How much fuel does ASS (Auto Start Stop) save?

[Twisted10]

none of my vehicles have it...

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[Atomic-Mouse]

Do you think those people brag about how much they enjoy doing that to you? That they cherish the thought of it?

Sorry if that's inaccurate, but that's how you portrayed it:

Actually yes. I was blocked into the off-road pump one day by a large group of French Canadian bikes with my truck and 35 ft gooseneck trailer. With no room to maneuver the trailer I asked if they could move. Since none of them could speak English (even though they can) they played dumb. So I waited a few minutes and they still didn’t move but they enjoyed staring at me and talking amongst themselves and pointing me out the their friends who were the last to come out of the store. It took about 15 minutes for them to enjoy the last of their drinks and staring at me, what did I do? I turned up the AC and the radio and waited. Patience is key.

 

[NWJeepr]

Yet the EPA did not mandate those lockouts. It was a handful of our manufacturers (primary GM) that used shitty techniques to attempt to game the system. If the EPA had mandated it then the Mustang would have had the same warts as GM's performance cars, but it didn't.

CAGS was used in Camaros/Firebirds and Corvettes to help the consumer avoid gas guzzler taxes.

It can be permanently defeated in about 2 seconds for about $10 unless you make the plug-in dongle yourself for cheaper. It can also be avoided when it's enabled...don't pussy-foot off the line, and if you get the lockout, just stab the throttle OR shift from 1-4 like the computer requires.

Camaros were still sold with CAGS through the end of production in 2024. Corvette owners haven't had to worry for a while as their cars are no longer sold with manual transmissions.

The defeat device doesn't deal with the issue of the tax itself, and it seems kind of silly that a low-production car is a target when GM is printing Suburbans, Tahoes, and Silverados with V8's so people can drive them to the grocery store, but this is where we are...

 

[Atomic-Mouse]

It's like saying the gas pump isn't designated ICE spots, you know like the dicks that block the pump to go shopping at the gas station, people feel entitled regardless of what kind of vehicle they drive.

People blocking the school pickup and drop off parking spots also cry victim like you.

In my non rural city it takes us less than a minute to report these vehicles using the city website, after they get the $150+ fines and possible tow, it seems to deter repeat offences.

I invite you to the area, tell the local businesses that you are there to enforce EV parking laws on their property, for spots not designated for any particular purpose. Let me know when you start because I want to see the the outcome.

 

[NWJeepr]

I invite you to the area, tell the local businesses that you are there to enforce EV parking laws on their property, for spots not designated for any particular purpose. Let me know when you start because I want to see the the outcome.

Is it really that hard to be an adult, a man with some grit, and have the virtue of patience which you seem to talk about, and just not find joy in, or not cherish moments of being a dick to other people? Maybe find other sources of joy in your life? Admit being wrong? Try it...it will change your life.

 

[AndySpill]

It's a bit surprising how much it saves. City driving, of course. And he doesn't take additional wear into consideration.

John:

With complete respect intended to this thread and its thoughts that you got the ball rolling on, I'm sure you agree that we can throw all the metrics of fuel savings in the trash if the system doesn't engage at stop lights for owners willing to not disengage it.

Forgetting for a moment those who have implemented either tech, hacks and expressly pressed the button to turn the system off, I am curious to know just how many JL owners find the ESS system continues to work after driving off the dealer lot, and if so for how long.

I know that I am not alone, and of course my infrequent use/short trips driving plays into this, that there is no way my ESS would engage were I not also trickle charging the dual factory batteries while the vehicle is parked.

To this point, an EPA test that doesn't track the reliability of such a system continuing to engage years into ownership, but rather tests the vehicle when new, once, like crash testing, is not a standard, at least in dual factory battery JL implementations, that accurately reflects mileage improvements of vehicle life.

 

[PeatedWhisky]

I don't like the feature so 8/10 times I get in the car, I turn it off immediately after starting the engine, so it doesn't engage on those trips. If I forget to turn it off, the first time it engages, I immediately turn it off. So based on the video, it actually uses more gas (though not really a material amount) since I only leave it on for 1 second per trip at most, and it takes about 7 seconds of idling to match the gas used to restart the vehicle.

