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Just got home from Bronco event...

ThirtyOne

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Where Jeep wins: Customization. The ability to make it your own. I may be proven wrong, but I don't see how you can customize a Bronco to the extent that you can customize a Jeep Wrangler. That puts Jeep ahead of Bronco for those that want something tough and unique.
Yeah. You can’t even get an Angry Grill for the Bronco.
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DanW

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Where Jeep wins: Customization. The ability to make it your own. I may be proven wrong, but I don't see how you can customize a Bronco to the extent that you can customize a Jeep Wrangler. That puts Jeep ahead of Bronco for those that want something tough and unique.
They'll move pretty quickly on that, but Jeep has literally decades of head start in aftermarket industry support.

I'm waiting for someone to show me an actual Sasquach window sticker that shows this fantasy of a lower price. Sure, on paper you can spec that out. But it ain't going to happen in the real world. And if it did, Jeep has PLENTY of markup built into the Wrangler to throw incentives and discounts in to keep sales up.

Besides that, Ford had almost 3 years to dissect the JL. If they didn't improve on some things, shame on them. Funny, though. All Jeep has to do is put a small lift and 35's on the Wrangler and the off-road stats put it back into 1st place. That doesn't sound like Jeep playing catch up. It sounds more like Jeep making an easy chess move that was set up several turns ago.
 

Steve JLUR

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The only problem is, reviews are calling the Bronco extremely capable off road, maybe better than the Wrangler... Then going on to state the Wrangler may be better ON the road than the Bronco. Honestly just one review I read like that but given that review you may have it all a little backwards...

I bought a Rubicon. It has about 1500 miles on it now. It has been off road for a couple of full days. I have used low range, the lockers and the swaybar disconnect. I will definitely be looking closer at the Bronco as Ford gets their production issues fixed mostly because I think it will simply be a better quality vehicle all around. I will use it's features. Of course I always tracked my sports cars as well...
There are provably better super cars out there than Porsches and Ferraris, but those two companies keep selling all they can make. You know why? Because they are aspirational purchases, just as Jeep Wranglers are. When Ford builds the mystique Jeep has around the Bronco, then we will see some reversal of fortune for Jeep. Until then spec sheet comparisons mean Jack Sh*t.
 

Suspect

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Spot-on. Watch the full video of Broncos trying to get through Devil's Hot Tub in Moab. That'll say everything about why IFS can't hang with solid axles off-road. And the Bronco had a professonal off-road driver and an engineer on board.

It's going to be a great vehicle, I'm sure. But there's no way to make up for the disadvantage of IFS compared to a solid front axle.

One of the most respected Overlanders in the world, Andrew St. Pierre White, made a long YouTube video absolutely lambasting Land Rover for going with independent suspension on the new Discovery. Ripped them a new one. In the video, he talks on and on about why solid axles at both ends are superior off-road. And he isn't at all into rock crawling or extreme obstacles. He's just talking overlanding on dirt roads and trails. There are very few vehicles today with solids at both ends. He's praised Jeep over and over for sticking with it. Along with some Toyota models that you can't get Stateside. Right now, he's running a new build on an old Land Rover. With solid axles.
100 percent agree. If I’m on a trail and I have wheels in the air because I went over a mild obstacle that’s totally unacceptable when I can have a vehicle with solid axles and avoid that entirely. I’m not even going to entertain people who argue that ifs is just as good or can do 90 percent of what a solid axle can do. The curbs at the mall will probably get close to lifting a wheel on the bronco
 

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Ridgway Jeeper

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There are provably better super cars out there than Porsches and Ferraris, but those two companies keep selling all they can make. You know why? Because they are aspirational purchases, just as Jeep Wranglers are. When Ford builds the mystique Jeep has around the Bronco, then we will see some reversal of fortune for Jeep. Until then spec sheet comparisons mean Jack Sh*t.
Funny because most people I know don't think much of Jeeps. I caught a lot of heck for finally giving in to my wifes wants, officially the Jeep mystique. Having owned several G-Wagens and a UNIMOG as well as dozens of other 4x4's I am aware that Jeep mostly trades on mystique rather than real honest function.

I have owned and raced several Porsches and can tell you there isn't much better road capable car on the track. Two summers ago I drove a Ferrari 488 spider all day on the Italian autostrda. I took the factory tour, parked inside the fabled gates, visited the museums. That brand is surrounded by a well earned mystique IMO. Fun comparison though!

If 150,000 orders for a vehicle not on the lots isn't substantial mystique, you might not be paying attention....
 

MARSHMELLA

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Funny because most people I know don't think much of Jeeps. I caught a lot of heck for finally giving in to my wifes wants, officially the Jeep mystique. Having owned several G-Wagens and a UNIMOG as well as dozens of other 4x4's I am aware that Jeep mostly trades on mystique rather than real honest function.

