Is it possible to just flip the soft top back and drive?

[GreyFox]

The JL interior is sooooo much better than the JK

Yes it is

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[Firemadz]

It’s absolutely ok to do it, despite what some mistakenly believe, just don’t dare use any double negatives...or not.

 

[Ronnie S]

My bad guys I had no idea there were other threads about this. And heated threads at that. I’ll start using the search more often. Well thank you for helping me anyway I really appreciate it.

 

[GreyFox]

My bad guys I had no idea there were other threads about this. And heated threads at that. I’ll start using the search more often. Well thank you for helping me anyway I really appreciate it.

FYI, our search actually sucks donkey balls. Use Google.

 

[Rahneld]

Sometimes I don’t feel like taking all the soft top windows out so is it ok to just flip the first part of the top back and drive? Or will this ruin it?

Ronnie I do this all the time. But prior poster's like @Bryce and @digitalbliss, who simply cannot let go that they are wrong, will tell you it's FCA sanctioned. They continue to disseminate wrong information here on this subject matter.

It's not. @JeepDave got it right. FCA tells you to remove the soft windows first, before riding in Sunrider position, in the one legal defacto standard: the owner's manual. All this means is that if you don't remove these windows, in the unlikely event that bad things happen you, and you alone, are responsible for any repairs if the windows are damaged and any litigation if the windows dislodge and hit other vehicles/motorists/pedestrians.

Those placards @Bryce and @digitalbliss provided, with conflicting instructions (saying soft windows can remain) to the owner's manual say to refer to that manual for further details. Case law in the courts have already repeatedly shown that when 1) conflicting instructions exist, and the 2) conflicting instructions say to refer to the owners manual, and 3) the owner's manual refers to no other manual on vehicle operation (not service,) the owner's manual trumps all else in litigation. Check the bottom of the picture in @digitalbliss' post and how it says to refer to the Owner's manual for complete details. That is one form of the language the courts accept for Owner's manual trumping supporting literature as to accuracy.

A step further, @JeepCares came on the monster prior post of this subject matter to confirm this. And what did naysayer's say...? essentially "what does Jeep Cares know!"

Hopefully this will not turn into another post where people more concerned with not being proven wrong than spreading fact will decent--but if they do, they are wrong--not because I say so, but because FCA, and prior conflicting instruction litigation in the auto industry says so. Corporate attorneys for any auto maker know these landmark cases like the back of their hand.

That litigation is exactly why pretty much every guide to owner operation other than the owner's manual has you refer to the owner's manual. So that if there's conflicting instructions the Owner's Manual (not the User's manual or anything else) trumps all else---except service manuals when it comes to service.

Let the fiction begin!

 

[digitalbliss]

The fact is, Jeep is including these placards in new Jeeps. That is a fact.

 

[Bryce]

Ronnie I do this all the time. But prior poster's like @Bryce and @digitalbliss, who simply cannot let go that they are wrong, will tell you it's FCA sanctioned. They continue to disseminate wrong information here on this subject matter.

It's not. @JeepDave got it right. FCA tells you to remove the soft windows first, before riding in Sunrider position, in the one legal defacto standard: the owner's manual. All this means is that if you don't remove these windows, in the unlikely event that bad things happen you, and you alone, are responsible for any repairs if the windows are damaged and any litigation if the windows dislodge and hit other vehicles/motorists/pedestrians.

Those placards @Bryce and @digitalbliss provided, with conflicting instructions (saying soft windows can remain) to the owner's manual say to refer to that manual for further details. Case law in the courts have already repeatedly shown that when 1) conflicting instructions exist, and the 2) conflicting instructions say to refer to the owners manual, and 3) the owner's manual refers to no other manual on vehicle operation (not service,) the owner's manual trumps all else in litigation. Check the bottom of the picture in @digitalbliss' post and how it says to refer to the Owner's manual for complete details. That is one form of the language the courts accept for Owner's manual trumping supporting literature as to accuracy.

A step further, @JeepCares came on the monster prior post of this subject matter to confirm this. And what did naysayer's say...? essentially "what does Jeep Cares know!"

Hopefully this will not turn into another post where people more concerned with not being proven wrong than spreading fact will decent--but if they do, they are wrong--not because I say so, but because FCA, and prior conflicting instruction litigation in the auto industry says so. Corporate attorneys for any auto maker know these landmark cases like the back of their hand.