 

[Wbino]

Before you get your panties in a bunch maybe you should take a second and contemplate that not all areas are the same. I don’t live in Boston, NY or LA. I live very rural and there are only a few charging stations and NOT ONE OF THEM is designated strictly EV parking only. Also consider that living this rural it is very rare that you see an EV, maybe one a month so the chance of me actually blocking someone from the charge is slim to none. I’d like to see them tow the fully loaded log trucks weighing 80k lbs that block 8 parking spots including the EV station when the drivers go in for coffee. I should apologize for my dick behavior and say I’m sorry for a harmless little joke I should have known someone would overreact and I guess I should have gone into more depth and explained my childish behavior, but I’m not sorry so lighten up.

The only one in twisted panties is you.
You boasted about being a dick, and couldn’t deal with the blowback.

 

[AndySpill]

For those who hate the ESS system, and I respect your right to feel that way for one of a bunch of reasons, including greater wear and tear on vehicle components, and higher purchase price, or simply having "the man" limit your freedom to burn gasoline you paid for I would though ask you to consider the alternative:

You may disagree on fossil fuel's negative effect, or the extent of that effect on air quality and greenhouse gases, but the powers see "dinosaur juice" inflicting a cost on the environment that extends far beyond its pump purchase price, and that if the cost of remediating these emissions were indeed reflected at the pump, fuel prices might be elevated like the price of movie theater candy.

Resulting, people who need vehicles to make a living might not be able to afford transportation, so instead, for all its failures, and there are a number of them, the EPA has instead adopted a slower belt tightening approach to fuel savings over time, that involves ever more stringent CAFE standards that, in a more controlled fashion raise the cost of ICE vehicle's purchase and use relative to electric alternatives.

Engine start stop is merely the "pet rock" of our times, that vehicle manufacturers are using to better meet these CAFE standards while we migrate to electric propulsion.

 

[BXFXJeep]

I invite you to the area, tell the local businesses that you are there to enforce EV parking laws on their property, for spots not designated for any particular purpose. Let me know when you start because I want to see the the outcome.

One of the great things about small towns and rural areas, is that they tend to run more on common sense, there are almost no "coffee is hot" signs, because by nature survival depends on common sense, and everyone know who is the town dick, rural areas are self policing.

Urban areas not so much, that is why urban areas use mechanisms like fines to control stupid behaviour.

 

[swampflyer]

Finally! EPA’s start/stop to end. By EPA’s Zeldin. Just announced on Fox.

 

[jadmt]

Finally! EPA’s start/stop to end. By EPA’s Zeldin. Just announced on Fox.

you are a day late ....

 

[Atomic-Mouse]

Is it really that hard to be an adult, a man with some grit, and have the virtue of patience which you seem to talk about, and just not find joy in, or not cherish moments of being a dick to other people? Maybe find other sources of joy in your life? Admit being wrong? Try it...it will change your life.

Ok this is my last post for this topic. I have been accused of play the victim card, so I might as well play the victim card. This is my daily driver.

