Is the JL generation history in the making?

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Er...how is that done on an electric vehicle?
Or does she own a hybrid that also burns petrol?

You plug in when you get home, and it warms up when you schedule it to.

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[erickdiaz019]

"...is this going to make Jeep more sloppy in reliability because of the added pressure to make a better product for the next gen wrangler?"

I'm trying to reconcile "better product" with "sloppy in reliability." Is the idea that in trying to make a better product they will in fact make a worse product?

My idea was making a worse product due to added pressures to get something new to market faster. I.e. maybe tighter deadlines in order to get a dominant design out there sooner

 

[old mike]

The ICE will finally be dead a few months after they install plenty of fast charging stations in Beatty, Nevada, and other remote towns like it. The longer range EVs are great; but, it's really not about the range or the power/torque or the acceleration. It's about the having the right fuel, in this case the right kind of electricity, in the right places when you need it and Wranglers and the Wrangler lifestyle are actually the weathervane for the concept.

The EVs are relatively easy. It's the charging stations and their distribution, both quality and quantity, that are the enabling factor. EVs are already the better option in many metropolitan areas and as vehicles that are used within their range during the day and returned to a home base charger at night; but, that's not how everyone, especially in the Thankfully Empty West, uses their vehicle.

 

[Heimkehr]

You plug in when you get home, and it warms up when you schedule it to.

I wasn't aware of such a feature. Neat!

 

[wcjeep]

Our 2021 JL 2dr sport is two months old. Bought it with 11 miles. It's developed a squeak/rattle in the dash. The transfer case takes some effort to engage 4wd. No offroad time yet for the JL. My 5yr old 4runner TRD Offroad has seen lots of beach and fire roads. Zero squeaks or rattles. The 4runner manual transfer case is smooth and easy every time. Jeep quality is not near Toyota.

My 93' YJ 4wd engagement is also easy. However, it spends most of its life in 4low.

 

[displayname]

600 miles? Are you serious? My 2019 JLR can barely get 300 miles on a good tank. Electric can charge every night, or at work should your job provide that. 600 miles? Really? How often does anyone drive 600 miles without stopping?

There was a time when the idea of a cell phone fitting in your pocket AND having a 2 day charge was a pipe dream. Now it’s common

I think that the US economy and auto industry are so dependent on oil that for ICE to be fully phased out of consumer vehicles, it needs to do more than match the convinces of gas, it needs to surpass it. I think if we see car batteries and electrical delivery developed at the same rate at cell phone technology, then I think a 600 mile EPA rated car is in range in the future. That would allow for lifted Wranglers with 37 and a Ford Lightning towing a loaded trailer to actually get a usable 300 miles on road.

Based on limited towing info I’ve read on electric vehicles like the Rivian towing, it takes a major hit on range. Like needing a charge every 100 miles. So yes, I do think to fully replace consumer ICE we’ll need to hit a 600mile-ish EPA electric range.

Until then, I’m actually surprised we aren’t seeing more PHEV options like the 4xe. That solution actually feels much more transitional to get consumers comfortable with EVs at scale though this progressive transition.

 

[LooselyHeldPlans]

The internal combustion engine will die. Not by 2025, probably not even by 2035, but it will die.

Define “die”. V8s in new half-ton and below vehicles has decreased probably 90%. I’d say they’re dead.

Follow a similar definition and I’d bet ya $10 (hold me to it, I plan on hanging around here) we see the death of ICE by 2035 if China doesn’t nationalise its auto industry (which is dominated by non Asian brands).

I think we are in a technologically transitional epoch of automobile reliability rather than the culmination of multiple generations of incremental refinement.

Agreed. This is why I’m so excited about Tesla (and maybe apple’s) software contributions.

Shudder. I don't want my car to plan my trip for me. What ever happened to individualism and taking a "short-cut" which takes an hour longer.

Oh good Lord. The individualism argument always perplexes me.

But technology marches on and I welcome it. I plan to keep my JL Rubi forever, but once it's paid off, the next daily-driver car is absolutely going to be electric. That's the future and I'd rather embrace it than try to fight it for nothing but nostalgia. ICE, like horses, will be a hobbyist pursuit and that's fine.

Exactly the same here. After I buy a house in ‘22 or ‘23, the JL will be paid off in ‘24… then I’m getting a Tesla (based on how the market looks right now).

Long Term I’m thinking about an electric conversion in a LJ.

 

[RedundanT]

The JL is "better" than previous gens in many aspects yes. However I will never miss the 3.6L, which is a decent engine in a small car, but abysmal in a Wrangler. Peak torque is barely higher than the superbly crappy 3.5L, yes it has more HP but I'm not crawling trails at 6000 rpm. Frankly I can't wait for this mini-van engine to go away. Ford uses turbos because they work, I fear though we will NOT see that turbo inline 6 in a Wrangler unless it's used to replace the 392.

