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Issues with Steersmarts Tie Rod

OP
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Spank

Spank

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Correct, 1/2 degree (.5). Have them adjust it to 1/2 degree and let me know. Doesn't sound like much, but I think you'll find it resolves the undesirable driving experience you're having now.
Okay. I'll try and get it reinstalled this weekend and take it back.

Also, wasn't asking questions in an accusatory fashion, I'm just direct, so I apologize if it came off that way.
No need to apologize. I wasn't suggesting as such, nor am I complaining that I couldn't run it without one. I just want to be clear on what I have and haven't done in trying to get this all figured out.
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SS_AP

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Okay. I'll try and get it reinstalled this weekend and take it back.

No need to apologize. I wasn't suggesting as such, nor am I complaining that I couldn't run it without one. I just want to be clear on what I have and haven't done in trying to get this all figured out.
Sounds good - let me know what you find when you get it put back on and setup.

Appreciate the understanding - text can come off as being short sometimes, and I didn't want you to feel that way.
 

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I noticed a bit of confusion between you guys. Spank had it toed-IN .5° and steer smarts says toed-OUT .5°. Researching on this forum has resulted in toed-IN .5° as being the maximum point in the +/- tolerance range. Not at all nit-picking, just wanting to clarify because the SS track/tie/drag combo is part of my very near future project beef-up.

Thanks and looking forward to reading that spank and others get all sorted out.
 

SS_AP

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I noticed a bit of confusion between you guys. Spank had it toed-IN .5° and steer smarts says toed-OUT .5°. Researching on this forum has resulted in toed-IN .5° as being the maximum point in the +/- tolerance range. Not at all nit-picking, just wanting to clarify because the SS track/tie/drag combo is part of my very near future project beef-up.

Thanks and looking forward to reading that spank and others get all sorted out.
I've been talking with the OP and I'm pretty sure we've gotten things figured out.

Yes, the industry as a whole recommends .5˚ of toe-in. From the studies that we've conducted, we find that .5˚ of toe-out is what works the best with our products, as well as with countering any type of potential death wobble situation. Everyone is entitled to set things up however they see fit, but our recommendations are not just pulled out of thin air, they come for studies and research that we've done with setting the vehicles up in different ways.

To clarify, this is .5˚ total, not per side. If you're doing the tape measure technique at home, you want between 1/8" and 3/16" toe-out (.32˚ & .48˚)
 

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I've been talking with the OP and I'm pretty sure we've gotten things figured out.

Yes, the industry as a whole recommends .5˚ of toe-in. From the studies that we've conducted, we find that .5˚ of toe-out is what works the best with our products, as well as with countering any type of potential death wobble situation. Everyone is entitled to set things up however they see fit, but our recommendations are not just pulled out of thin air, they come for studies and research that we've done with setting the vehicles up in different ways.

To clarify, this is .5˚ total, not per side. If you're doing the tape measure technique at home, you want between 1/8" and 3/16" toe-out (.32˚ & .48˚)
Damn, that was quick! Thanks, Andy!

Another quick question or two. I'm stock at the moment and haven't had any steering issues at all. I'm planning a 2" lift on 35" ko2's, 8 adjustable control arms, adjustable rear track bar, and your yeti track/tie/drag combo (just want everything beefed up). Would you still recommend the .5° combined toe-out if the steering remains as great or greater? Also, are you planning on bringing a rear track bar to market?

Thanks again!
 

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I noticed a bit of confusion between you guys. Spank had it toed-IN .5° and steer smarts says toed-OUT .5°. Researching on this forum has resulted in toed-IN .5° as being the maximum point in the +/- tolerance range. Not at all nit-picking, just wanting to clarify because the SS track/tie/drag combo is part of my very near future project beef-up.
The confusion was all me. I clearly missed the mark on what the toe should've been beforehand.

Thanks and looking forward to reading that spank and others get all sorted out.
I had it towed in and out all over the place throughout my testing. Granted, I don't have spiffy computer alignment technology handy in my garage, but I'm pretty sure I had it close to half a degree out somewhere along the line before I took it to the alignment shop the first time. I just didn't know that was the sweet spot. I was more focused on stock specs and matching the OEM tie rod the entire time. It also didn't help that I screwed up a second time and told the shop to do half a degree on each wheel.

Another interesting thing was the first alignment shop showed a huge issue with camber on my front wheels. I don't know if that value affects overall calculations and adjustments when working on toe, but when I took it to a different shop to get the proper half degree toe dialed in, my camber beforehand was fine.

Another issue that screwed me up was apparently my tires weren't balanced properly, even though I had that done just days before installing the parts. The combination of getting the toe correct and another tire rotation fixed virtually everything. I'm still getting a slight pull to the left, but I've got a feeling part of that is the pressure from the Fox SS (the SS relocation bracket sets that up the same way it was on the JK, mounted from the trackbar bracket to the center of the tie rod). My Jeep tracks straight generally most of the time and just minor adjustments at the wheel keep it centered as opposed to constantly having to hold the wheel to the right when it kept seriously pulling left.

I've been talking with the OP and I'm pretty sure we've gotten things figured out.
And again, Thank you for the back and forth in getting this literally and figuratively straightened out. The support has been fantastic. I'm sure getting proper control arms and a rear adjustable trackbar will help clean things up even more.
 

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Damn, that was quick! Thanks, Andy!

Another quick question or two. I'm stock at the moment and haven't had any steering issues at all. I'm planning a 2" lift on 35" ko2's, 8 adjustable control arms, adjustable rear track bar, and your yeti track/tie/drag combo (just want everything beefed up). Would you still recommend the .5° combined toe-out if the steering remains as great or greater? Also, are you planning on bringing a rear track bar to market?