With a titanium vertebrae 8 screws and a plate in my lower back I was told I’d never walk again I need a wheelchair for many things like shopping. I can however walk short distances with crutches but can’t maintain balance or carry anything over 8-10 lbs due to strength in my legs. I have limited feeling and use of my right leg and my left leg is completely numb and I have no control over my left ankle. I live with constant nerve pain from the waist down and piss through a plastic tube. I’ll leave the number 2 to your imagination but you will be way off on your guess. I have to travel an hour just to get to a Walmart and 9 times out of 10 the handicap spaces are always full. We all know the jokes about handicap spaces. ( you broke your arm, now you can park in a handicap spot) So somedays if the weather is bad and the parking lot is full of slush I will pull into a regular spot and wait for a handicap space to open up. Ever have nerve pain in your ass and have to sit in a vehicle for a few hours? Every time someone comes running out of the store with a small bag of items hops in their car and speeds off. I have actually been cut off by people who stole the spot in front of me and ran into the store. So I wait, I sit in my vehicle with nerve pain and the anxiety of having a bathroom accident (no feeling from the waist down also means no control of bowls and bladder) and I wait. During the summer months it’s no big deal. I can park off to the side where I have a good chance of not being parked next to. Unload the chair, attach the rear wheels and cushion and push myself 200 yards to the entrance. Have you ever had to push a wheel chair through 6 inches of slush? you get wet fast. Do I holler and scream when I see someone run out of the store and hop into their car in the handicap spot I could have otherwise used. Nope, won’t do any good. Then I get to try to maneuver back to my vehicle with my purchase precariously perched on my lap, usually have to get the essentials or make multiple trips. Am I a victim, no. I wait my turn or I come up with an alternative plan. Everything in my life involves altering plans. Handicap spaces are among the most abused parking in the world. In many cases such as the local stores that are a short enough distance I can walk I will not use the handicap space unless the lot is full. Even the few local handicap spots are at the owners discretion. Most available parking is right up against the building so not a long walk 90% of the time. The stores are one level and small, easily accessible for a quick drink purchase. I do everything I can everyday, I operate heavy equipment, plow snow, work on my jeeps and help others in my community and am an active member of my local fire department. I recently built this storage box for the rear of our new rescue truck so med supplies can be stored inside. All with limited help because I am determined to do things on my own, I find a way. Judge me all you like, I don’t know you and will most likely never meet you.

The only time I complain is when my bowls aren’t working properly and I spend hours on the toilet. So I’m not sorry if I happen inconvenience the rare EV driver for a few precious minutes. I’m not sorry for a joke that was blown way out of proportion. I’m not asking for sympathy or remorse, all I ask for is patience and understanding over different situations in different areas. None of you know my area or its infrastructure. So just because we don’t see things the same way doesn’t mean we need to rip each other’s throats out over something so insignificant as a parking spot. To be clear, NO, I don’t park in front of this,

But because it is not noticeable nor advertised, promoted or otherwise marked EVs only I will park in front of something like this in my local area where I know the business owners and their policies on parking. (Not my picture but very identical to what a local store has.) Does being in a wheelchair give me justification to park in EV spots nope, but if they aren’t specifically designated or enforced by the owner it seems like it probably isn’t the end of the world either.

On a side note my father just dropped off some groceries for me as he was in town for a doctors visit. I mentioned the fire storm I created on here and he said to let everyone know what the north county thinks of EV charging stations. The local hospital has pulled it’s only four Siemens charging stations and painted over the parking lot symbols because they were not used enough to justify the cost. I’ll try to get a picture next time I go in. So just because someone makes a joke and you don’t understand the circumstances maybe be somewhat polite until all the facts are out. Remember I’m not in a major city where there are EVs on every street corner. I have only ever seen 2 teslas in my area and the first cyber truck just a month ago. No one of which seemed to be looking for a charger. I doubt this has made any reasonable sense to some who feel I should jump of a cliff, I understand some minds can only see things one way but yes I do know what it’s like to need a parking spot, but I also have the patience to wait a few minutes.

 

[NWJeepr]

Finally! EPA’s start/stop to end. By EPA’s Zeldin. Just announced on Fox.

Will be interesting to see if automakers actually remove it.

The EPA can't "end" it, as they never required it in the first place. What they are doing is removing the monetary credit given to automakers for installing it. Given that fuel economy and emissions have global targets, and FCA/Stellantis is a global company, they may just leave it in. Or, not worth the effort until this false regime blows over and is run out of the US.

 

[NWJeepr]

Ok this is my last post for this topic. I have been accused of play the victim card, so I might as well play the victim card. This is my daily driver.

