Sponsored

JeepCares

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 1, 2018
Threads
15
Messages
5,093
Reaction score
2,568
Location
Auburn Hills, MI
Vehicle(s)
JL
I agree- there is no reason why a vehicle with 17k miles on it should have a distinctive wobble when going over a tiny bump. Nevertheless, my dealer is not going to replace the crappy aluminum steering box... at least not yet.

I took my Jeep into Discount Tire today, and they found the front wheels were indeed out of balance. After the tires were brought back into balance the wobble is definitely less noticeable- but I still get a slow wobble between 40-45mph when I hit just the right kind of bump. I'm glad I don't have the severe "death wobble" other Jeeps have experienced. Fortunately, my Teraflex Falcon Nexus 2.2 Steering Stabilizer arrived today (plan to install tomorrow a.m.), which should "mask" the defective suspension design FCA put into the JL. Hopefully I'll have no wobble until they decide to replace the steering box (if I have to, I will eventually just purchase the steel box, which I'm sure is what FCA wants).
You need to contact @JeepCares and discuss the unwillingness of the dealer to perform the TSB. That's BS!
Hi @SSinGA - Thank you for tagging us!

@Varilux - Please send our team a private message so that we can discuss your vehicle concerns further. We would be happy to provide additional assistance.

Darlene
Jeep Cares
Sponsored

 

Varilux

Well-Known Member
First Name
Pete
Joined
Dec 29, 2018
Threads
16
Messages
320
Reaction score
682
Location
Hickory Creek, TX
Vehicle(s)
2018 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon
Vehicle Showcase
1
You need to contact @JeepCares and discuss the unwillingness of the dealer to perform the TSB. That's BS!
Thank you for tagging Jeep Cares- I've sent them a PM.
It's very unlikely the steering box is the culprit. Have you followed the steps in the algorithm in the 1st post and performed them?
I've checked the torque on all the fasteners (using the FCA sheet as a reference), have checked to ensure there is no wobble being caused by ball or universal joints, and had the tires rebalanced (which did reduce the intensity of the wobble slightly, but it's still there). I scheduled an appointment to have the alignment checked, but my Jeep dealer talked me out of it- indicating he didn't think the Jeep was out of alignment due to the normal wear of the tires and didn't feel as if the alignment was the cause. The dealer's fix (as mentioned earlier) is to install an adjustable steering stabilizer. My mechanic (who used to install lift kits for my dealer on their new inventory) has checked the geometry of the steering components and says there is nothing there to explain this wobble (it's his opinion the steering box is the culprit).
Hi @SSinGA - Thank you for tagging us!
@Varilux - Please send our team a private message so that we can discuss your vehicle concerns further. We would be happy to provide additional assistance.
Darlene
Jeep Cares
Thank you for your reponse, and PM sent.
 

Whoisalejo

Member
First Name
Alejandro
Joined
Dec 8, 2020
Threads
3
Messages
22
Reaction score
11
Location
SoCal
Vehicle(s)
Wrangler JLU
Hey everyone, just wanted to thank the OP for this fantastic write up! I had death wobble, and i had it bad. My jeep was a CPO 2019 with less than 8k miles on it and has death wobble (quality parts from the factory amiright -_- ) but thanks to this write up my first change was installing a teraflex track bar, i took it for a ride and still had death wobble but the amplitude of the vibrations was down 60%.

I kept following the OPs instructions and figured the next thing was the ball joints, so I picked up the dynatrac HD rebuildable ones and paid a local 4x4 shop for the install.

After that though BOOM death wobble gone. This weekend I took my JLU sport out on a 2hr highway drive up to 90mph on bad socal roads and a few miles on a dirt road and it was solid as a rock.

If you're here for death wobble, it's definitely fixable. It's scary, it sucks, and the factory ball joints are plastic trash, but with some work it too shall pass
 

LazyJL

Well-Known Member
First Name
Larry
Joined
Sep 13, 2020
Threads
2
Messages
129
Reaction score
148
Location
SoCal
Vehicle(s)
2020 Rubicon, 2001 built XJ, 1997 near stock XJ
Occupation
Retired fabricator and mechanic
Jeeps have suffered from DW for decades, it's not just an issue for late models. DW seems to be in the nature of solid front axles
My TJs and XJs, along with a 4X4 Dodge Dakota and a 1959 Ford F100 4X4 have had the problem.
Wheel bearing looseness caused the problem with the Ford and Dakota, the Dakota had a slight amount of play in the driver's side unit bearing...terrible DW.
The Jeeps either had track bar problems or a ball joint was worn enough to cause the DW but not enough wear to be out of specifications when jacking the axle up and checking the ball joint's slop with a dial indicator. Wish there was a faster way of checking the ball joint's preload without major disassembly.
My 2001 XJ had DW at 25,000 miles. An aftermarket track bar with extra-hard bushings set it right.
 