 

[Zandcwhite]

600 miles? Are you serious? My 2019 JLR can barely get 300 miles on a good tank. Electric can charge every night, or at work should your job provide that. 600 miles? Really? How often does anyone drive 600 miles without stopping?

The lucid aire is already available with a 500 mile range, I don't think 600 is that far off. On average we take 5-6 road trips a year where 600 miles between charges would be very nice. Obviously you don't need anywhere near that range for a commuter car. When talking electric Jeeps, there's a real possibility you'll be nowhere near a power source for days. It's easy to throw a Jerry can or 2 on the jeep and extended the range by 150 miles, EV's won't have that so they better have a huge range for an off road vehicle. Maybe solar hood and/or roof panels to ease the range anxiety that I think we will all have when venturing off the beaten path? The aren't efficient enough to charge the vehicle on a regular basis, but if camping 2 extra days could add the range to get to a charger that would help ease the worry.

 

[Zandcwhite]

There was a time when the idea of a cell phone fitting in your pocket AND having a 2 day charge was a pipe dream. Now it’s common

I think that the US economy and auto industry are so dependent on oil that for ICE to be fully phased out of consumer vehicles, it needs to do more than match the convinces of gas, it needs to surpass it. I think if we see car batteries and electrical delivery developed at the same rate at cell phone technology, then I think a 600 mile EPA rated car is in range in the future. That would allow for lifted Wranglers with 37 and a Ford Lightning towing a loaded trailer to actually get a usable 300 miles on road.

Based on limited towing info I’ve read on electric vehicles like the Rivian towing, it takes a major hit on range. Like needing a charge every 100 miles. So yes, I do think to fully replace consumer ICE we’ll need to hit a 600mile-ish EPA electric range.

Until then, I’m actually surprised we aren’t seeing more PHEV options like the 4xe. That solution actually feels much more transitional to get consumers comfortable with EVs at scale though this progressive transition.

The problem with PHEV's is complexity. The beauty of a true EV is its simplicity. Less wear/maintenance/potential failure items. You get the range adding benefits with the hybrid of gas, but also all the maintenance, wear, heat, etc of a traditional ICE vehicle. Because it has to have both systems, the EV motors and batteries are grossly under sized. You lose any kind of real usable EV range as a result, and the EV performance isn't there either. I'd buy a fully electric wrangler long before a 4xe personally, and my work car is a cmaxx so I have some experience with PHEV's.

 

[Chupacabra]

Think of all the data that Tesla et.al have to sell about you. Apple doesn't make that much selling iPhones, they make the money selling the data the iPhones collect.

Android, sure. I have never seen that Apple makes money selling your data to others though.

 

[displayname]

Android, sure. I have never seen that Apple makes money selling your data to others though.

“Now, however, a research note says that payment is expected to increase to $15 billion in 2021. It also expects the amount to rise in 2022 to as much as $18 billion. While Apple doesn't break out its various sources of services revenue, most analysts believe the Google deal is the most profitable piece of the company's services pie.”
https://www.inc.com/jason-aten/apple-just-traded-your-privacy-for-15-billion.html

 

[LooselyHeldPlans]

The lucid aire is already available with a 500 mile range, I don't think 600 is that far off. On average we take 5-6 road trips a year where 600 miles between charges would be very nice. Obviously you don't need anywhere near that range for a commuter car. When talking electric Jeeps, there's a real possibility you'll be nowhere near a power source for days. It's easy to throw a Jerry can or 2 on the jeep and extended the range by 150 miles, EV's won't have that so they better have a huge range for an off road vehicle. Maybe solar hood and/or roof panels to ease the range anxiety that I think we will all have when venturing off the beaten path? The aren't efficient enough to charge the vehicle on a regular basis, but if camping 2 extra days could add the range to get to a charger that would help ease the worry.

You can get at most 400 watts from the roof and 100 on the hood. I’ve got 6, 50 watt panels waiting to be installed.

At 500w and everything running 100% efficient (normal is a 20% loss) you’d get at most 3kw per day. If the 4xe battery is 17KW hours, that’s 5-6 days to charge the battery.

TFL got 3 miles in real world usage off the 4xe’s 17KW battery.

Charge as you go solar will never make sense under current PV efficiency rates… and we’re pushing the theoretical max on them now. To get any higher will require groundbreaking new tech.

 

[Terpsred]

Save the Manuals! Row gears while we still can. I agree ICE will fade away for newer tech, but Manuals are the dying breed currently.

 

[LarryB]

Er...how is that done on an electric vehicle?
Or does she own a hybrid that also burns petrol?

Yes, I should have stated that. She has a full electric. The warm-up is powered by the power outlet, so it doesn’t even affect her range.

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