Is there a true fix for the Steering/Wandering issue?

[Dvol]

People who've installed the PSC system seem very happy.

Their Happiness only cost them price of new Wrangler +3k+ whatever else it took to fix what most folks originally thought they paid for when they purchased their Jeeps...So yeah they seem happy I guess..Some can can’t or some refuse too.

I personally believe fixing FCA’s flawed part or parts is send wrong message that they can get away with crappy customer service and products. I did fix my JkU bad parts but I bought that one used and at almost half of what my JLUR cost me..I kinda wish I had it back lol oh well moving forward now...

I’m sure these issues are a small minority of us but hey no one forced me to buy a wrangler that’s all on me and yes believe it or not I love my Jeep most times..But I’m sure a forced recall/part update is coming..Takes time for big companies to fix their mistakes and save face..Death wobble lawsuit I think may force fixes for all..Hope so

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[GtX]

Their Happiness only cost them price of new Wrangler +3k+ whatever else it took to fix what most folks originally thought they paid for when they purchased their Jeeps...So yeah they seem happy I guess..Some can can’t or some refuse too.

I personally believe fixing FCA’s flawed part or parts is send wrong message that they can get away with crappy customer service and products. I did fix my JkU bad parts but I bought that one used and at almost half of what my JLUR cost me..I kinda wish I had it back lol oh well moving forward now...

I’m sure these issues are a small minority of us but hey no one forced me to buy a wrangler that’s all on me and yes believe it or not I love my Jeep most times..But I’m sure a forced recall/part update is coming..Takes time for big companies to fix their mistakes and save face..Death wobble lawsuit I think may force fixes for all..Hope so

I was just pointing out that there seems to be a fix.

"If you're not changing it, you're choosing it".

 

[GeeBee]

Then how would you explain that only a select few have the problem ?
The expansion would effect all with a aluminum steering box.

The thermal coefficient of steel is half that of aluminium. So in the cold the aluminium housing will shrink in length twice as much as any of the steel components inside.

The theory is that if the box has excess play, the 'contraction' of the alu housing serves to reduce the slop in the system. If you are lucky enough to have a well adjusted box then the alu housing will shrink until all of the available slop is taken out and then the box will take a slight bind but it's not noticeable because the power steering does most of the work for you. If you are unlucky enough to have an over-tight box to start with then you run the risk of the box jamming up completely at colder temperatures i.e. the power steering assist is not enough.

 

[Dvol]

The thermal coefficient of steel is half that of aluminium. So in the cold the aluminium housing will shrink in length twice as much as any of the steel components inside.

The theory is that if the box has excess play, the 'contraction' of the alu housing serves to reduce the slop in the system. If you are lucky enough to have a well adjusted box then the alu housing will shrink until all of the available slop is taken out and then the box will take a slight bind but it's not noticeable because the power steering does most of the work for you. If you are unlucky enough to have an over-tight box to start with then you run the risk of the box jamming up completely at colder temperatures i.e. the power steering assist is not enough.

I wonder how much the fluid that is in these racks plays a big part in the varied feel of the steering. I’m assuming it is a sealed system??? Could also be some poor unskilled worker didn’t use the proper level or wrong type of fluid or adjustments. I also want to see if my steering box moves even tho it’s solid mounted. This wouldn’t be the first time I’ve had to diagnose stuff for the Dealer.

Being a mechanic now a days means you throw parts at the so called issues and hope customers and problems magically go away...That ain’t just a Jeep issue tho....

 

[df007]

Correct, Not if you expect rack&pinion feel steering.

Hmmm. PSC kits are not rack and pinion and they have fixed the slop. JK's were not rack and pinion and there were way less complaints (if any) of slop. Sorry you are just wrong.

 

[Goin2drt]

Their Happiness only cost them price of new Wrangler +3k+ whatever else it took to fix what most folks originally thought they paid for when they purchased their Jeeps...So yeah they seem happy I guess..Some can can’t or some refuse too.

I personally believe fixing FCA’s flawed part or parts is send wrong message that they can get away with crappy customer service and products. I did fix my JkU bad parts but I bought that one used and at almost half of what my JLUR cost me..I kinda wish I had it back lol oh well moving forward now...

I’m sure these issues are a small minority of us but hey no one forced me to buy a wrangler that’s all on me and yes believe it or not I love my Jeep most times..But I’m sure a forced recall/part update is coming..Takes time for big companies to fix their mistakes and save face..Death wobble lawsuit I think may force fixes for all..Hope so

I don’t disagree with your feelings. However you have choices to make. Sure drive an unsafe steering vehicle and “hope” and wait for a fix that may or may not be coming. That is the least expensive option and the least enjoyable and the longest term of a fix. Or folks can stop complaining and stop spending countless hours (which by the way cost money) and pay $3k and be done. I calculated the one guy on here how much time he has spent based on his posts at $30/hr and he could have bought two PSC’s just in his time not to mention other costs like rentals etc that he “hopes” to get recouped. Yes it is a $50k vehicle but people spend $10k in mods. I chalked it up to just another mod. You could also get rid of the Jeep. That also would cost more than a PSC in depreciation let alone folks like me that already modded the Jeep and didn’t keep the stock parts. Not really an option for me.