cmb396

Well-Known Member
First Name
Chad
Joined
Apr 6, 2018
Threads
34
Messages
358
Reaction score
316
Location
WV
Vehicle(s)
2018 Crystal Granite JLUR
I haven't seen anything detailed on here providing an algorithm for diagnosing and fixing true DW and felt this method may help save folks alot of time, money and headaches. As parts wear out, this issue seems to eventually affect the majority of solid axle vehicles(especially when lifted) and I waded through ALOT of info dealing with recent DW that ran the full gamut. This included significant time researching, working on it, talking with a dealer, going to 2 offroad shops and talking with several very knowledgeable guys on here to learn how to isolate the root cause. Most know it can be caused by 1 issue or a multitude of issues combined and unfortunately, it seems there are alot of misconceptions and many Jeep owners/dealers/offroad shops don't know how to properly diagnose it and simply give up or blindly start throwing costly new parts at it. Or they resort to blaming the steering stabilizer...when in reality, a properly setup jeep should be able to drive without DW with the steering stabilizer taken off.

At 29k miles, my jeep began experiencing true DW driving 25-45mph over certain pot holes/manhole covers and I had to brake below 5mph or stop the jeep for it to stop. I slowly drove home and retorqued everything and worked with an experienced friend performing steps 1-4 listed below without fixing it. I then tried to ask the lead mechanic at my dealer if he would check ball joints while the jeep was there for yet another electrical issue. The mechanic referred me to a well known local offroad shop(no surprise...it's lifted 2.5" on 37s) and they couldn't find the cause after 3 days and essentially did nothing more than what I had already done and even charged for it.:lipssealed:

I took it to another shop that claimed they would do whatever it took to find the root cause or they wouldn't charge anything. This shop had a different approach and was calculated...it was apparent they had alot more experience working on DW. They treated it like the jeep has a 100% curable disease and they're a physician trying to efficiently and cost effectively isolate the root problem(s) and fix it. They had a checklist for ruling out potential causes beginning with the most common that are the least expensive/easiest to check. They also emphasized the importance of properly inspecting each part because many people unknowingly overlook issues and spend alot more $/time chasing it than should be needed. Below is the algorithm that was used and I will be following in the future:

1. Have a knowledgeable person lay under jeep with someone rocking the steering wheel back and forth from 10 o'clock to 2 o'clock and look closely for movement/slop in the trackbar/draglink/tie rod bushings and then firmly pull on them to see if you get any movement. It's even better to do this with a tire against a curb to add stress to help uncover slop in a bad joint. Pay careful attention to the trackbar joints as it seems to the be the culprit the majority of the time. Also, pull on control arms to see if anything feels loose. If any joints or brackets have movement, inspect further and check mounts/brackets to see if welds look good and nothing is obviously bent/flexing. Retorque or replace as needed and test drive it.

2. With the jeep on the ground, loosen bolts in trackbar/draglink/tie rod and control arms and rock the jeep and then retorque to spec to make sure bolts weren't loose or bound up. Check lugnut torque and grease joints if you have greasable joints and haven't recently. Test drive jeep.

3. Lift each front tire off the ground at the axle and use a pry bar under tire to lift up and check for movement at ball joints. This typically works if ball joints are in very poor shape flopping around. However, you likely won't see movement if the ball joints are moderately bad and arent applying preload to the knuckles like mine and several others have experienced. Ball joints may still be the root cause of DW, so dont rule them out based on this test alone. The 1st offroad shop I took it to stopped at this step and thought they had eliminated ball joints as the cause bc they didn't see any movement and they felt it was unlikely on a 2 year old jeep with 29k miles mainly riding on lightweight wheels and 33" and 35" ko2's. Fully inspecting them requires significant labor removing the brakes & knuckles and is addressed in the last step.

4. Check shocks and steering stabilizer(bolts and compression for consistent compression/extension) and make sure steering box is bolted to frame at proper torque.

5. Have wheels/tires rebalanced dynamically....or better yet, swap on a friends set of wheels/tires.

6. Check alignment and caster.

7. Retorque ball joint castle nuts to spec and insert new cotter pins.

7. Time to start swapping in different steering parts and checking the bolt holes to see if they are wallowed out and then test driving it after each new part. I had my takeoff stock parts available and used them. Begin with trackbar and test drive it...and then draglink, tie rod.