Thanks again!
Yes I would.

We are and hopefully they’ll be available by the end of the year. We had to revise the manufacturing process which required a setup change which takes 12 weeks.


The confusion was all me. I clearly missed the mark on what the toe should've been beforehand.



I had it towed in and out all over the place throughout my testing. Granted, I don't have spiffy computer alignment technology handy in my garage, but I'm pretty sure I had it close to half a degree out somewhere along the line before I took it to the alignment shop the first time. I just didn't know that was the sweet spot. I was more focused on stock specs and matching the OEM tie rod the entire time. It also didn't help that I screwed up a second time and told the shop to do half a degree on each wheel.

Another interesting thing was the first alignment shop showed a huge issue with camber on my front wheels. I don't know if that value affects overall calculations and adjustments when working on toe, but when I took it to a different shop to get the proper half degree toe dialed in, my camber beforehand was fine.

Another issue that screwed me up was apparently my tires weren't balanced properly, even though I had that done just days before installing the parts. The combination of getting the toe correct and another tire rotation fixed virtually everything. I'm still getting a slight pull to the left, but I've got a feeling part of that is the pressure from the Fox SS (the SS relocation bracket sets that up the same way it was on the JK, mounted from the trackbar bracket to the center of the tie rod). My Jeep tracks straight generally most of the time and just minor adjustments at the wheel keep it centered as opposed to constantly having to hold the wheel to the right when it kept seriously pulling left.



And again, Thank you for the back and forth in getting this literally and figuratively straightened out. The support has been fantastic. I'm sure getting proper control arms and a rear adjustable trackbar will help clean things up even more.
You’re welcome - I knew that there had to be something else going on and I’m glad we got it resolved.
 

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@SS_AP if one has a Yeti tie rod, RK track bar but a stock drag link, do you still recommend .5° toe out? Was waiting to do the drag link later.
 

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One thing i noticed aligning the center point of my axles with adjustable track bars was the amount of preload.

The jeep wants to sit uneven.

It was most noticeable doing the rear without the aid of the steering wheel.
I needed my wife to push on the drivers side rear to get the bolt to line up.

I don't have enough time behind the wheel to see any unusual side effects of this yet.
 

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@SS_AP if one has a Yeti tie rod, RK track bar but a stock drag link, do you still recommend .5° toe out? Was waiting to do the drag link later.
Just seeing this, sorry - my notifications for this site don't seem to work very well.

We recommend between .35 and .5 degrees of total toe regardless of the other components. The nice thing about something like the posts above or our toe plate alignment kit is that you can fine-tune your toe to your desired feel as everyone has unique setups with different wheel sizes, offsets, etc. All of those things play a factor in the overall driveability over your vehicle, but the above mentioned toe-out specs are what we find works the best
 

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Hello, I have the same exact situation going on. I've been fighting it for over a month. What was the final solution for you?
A month ago I installed a SS drag-link, and tie-rod and started to experience death wobble in my 2018 JLUR 3.5" RK lift on 37" tires (balanced tires 3 times now) and two alignments. I was told that my RK track-bar wasn't good enough and I needed the SS track-bar. Did that it didn't fix it. Next someone suggested a new steering box or get the TSB done for the steel steering box. Did that, didn't fix it.
NOTHING FIX IT UNTIL.
Today I installed my factory tie-rod, factory drag-link, and my RK adjustable track-bar and boom. The wobble is gone. I called Kate at steer smarts and she said that it would be the first time in her career at SS that factory parts fixed a issue over SS parts. Someone explain how this is possible? How do I see a lot of people running SS products on various JL's without issue and I can't run any of it. I've tried the Drag link alone (wobble) I've tried the tie-rod alone (wobble). The only solution is to pull both of them out.
 

rayzjeep

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Hello, I have the same exact situation going on. I've been fighting it for over a month. What was the final solution for you?
A month ago I installed a SS drag-link, and tie-rod and started to experience death wobble in my 2018 JLUR 3.5" RK lift on 37" tires (balanced tires 3 times now) and two alignments. I was told that my RK track-bar wasn't good enough and I needed the SS track-bar. Did that it didn't fix it. Next someone suggested a new steering box or get the TSB done for the steel steering box. Did that, didn't fix it.
NOTHING FIX IT UNTIL.
Today I installed my factory tie-rod, factory drag-link, and my RK adjustable track-bar and boom. The wobble is gone. I called Kate at steer smarts and she said that it would be the first time in her career at SS that factory parts fixed a issue over SS parts. Someone explain how this is possible? How do I see a lot of people running SS products on various JL's without issue and I can't run any of it. I've tried the Drag link alone (wobble) I've tried the tie-rod alone (wobble). The only solution is to pull both of them out.
That is very odd. I have the RK track bar, SS tie rod, stock drag link, stock steering stabilizer and I get a tiny bit of shimmy at 55 but not death wobble. Does that mean you'll be unloading a drag link soon?
 

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That is very odd. I have the RK track bar, SS tie rod, stock drag link, stock steering stabilizer and I get a tiny bit of shimmy at 55 but not death wobble. Does that mean you'll be unloading a drag link soon?
I know right!

I plan on sending these parts to SS to be inspected. After that I might keep them for a 1 ton axle swap planned this winter and see if they work for me then.
 

rayzjeep

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I know right!

I plan on sending these parts to SS to be inspected. After that I might keep them for a 1 ton axle swap planned this winter and see if they work for me then.
Post what you find out if you send them in. I'm curious what they say.
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