst track record making any sort of predictions.

I mean no disrespect. He seems to be a swell guy. The media loves Mr. Lutz because of his colorful stories and he is an avid auto enthusiast. But his “predictions” are usually based on little more than personal opinions, which usually are proved wrong.

Among other things, he gave us Chevy SSR, Pontiac Solstice and Saturn Sky. They were good-looking cars but highly impractical and poorly executed. He pushed Cadillac into becoming a full-blown German wanna-be brand. He also famously uttered that hybrids and EVs weren’t going to sell.

Lee Iacocca didn’t have Bob Lutz’s continental pedigree or sophistication, but Lido had a nose to tell from a mile away what would and wouldn’t sell.

Hey, I had a Solstice. An early production 2006. Yes, impractical. But man, was it fun. It actually was a great car. They punched way above their weight in autocross because the balance and handling was outstanding. Put Eagle F1's on it and it pulled skid pad G's comparable to a Vette. I never had an issue with mine and often wish I hadn't sold it. But I wouldn't have a garage big enough if I kept every vehicle I wish I hadn't sold, LOL!

One thing I deeply appreciated about Lutz was that he is 6'4" tall and told the Soltice/Sky chief designer that he'd fire him if he couldn't be comfortable in it. I'm 6'5" tall and I was comfortable, although there wasn't a milimeter to spare.. And flicking through the gears with that 5 speed was like a video game. Nice short throws and great feel. And I thought the car was drop dead gorgeous. The steering was outstanding, too, and I remember braking being very good. It was just a hoot in the twisties. I wish I'd had a chance to take it to the Tail of the Dragon just once. Not a ton of power, but the little 2.4 ran great and was well matched to the tranny. In fact, you can still get that very powertrain.....in a Polaris Slingshot, of all things! Lol!

Indeed.

Add to that, the fact that different JL trims use different grilles, bumpers, fenders, hoods, seats, door trim panels, turn signals, dashboard covers, cup holders, etc., etc., etc. This means dealers have 3 or 4 times as many parts to order from and/or stock in inventory.

Such unnecessary proliferation adds complexity, room for errors, time and cost, and provides little discernible benefits to customers.

Is it any wonder Jeep dealers now need weeks to get parts in...?

My guess is Stellantis is going to streamline much of this nonsense.

Actually, the entire industry is experiencing parts issues right now. In fact, there's a shortage of whole Jeeps due in part to high demand.

Think Ford is doing better? Those with Bronco orders with hard tops are being told not to expect delivery until 2023. I'm betting a number of those 150k ordered will not wind up accepting delivery.

And btw, 150k is healthy demand, but still about a hundred grand short of 1 year of Wrangler production.

Ford has taken several major stumbles out of the gate. They can't afford many more.

The latest in this mess for Ford? Now a soft top supply shortage thanks to the demand caused by no hard tops. So yes, it is now in production, but it is very slow at the moment.

Btw, I'm not trying to dog on Ford. A healthy Ford is good for America, so I'm hoping they get this thing right.

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