8. If none of that is fixing it, you're narrowing it down to ball joints or steering box with ball joints being much more likely. Time to get serious and have an experienced shop disassemble the brakes/knuckles and check preload on ball joints.(6 hour ish job) The mechanic said my ball joints weren't applying preload on the knuckle, but were not flopping around like you see with ball joints that are completely shot. He said that is a classic sign that the ball joints are the culprit and replaced them with Dana Spicer ball joints and reassembled everything.

With the new ball joints, the jeep drives like new. Very frustrating and drawn out experience....glad it's resolved! :jk:
giphy.com.gif
Great write up, and Go Vols!!
Just got on here to research for a friend that is experiencing DW after going from a 2.5" spacer to 2" Mopar lift, and is frustrated. We will start with this list to diagnose. and btw, are you ChattaVol on Volnation that does the deep and detailed algorithms, charts, and spread sheets on everything football related? lol
 

Sponsored

Varilux

Well-Known Member
First Name
Pete
Joined
Dec 29, 2018
Threads
16
Messages
320
Reaction score
682
Location
Hickory Creek, TX
Vehicle(s)
2018 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon
Vehicle Showcase
1
Just a follow-up on my experience with wobble... The adjustable stabilizer from Teraflex (Falcon 2.2) eliminated the wobble when set to the medium or firm setting- but if placed on the soft setting I would still get some wobble. I have since installed the Teraflex track bar, and can now set the stabilizer to soft without any wobble (although I prefer it set to medium, as it helps reduce the amount of steering correction needed when going over bumps). I am waiting to see if any additional aftermarket ball joints hit the market, and will eventually swap those out as well. I just don't like the idea of having ball joints with plastic internals. I've been wobble-free for over a month now.
 

TakingChances

Member
First Name
Chance
Joined
Feb 6, 2019
Threads
0
Messages
8
Reaction score
1
Location
Georgia USA
Vehicle(s)
2018 JL Wrangler
Man, I have had this Jeep since July 2018 and I am now getting a severe death wobble at 50000 miles. @JeepCares

Any little road bump from 30-55mph causes the Jeep to go out of control. I have to slow down under 30 mph most of the time. This past weekend it wobbled out of control going 65mph on the freeway ramp. I had to slow down to 35 mph and caused some traffic.
It’s becoming severely scary and dangerous to drive the Jeep. It’s happening more and more often now.
My wife’s JL 2018 @ 50000 miles now and is doing the same. Its been hit or miss recently some days it’ll go a month or 2 just fine. Then go to a daily occurrence for a few weeks then back to normal for a while. Local dealers say it’s fixed/can’t replicate after steering stabilizer replacement. But she will get in and it happens right after pulling off the dealer lot.
Also not quite a death wobble but A decent shimmy.

gonna run through this list and check some things out.

Props to the OP for this great write up.
 

billychase1974

Well-Known Member
First Name
Bill
Joined
Dec 17, 2021
Threads
4
Messages
48
Reaction score
13
Location
Shelby, NC
Vehicle(s)
2018 Jeep JLUS
Occupation
Senior Corporate IT Analyst
My wife’s JL 2018 @ 50000 miles now and is doing the same. Its been hit or miss recently some days it’ll go a month or 2 just fine. Then go to a daily occurrence for a few weeks then back to normal for a while. Local dealers say it’s fixed/can’t replicate after steering stabilizer replacement. But she will get in and it happens right after pulling off the dealer lot.
Also not quite a death wobble but A decent shimmy.

gonna run through this list and check some things out.

Props to the OP for this great write up.

Did you find out what was causing that? My 2018 New/Used JL is doing the same. I want to swap out what ever part OEM is bad with aftermarket.
 

TakingChances

Member
First Name
Chance
Joined
Feb 6, 2019
Threads
0
Messages
8
Reaction score
1
Location
Georgia USA
Vehicle(s)
2018 JL Wrangler
Did you find out what was causing that? My 2018 New/Used JL is doing the same. I want to swap out what ever part OEM is bad with aftermarket.
I believe a small part was tires. Just swapped from factory wheels andtires to 35” on 20” black rhinos. To get those to fit I installed a RC 2.5” spacer lift. And new longer Lower control arms. I believe the lower control arms are the key to keep the caster angle correct. I read earlier on that the best angle is between 6-8 degrees.After new LCA I believe that put me in the correct range. Also had a slight bit of toe in after lift install that was corrected at the shop after new tire install.
After all of that the wobble/shimmy is gone and she doesn’t have any issues any more.
Side note I retorqued all the suspension components while I was installing the lift. I wish I would’ve done it in steps to isolate what mine thing fixed the issue but unfortunately I didn’t isolate one thing that fixed it.
 