Those out of principle keep fighting the fight and driving your shitty unsafe Jeep. That is also a valiant and admirable option. Freedom of choice is the best thing we have in this great country. I chose to fix it and start enjoying the Jeep.

Hmmm. PSC kits are not rack and pinion and they have fixed the slop. JK's were not rack and pinion and there were way less complaints (if any) of slop. Sorry you are just wrong.

Correct. You do not need rack and pinion to be fixed. You need a steering box and a electronic box that works. PSC replaces both to yes fix the issue.

 

[Arrowhead]

I don’t disagree with your feelings. However you have choices to make. Sure drive an unsafe steering vehicle and “hope” and wait for a fix that may or may not be coming. That is the least expensive option and the least enjoyable and the longest term of a fix. Or folks can stop complaining and stop spending countless hours (which by the way cost money) and pay $3k and be done. I calculated the one guy on here how much time he has spent based on his posts at $30/hr and he could have bought two PSC’s just in his time not to mention other costs like rentals etc that he “hopes” to get recouped. Yes it is a $50k vehicle but people spend $10k in mods. I chalked it up to just another mod. You could also get rid of the Jeep. That also would cost more than a PSC in depreciation let alone folks like me that already modded the Jeep and didn’t keep the stock parts. Not really an option for me.

Those out of principle keep fighting the fight and driving your shitty unsafe Jeep. That is also a valiant and admirable option. Freedom of choice is the best thing we have in this great country. I chose to fix it and start enjoying the Jeep.

Agreed^^^^^^^^

I have systematically cured my steering woes by replacing the crappy stock parts as they have self destructed over the first 10,000 miles. First was the drag link with prematurely worn joint. Next was the track bar with a prematurely worn bushing. Third was the defective steering stabilizer. Fourth was adjusting out the significant slop in the steering box. I did the work myself and replaced the two links with Synergy, adjusted the box my self but did do the SS under warranty (which they installed upside down and I fix myself in 10 minutes instead of wasting more of my time at the dealer). Being I installed a Rubicon takeoff springs for a 1-1/2" of lift, I also swapped the lower front control arm for the Mopar lift ones to add a little caster. The tie rod seems to be holding up OK so far.

So for just over $600 and a few hours labor I have a rig that handles well and doesn't try to kill me anymore when I look over to adjust the radio. And bonus, the parts I used are way beefier than the stock so I can off road with confidence and can throw bigger lift and tires at it down the road. (Just don't get me started on the rear limited slip that blew up or the radio that randomly resets or the dash and shifter lights that randomly stay on)

 

[df007]

I wonder how much the fluid that is in these racks plays a big part in the varied feel of the steering. I’m assuming it is a sealed system??? Could also be some poor unskilled worker didn’t use the proper level or wrong type of fluid or adjustments. I also want to see if my steering box moves even tho it’s solid mounted. This wouldn’t be the first time I’ve had to diagnose stuff for the Dealer.

Being a mechanic now a days means you throw parts at the so called issues and hope customers and problems magically go away...That ain’t just a Jeep issue tho....

I have ~1" of play and it does reduce in magnitude ~0.25" when cold vs. hot out. This is me rotating the steering column with my hand just ahead of the gearbox and noting how much the SW moves. To me this seems to jive with the mechanical tolerance aspect of the AL housing vs. Steel internals having a thermal sensitivity.

The interesting thing is the "feel" in the play region is very different when cold. It could almost be mistaken for not having any play while driving (but still static play). I think when the fluid is dead cold it increases the damping quite a bit in the gear lash and so light on-center steering does react instead of flopping straight through the gear lash.

So...I imagine if you DON'T have play, it probably won't feel that temp sensitive if my theory is true. BUT if you have a tight enough box the mechanical aspect can bite you at some point with the "steering lock up" issues we also hear about on the JL.

It seems like you got to have the Goldilocks setup on one of these boxes and if they miss it it's not good. Now all that said, this is just about the play issues...not for those that have tight steering and have the wandering.