That litigation is exactly why pretty much every guide to owner operation other than the owner's manual has you refer to the owner's manual. So that if there's conflicting instructions the Owner's Manual (not the User's manual or anything else) trumps all else---except service manuals when it comes to service.

Let the fiction begin!

So, the velcro straps don't go around the brackets? I never said anything about the windows.

 

[Rahneld]

The fact is, Jeep is including these placards in new Jeeps. That is a fact.

Until you can show us a placard absent of the "refer to the owner's manual for complete details" disclaimer @digitalbliss, FCA can be handing them out with free soda for all the courts care.

FCA will not pay out a dime in damages if it doesn't have to. Case law here is on their side that they won't have to keeping soft windows in while in Sunrider mode causes damages. This has been explained to you a dozen times. You can't manage to even get what is and isn't legally relevant. The fact that these placards are newer perhaps, is equally irrelevant.

Again, I ride with the windows in much of the time.

So--the fact that Jeeps including these is a...wait for it...fact @digitalbliss. ; - )

Please give this a rest. FCA will not say, "you know what, our placard's correct because we actually enjoy being held accountable and paying damages more than law requires us to if your soft windows get or cause damage."

And this is nothing that hasn't already been said a dozen times before to you.

Please come back here with only legally relevant fact, not what you hope is true.

@digitalbliss implying that FCA blesses keeping the windows in, despite this placard, was, is, and always will be wrong for the JL.

What's next @digitalbliss, pictures of FCA execs doing this? A YouTube video of someone's sweet old grandma saying "there, there, it's ok to leave the soft windows in."

Boxing metaphor: for the love of God, stay down for the count.

 

[Rahneld]

So, the velcro straps don't go around the brackets? I never said anything about the windows.

Bryce: the secret to my silence, post fact.

 

[digitalbliss]

Until you can show us a placard absent of the "refer to the owner's manual for complete details" disclaimer @digitalbliss, FCA can be handing them out with free soda for all the courts care.

FCA will not pay out a dime in damages if it doesn't have to. Case law here is on their side that they won't have to keeping soft windows in while in Sunrider mode causes damages. This has been explained to you a dozen times. You can't manage to even get what is and isn't legally relevant. The fact that these placards are newer perhaps, is equally irrelevant.

Again, I ride with the windows in much of the time.

So--the fact that Jeeps including these is a...wait for it...fact @digitalbliss. ; - )

Please give this a rest. FCA will not say, "you know what, our placard's correct because we actually enjoy being held accountable and paying damages more than law requires us to if your soft windows get or cause damage."

And this is nothing that hasn't already been said a dozen times before to you.

Please come back here with only legally relevant fact, not what you hope is true.

@digitalbliss implying that FCA blesses keeping the windows in, despite this placard, was, is, and always will be wrong for the JL.

What's next @digitalbliss, pictures of FCA execs doing this? A YouTube video of someone's sweet old grandma saying "there, there, it's ok to leave the soft windows in."

Boxing metaphor: for the love of God, stay down for the count.

I dont have to prove anything to you, this isnt a court room. People here are grown adults and can choose to follow the placards or ignore them. And to utilize that feature myself, consider yourself ignored.

 

[Rahneld]

I dont have to prove anything to you, this isnt a court room. People here are grown adults and can choose to follow the placards or ignore them. And to utilize that feature myself, consider yourself ignored.

Your not proving anything to me champ. Rather, your spreading fiction here trying to pass the absence of requirement to remove soft windows when the soft top's in Sunrider position of as fact. It's irresponsible. You've been told this many times already the your ideas are false. If I cited the actually court cases you still wouldn't shut up with this garbage. @JeepCares , copied here, has already said you're wrong.

You have an obligation to state something as opinion here when you portray wrong information as fact....much less repeatedly. But please, continue. Have forum members not take you seriously, in which case it won't be you ignoring me, it will be forum members ignoring you.

I'd really like to understand what it is about you that you can't accept that you're wrong here.

 

[JeepDave]

"that settled the issue" !!!!!

Yeah, tongue-in-cheek but, it kinda did settle things as anyone that followed that likely is now so repulsed by the question and are determined to do whatever the heck they want with their windows and don't care what anyone else thinks. I know that's where I'm at.

I got the same don't-take-the-windows-out thing with my Jeep, I believe it came out of the soft-top windows bag package but don't know for sure. I was an early 2019 order so I don't think it is something they put out to correct the manual in "new" Jeeps. But its out there and definitely says to skip taking the windows out (unseen steps 1 & 2).