Doubleaaron

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 18, 2019
Threads
9
Messages
88
Reaction score
53
Location
New Mexico
Vehicle(s)
2019 Rubicon JLU
Just experienced this on the freeway doing around 60mph. 2019 JLUR, stock, 28,000 miles. Scared the crap out of me. Pulled over and it went away at around 25mph.

also have the newer steering gear box (black one)
 

Sponsored

Lohkay

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2018
Threads
12
Messages
112
Reaction score
112
Location
Montreal
Vehicle(s)
JLUR
I guess you can put me in the "fixed by swapping ball joints" category. Everything under is aftermarket (and steel steering box), got death wobble with my summer tires and then again with my winter tires. Checked everything myself and a 4x4 shop did as well but we found nothing besides an out of balance wheel. With the wheel balanced, I didn't get a wobble but was still getting the occasional shimmy.

Even though the ball joints didn't show signs of wear, based on forum feedback, I went and replaced them with the dynatracs. Since then, didn't get a wobble and the shimmy is gone as well.

Also alignment is spot on with 7.5* of caster, I'll probably dial that back since I'm getting a slight front driveshaft vibration at high speeds. Besides, it was only that high cause I was chasing the shimmy issue.
 

BVES4

Active Member
First Name
B
Joined
Jun 9, 2020
Threads
2
Messages
26
Reaction score
14
Location
Springboro, OH
Vehicle(s)
BLACK 2019 Wrangler Unlimited
Just experienced this on the freeway doing around 60mph. 2019 JLUR, stock, 28,000 miles. Scared the crap out of me. Pulled over and it went away at around 25mph.

also have the newer steering gear box (black one)
Happened to me today, normal highway...has it happened again for you?
 

Hartdt

Active Member
First Name
David
Joined
Oct 16, 2018
Threads
4
Messages
36
Reaction score
30
Location
Paducah, KY
Vehicle(s)
2018 Wrangler JLUS
I haven't seen anything detailed on here providing an algorithm for diagnosing and fixing true DW and felt this method may help save folks alot of time, money and headaches. As parts wear out, this issue seems to eventually affect the majority of solid axle vehicles(especially when lifted) and I waded through ALOT of info dealing with recent DW that ran the full gamut. This included significant time researching, working on it, talking with a dealer, going to 2 offroad shops and talking with several very knowledgeable guys on here to learn how to isolate the root cause. Most know it can be caused by 1 issue or a multitude of issues combined and unfortunately, it seems there are alot of misconceptions and many Jeep owners/dealers/offroad shops don't know how to properly diagnose it and simply give up or blindly start throwing costly new parts at it. Or they resort to blaming the steering stabilizer...when in reality, a properly setup jeep should be able to drive without DW with the steering stabilizer taken off.

At 29k miles, my jeep began experiencing true DW driving 25-45mph over certain pot holes/manhole covers and I had to brake below 5mph or stop the jeep for it to stop. I slowly drove home and retorqued everything and worked with an experienced friend performing steps 1-4 listed below without fixing it. I then tried to ask the lead mechanic at my dealer if he would check ball joints while the jeep was there for yet another electrical issue. The mechanic referred me to a well known local offroad shop(no surprise...it's lifted 2.5" on 37s) and they couldn't find the cause after 3 days and essentially did nothing more than what I had already done and even charged for it.:lipssealed:

I took it to another shop that claimed they would do whatever it took to find the root cause or they wouldn't charge anything. This shop had a different approach and was calculated...it was apparent they had alot more experience working on DW. They treated it like the jeep has a 100% curable disease and they're a physician trying to efficiently and cost effectively isolate the root problem(s) and fix it. They had a checklist for ruling out potential causes beginning with the most common that are the least expensive/easiest to check. They also emphasized the importance of properly inspecting each part because many people unknowingly overlook issues and spend alot more $/time chasing it than should be needed. Below is the algorithm that was used and I will be following in the future:

1. Have a knowledgeable person lay under jeep with someone rocking the steering wheel back and forth from 10 o'clock to 2 o'clock and look closely for movement/slop in the trackbar/draglink/tie rod bushings and then firmly pull on them to see if you get any movement. It's even better to do this with a tire against a curb to add stress to help uncover slop in a bad joint. Pay careful attention to the trackbar joints as it seems to the be the culprit the majority of the time. Also, pull on control arms to see if anything feels loose. If any joints or brackets have movement, inspect further and check mounts/brackets to see if welds look good and nothing is obviously bent/flexing. Retorque or replace as needed and test drive it.