I have owned and raced several Porsches and can tell you there isn't much better road capable car on the track. Two summers ago I drove a Ferrari 488 spider all day on the Italian autostrda. I took the factory tour, parked inside the fabled gates, visited the museums. That brand is surrounded by a well earned mystique IMO. Fun comparison though!

If 150,000 orders for a vehicle not on the lots isn't substantial mystique, you might not be paying attention....
The Jeep is within reach of most people. Those other vehicles you mentioned are not.
If they were, they might be on par with the legendary Jeep brand.
Also, those Offroad vehicles you mention don’t have a removable top. It’s hard to beat a convertible Offroad beast.
And finally, the Jeep is attached to the American dream. It doesn’t get more nostalgic than a Jeep. Murcia!!! :flag:
 

ThirtyOne

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Been watching videos of the Bronco in action.

looks like a great vehicle if you lionly 3 wheels on the ground.

also saw one that had a really nice looking interior. I need to see if i can find a picture. So i guess it really depends on trim level.

edit:here’s the picture. Definitely better than what i sat in.



the ignition chime sounds like a cheap rental car. Really bad.
Jeep Wrangler JL Just got home from Bronco event... 354CE2E7-7B2C-427F-A1E6-B0D80E24DC23
 

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Ridgway Jeeper

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The Jeep is within reach of most people. Those other vehicles you mentioned are not.
If they were, they might be on par with the legendary Jeep brand.
Also, those Offroad vehicles you mention don’t have a removable top. It’s hard to beat a convertible Offroad beast.
And finally, the Jeep is attached to the American dream. It doesn’t get more nostalgic than a Jeep. Murcia!!! :flag:
The Jeeps on my dealers lot were all 50-60k and a 392 is $20k more than that at least. For that money I would take a used "anything on my list" thanks

Those vehicles I mention are both available as convertibles

Attached to the American dream... probably why people used to buy so many Harleys too, another "less than impressive" thing some people seem to long for.

I left my expensive toys behind and changed my lifestyle, can't really afford to run in those circles anymore, which I am OK with. Having done so though I understand the differences. You might have to experience them for yourself to believe it or just go on thinking Jeeps are somehow special I guess.

Obviously time for me to just bite my tongue... Flame suit on
 

DanW

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Funny because most people I know don't think much of Jeeps. I caught a lot of heck for finally giving in to my wifes wants, officially the Jeep mystique. Having owned several G-Wagens and a UNIMOG as well as dozens of other 4x4's I am aware that Jeep mostly trades on mystique rather than real honest function.

I have owned and raced several Porsches and can tell you there isn't much better road capable car on the track. Two summers ago I drove a Ferrari 488 spider all day on the Italian autostrda. I took the factory tour, parked inside the fabled gates, visited the museums. That brand is surrounded by a well earned mystique IMO. Fun comparison though!

If 150,000 orders for a vehicle not on the lots isn't substantial mystique, you might not be paying attention....
Bronco stole its mystique from the International Scout. Ripped it right off. But wait....I forgot about OJ. So I maybe I'm wrong. (So this is now the 2nd time in Bronco history that it completely benchmarked a competing vehicle that was first to the market.)

Whatever mystique the Ford has won't make up for IFS when off the pavement.

And 150k pre-orders is indeed impressive. But sustainability is something that only time will tell. Time has already spoken on the Jeep. Record sales after over 75 years on the market and decades at the top of the resale value charts is a track record that few, outside of full size pickups, can match. But I'm betting that at least for now, there is plenty of room in the market for both vehicles, and the competition will be healthy. No shortage of parking spots at the mall for either one.

And I don't think the G-Wagon is the measure of honest function. The location of its exhaust pipes screams Madison Avenue and doesn't even utter a murmer of the Rubicon Trail without the scary thought of ripping its side steps off. Mercedes own website doesn't even dare to compare Wrangler and G-Wagon's off-road stats, so it sticks to its territory and compares engines, towing capacity, cargo volume, and infotainment display. Of course, they left out the price tag comparison, as it is probably the only vehicle that makes a Wrangler look like a bargain. And Unimog? I'm a bit flummoxed as to how that has anything to do with the price of fish in Denmark, but ok. (I did notice that Mercedes didn't put the 392 in their comparison with the G-Wagon. I wonder why?)
 

cwsbbb

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Living in Australia there is no chance of seeing a Bronco in person for a long time yet but a few things I like better based on YouTube videos are

  • Frameless doors
  • Windows on body
  • Rubber mats integrated into trunk
  • Freedom panels over back seats
  • No b pillar
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