And last thing I think is that even though JeepCares said "follow the manual" I think they probably tell that to all the guys, meaning I doubt they went off and found some soft-top engineer and got their take on the issue and came back to tell us, yup, the manual has it right. I bet if anybody asks how to do anything they automatically say to refer to the manual, for Rahneld's reasons he's detailed.

I only posted the manual stuff because the OP mentioned the manual, and I thought he'd want to see what it said. So now he can make up his own mind with a little more information.

 

[Ronnie S]

"that settled the issue" !!!!!

Yeah, tongue-in-cheek but, it kinda did settle things as anyone that followed that likely is now so repulsed by the question and are determined to do whatever the heck they want with their windows and don't care what anyone else thinks. I know that's where I'm at.

I got the same don't-take-the-windows-out thing with my Jeep, I believe it came out of the soft-top windows bag package but don't know for sure. I was an early 2019 order so I don't think it is something they put out to correct the manual in "new" Jeeps. But its out there and definitely says to skip taking the windows out (unseen steps 1 & 2).

And last thing I think is that even though JeepCares said "follow the manual" I think they probably tell that to all the guys, meaning I doubt they went off and found some soft-top engineer and got their take on the issue and came back to tell us, yup, the manual has it right. I bet if anybody asks how to do anything they automatically say to refer to the manual, for Rahneld's reasons he's detailed.

I only posted the manual stuff because the OP mentioned the manual, and I thought he'd want to see what it said. So now he can make up his own mind with a little more information.

Well I decided to just try it and go off the new placard. I’ll see how it feels around town around 40-55 mph. If all goes well I’ll try it on the expressway at around 70mph. If I ruin the soft top then screw it I’ll just buy the hard top. Lol!

 

[Jebiruph]

Ronnie I do this all the time. But prior poster's like @Bryce and @digitalbliss, who simply cannot let go that they are wrong, will tell you it's FCA sanctioned. They continue to disseminate wrong information here on this subject matter.

It's not. @JeepDave got it right. FCA tells you to remove the soft windows first, before riding in Sunrider position, in the one legal defacto standard: the owner's manual. All this means is that if you don't remove these windows, in the unlikely event that bad things happen you, and you alone, are responsible for any repairs if the windows are damaged and any litigation if the windows dislodge and hit other vehicles/motorists/pedestrians.

Those placards @Bryce and @digitalbliss provided, with conflicting instructions (saying soft windows can remain) to the owner's manual say to refer to that manual for further details. Case law in the courts have already repeatedly shown that when 1) conflicting instructions exist, and the 2) conflicting instructions say to refer to the owners manual, and 3) the owner's manual refers to no other manual on vehicle operation (not service,) the owner's manual trumps all else in litigation. Check the bottom of the picture in @digitalbliss' post and how it says to refer to the Owner's manual for complete details. That is one form of the language the courts accept for Owner's manual trumping supporting literature as to accuracy.

A step further, @JeepCares came on the monster prior post of this subject matter to confirm this. And what did naysayer's say...? essentially "what does Jeep Cares know!"

Hopefully this will not turn into another post where people more concerned with not being proven wrong than spreading fact will decent--but if they do, they are wrong--not because I say so, but because FCA, and prior conflicting instruction litigation in the auto industry says so. Corporate attorneys for any auto maker know these landmark cases like the back of their hand.

That litigation is exactly why pretty much every guide to owner operation other than the owner's manual has you refer to the owner's manual. So that if there's conflicting instructions the Owner's Manual (not the User's manual or anything else) trumps all else---except service manuals when it comes to service.

Let the fiction begin!

This picture does not deffer to the owners manual. If Jeep wants to claim you have to take the windows out, then they have committed fraud with this picture.

 

[lightsout]

This picture does not deffer to the owners manual. If Jeep wants to claim you have to take the windows out, then they have committed fraud with this picture.

Look FCA is obviously referring to on road use for the No windows disclosure, and I am sure off the record they would tell you it is acceptable to leave windows in up to t a certain speed and especially in slow off road driving conditions, whereas that picture is an off road senario most likely well within the un official limitations of windows in. Clearly their disclaimer is broad in scope, it has to be to cover their asses. Now show us that same picture on the interstate...

it is comical to watch all the arm chair detectives here...

I enjoyed this thread, the forum was getting a little boring and repetative

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