 

[Rdmitch]

I don’t disagree with your feelings. However you have choices to make. Sure drive an unsafe steering vehicle and “hope” and wait for a fix that may or may not be coming. That is the least expensive option and the least enjoyable and the longest term of a fix. Or folks can stop complaining and stop spending countless hours (which by the way cost money) and pay $3k and be done. I calculated the one guy on here how much time he has spent based on his posts at $30/hr and he could have bought two PSC’s just in his time not to mention other costs like rentals etc that he “hopes” to get recouped. Yes it is a $50k vehicle but people spend $10k in mods. I chalked it up to just another mod. You could also get rid of the Jeep. That also would cost more than a PSC in depreciation let alone folks like me that already modded the Jeep and didn’t keep the stock parts. Not really an option for me.

Those out of principle keep fighting the fight and driving your shitty unsafe Jeep. That is also a valiant and admirable option. Freedom of choice is the best thing we have in this great country. I chose to fix it and start enjoying the Jeep.


Correct. You do not need rack and pinion to be fixed. You need a steering box and a electronic box that works. PSC replaces both to yes fix the issue.

Except from what I have understood from others, the PSC kit solves the loose steering...not the wandering. I believe these a two separate issues.

 

[Dvol]

I don’t disagree with your feelings. However you have choices to make. Sure drive an unsafe steering vehicle and “hope” and wait for a fix that may or may not be coming. That is the least expensive option and the least enjoyable and the longest term of a fix. Or folks can stop complaining and stop spending countless hours (which by the way cost money) and pay $3k and be done. I calculated the one guy on here how much time he has spent based on his posts at $30/hr and he could have bought two PSC’s just in his time not to mention other costs like rentals etc that he “hopes” to get recouped. Yes it is a $50k vehicle but people spend $10k in mods. I chalked it up to just another mod. You could also get rid of the Jeep. That also would cost more than a PSC in depreciation let alone folks like me that already modded the Jeep and didn’t keep the stock parts. Not really an option for me.

Those out of principle keep fighting the fight and driving your shitty unsafe Jeep. That is also a valiant and admirable option. Freedom of choice is the best thing we have in this great country. I chose to fix it and start enjoying the Jeep.


Correct. You do not need rack and pinion to be fixed. You need a steering box and a electronic box that works. PSC replaces both to yes fix the issue.

I appreciate your opinion and others input. Just to be clear there is no feelings here. Just my opinions and experiences so far. I have considered just buying stuff over a few months and fixing it myself like i did with my JK. Sometimes opinions can change and reconsider the options we all have. I never would have heard of this PSC stuff without reading complaints and opinions here so its all good..Hope all have a Blessed and Merry CHIRSTmas!

 

[Goin2drt]

Except from what I have understood from others, the PSC kit solves the loose steering...not the wandering. I believe these a two separate issues.

Absolutely not true. Fact it fixed mine 100%.

 

[Rdmitch]

Absolutely not true. Fact it fixed mine 100%.

That’s great news and I’m thrilled to hear it!
No one else here has chimed in that it helped and I’m seriously considering the kit, pending
the outcome of my current legal issue with FCA. I am glad there is still a possible means to
resolve the issue since I don’t seem to have a “loose” steering issue, only excessive and uncontrollable wandering.

 

[Goin2drt]

That’s great news and I’m thrilled to hear it!
No one else here has chimed in that it helped and I’m seriously considering the kit, pending
the outcome of my current legal issue with FCA. I am glad there is still a possible means to
resolve the issue since I don’t seem to have a “loose” steering issue, only excessive and uncontrollable wandering.

I believe @thadius65 is also a happy camper. I’ll let him chime in.

 

[mysto]

I have a new off-the-wall theory, what if some wire associated with the stock steering assist has it's polarity reversed? Pushing when it should be pulling, or sensing left when turned right. I'm not sure how to test it but just a thought, a bad wiring harness rather than a bad steering box. PSC replaces the assist completely, thus fixing that particular wandering cause.

I still also really like the steering fluid theory, absolutely explains cold weather behavior and the variability of experience.

As usual in life, there are multiple symptoms, and multiple causes for each symptom, leading to confusion when looking for "the" fix.

 

[thadius65]

So I posted some comments in another thread on steering issues, but count me as one of the owners that got sick of the poor steering and fully believe that FCA/JEEP is never going to fix. I have friends and peers that have been to the shop 5+ times and in some cases things got worse. I love every aspect of my 2020 JLUR except the steering (and front defrost). I am now 4 days on my PSC Overlander Kit (SK500) and I am very happy. Angry I had to spend $2560 for the SK500 and install, but I can tell you that the play in my steering and it wandering is completely gone. The feel is a little lighter, but that is because I am on stock 33's. I plan on putting a Teraflex 2.2 adjustable steering stabilizer on this week and think on firm I will be perfect for highway.

To each their own, but now I can enjoy myself. Not happy about the money out of pocket, but that feeling will vanish soon.

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