2. With the jeep on the ground, loosen bolts in trackbar/draglink/tie rod and control arms and rock the jeep and then retorque to spec to make sure bolts weren't loose or bound up. Check lugnut torque and grease joints if you have greasable joints and haven't recently. Test drive jeep.

3. Lift each front tire off the ground at the axle and use a pry bar under tire to lift up and check for movement at ball joints. This typically works if ball joints are in very poor shape flopping around. However, you likely won't see movement if the ball joints are moderately bad and arent applying preload to the knuckles like mine and several others have experienced. Ball joints may still be the root cause of DW, so dont rule them out based on this test alone. The 1st offroad shop I took it to stopped at this step and thought they had eliminated ball joints as the cause bc they didn't see any movement and they felt it was unlikely on a 2 year old jeep with 29k miles mainly riding on lightweight wheels and 33" and 35" ko2's. Fully inspecting them requires significant labor removing the brakes & knuckles and is addressed in the last step.

4. Check shocks and steering stabilizer(bolts and compression for consistent compression/extension) and make sure steering box is bolted to frame at proper torque.

5. Have wheels/tires rebalanced dynamically....or better yet, swap on a friends set of wheels/tires.

6. Check alignment and caster.

7. Retorque ball joint castle nuts to spec and insert new cotter pins.

7. Time to start swapping in different steering parts and checking the bolt holes to see if they are wallowed out and then test driving it after each new part. I had my takeoff stock parts available and used them. Begin with trackbar and test drive it...and then draglink, tie rod.

8. If none of that is fixing it, you're narrowing it down to ball joints or steering box with ball joints being much more likely. Time to get serious and have an experienced shop disassemble the brakes/knuckles and check preload on ball joints.(6 hour ish job) The mechanic said my ball joints weren't applying preload on the knuckle, but were not flopping around like you see with ball joints that are completely shot. He said that is a classic sign that the ball joints are the culprit and replaced them with Dana Spicer ball joints and reassembled everything.

With the new ball joints, the jeep drives like new. Very frustrating and drawn out experience....glad it's resolved! :jk:
giphy.com.gif
Hi...I have made it through step 2. The two pics I have attached appear to be the ball joints for both the tie rod and drag link on the passenger front wheel. I am able to rock both the tie rod and drag link slightly and get some movement within the ball joint. Is this normal or a possible culprit to me experiencing intermittent DW. My 2018 wrangler JLUS has rubicon shocks and springs with a 1/2 spacer in front to accommodate additional weight of winch (sag). 45000 miles and factory rubicon wheels and BFG KO tires.

Appreciate your thoughts and feedback.

David

53C45FD0-0653-4D60-8BE0-1D65691A932F.jpeg


BC2E9D1D-C350-468C-862C-7558371805DE.jpeg
 

Hartdt

Active Member
First Name
David
Joined
Oct 16, 2018
Threads
4
Messages
36
Reaction score
30
Location
Paducah, KY
Vehicle(s)
2018 Wrangler JLUS
Hi...I have made it through step 2. The two pics I have attached appear to be the ball joints for both the tie rod and drag link on the passenger front wheel. I am able to rock both the tie rod and drag link slightly and get some movement within the ball joint. Is this normal or a possible culprit to me experiencing intermittent DW. My 2018 wrangler JLUS has rubicon shocks and springs with a 1/2 spacer in front to accommodate additional weight of winch (sag). 45000 miles and factory rubicon wheels and BFG KO tires.

Appreciate your thoughts and feedback.

David

Jeep Wrangler JL How to Beat Death Wobble! (An Algorithm to Diagnose The Issue) BC2E9D1D-C350-468C-862C-7558371805DE


Jeep Wrangler JL How to Beat Death Wobble! (An Algorithm to Diagnose The Issue) BC2E9D1D-C350-468C-862C-7558371805DE
Anyone?
 

JeepLifeStLouis

New Member
First Name
Mike
Joined
Jul 6, 2022
Threads
0
Messages
1
Reaction score
0
Location
Saint Louis
Vehicle(s)
2018 JLU
Nice work. I'd add checking air pressure of tires/trying a different pressure (usually try higher psi) to the list. I may even suggest #5 be moved to a numerically lower position on the list. Though when death wobble is occuring they all seem pretty equally important.

I went through the whole list above about a year ago and was able to solve my death wobble. Now though, if my street pressure is below about 35 psi I can feel additional wobble, not death wobble, but more wobble. Tells me I'm due for a tire rebalance after a year of a lot of wheeling and chewing up the tires.
The main issue I have with having my street pressure at 35 psi (in 35" M/T's) is I feel like the jeep is bouncing all over the place. I normally run mine at ~26 psi to resolve the bouncing issue.
Sponsored

 
 



Top