With a titanium vertebrae 8 screws and a plate in my lower back I was told I’d never walk again I need a wheelchair for many things like shopping. I can however walk short distances with crutches but can’t maintain balance or carry anything over 8-10 lbs due to strength in my legs. I have limited feeling and use of my right leg and my left leg is completely numb and I have no control over my left ankle. I live with constant nerve pain from the waist down and piss through a plastic tube. I’ll leave the number 2 to your imagination but you will be way off on your guess. I have to travel an hour just to get to a Walmart and 9 times out of 10 the handicap spaces are always full. We all know the jokes about handicap spaces. ( you broke your arm, now you can park in a handicap spot) So somedays if the weather is bad and the parking lot is full of slush I will pull into a regular spot and wait for a handicap space to open up. Ever have nerve pain in your ass and have to sit in a vehicle for a few hours? Every time someone comes running out of the store with a small bag of items hops in their car and speeds off. I have actually been cut off by people who stole the spot in front of me and ran into the store. So I wait, I sit in my vehicle with nerve pain and the anxiety of having a bathroom accident (no feeling from the waist down also means no control of bowls and bladder) and I wait. During the summer months it’s no big deal. I can park off to the side where I have a good chance of not being parked next to. Unload the chair, attach the rear wheels and cushion and push myself 200 yards to the entrance. Have you ever had to push a wheel chair through 6 inches of slush? you get wet fast. Do I holler and scream when I see someone run out of the store and hop into their car in the handicap spot I could have otherwise used. Nope, won’t do any good. Then I get to try to maneuver back to my vehicle with my purchase precariously perched on my lap, usually have to get the essentials or make multiple trips. Am I a victim, no. I wait my turn or I come up with an alternative plan. Everything in my life involves altering plans. Handicap spaces are among the most abused parking in the world. In many cases such as the local stores that are a short enough distance I can walk I will not use the handicap space unless the lot is full. Even the few local handicap spots are at the owners discretion. Most available parking is right up against the building so not a long walk 90% of the time. The stores are one level and small, easily accessible for a quick drink purchase. I do everything I can everyday, I operate heavy equipment, plow snow, work on my jeeps and help others in my community and am an active member of my local fire department. I recently built this storage box for the rear of our new rescue truck so med supplies can be stored inside. All with limited help because I am determined to do things on my own, I find a way. Judge me all you like, I don’t know you and will most likely never meet you.

The only time I complain is when my bowls aren’t working properly and I spend hours on the toilet. So I’m not sorry if I happen inconvenience the rare EV driver for a few precious minutes. I’m not sorry for a joke that was blown way out of proportion. I’m not asking for sympathy or remorse, all I ask for is patience and understanding over different situations in different areas. None of you know my area or its infrastructure. So just because we don’t see things the same way doesn’t mean we need to rip each other’s throats out over something so insignificant as a parking spot. To be clear, NO, I don’t park in front of this,

But because it is not noticeable nor advertised, promoted or otherwise marked EVs only I will park in front of something like this in my local area where I know the business owners and their policies on parking. (Not my picture but very identical to what a local store has.)

On a side note my father just dropped off some groceries for me as he was in town for a doctors visit. I mentioned the fire storm I created on here and he said to let everyone know what the north county thinks of EV charging stations. The local hospital has pulled it’s only four Siemens charging stations and painted over the parking lot symbols because they were not used enough to justify the cost. I’ll try to get a picture next time I go in. So just because someone makes a joke and you don’t understand the circumstances maybe be somewhat polite until all the facts are out. Remember I’m not in a major city where there are not EVs on every street corner. I have only ever seen 2 teslas in my area and the first cyber truck just a month ago. No one of which seemed to be looking for a charger. I doubt this has made any reasonable sense to some who feel I should jump of a cliff, I understand some minds can only see things one way but yes I do know what it’s like to need a parking spot, but I also have the patience to wait a few minutes.

I'm glad you are managing your disability well. However, you specifically said you cherish parking in front of EV chargers with your 392. And then blamed everyone else and tried to backpedal when called on it.

I don't care if you are disabled, or a volunteer FF, or anything else. That's just not a nice thing to do, and if it needed pages of explanation of why you think you're still in the right and it was all just a joke, then maybe it didn't need to be said in the first place at all.

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