Mike921921

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oh, i have more than some knowledge. Ive held a formula racing license and been a driving instructor. So spare me the “when i was your age” crap.

Knowing what best to do in a pinch is a great thing for sure. that doesnt mean you should handicap yourself. just because a technology didnt exist years ago doesnt mean youre better off without it. Thats why we have electric lights, fly on airplanes, and dont go everywhere by horse drawn buggy.

you cannot control or stop a vehicle better with these systems disabled. Its been tested. Its been proven. There is absolutely no debate about this. to think otherwise is pure ego, and is backed up with zero evidence.
Yeah, works until it doesn't - like the 737Max......





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JeepCares

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Hi @JDJeep85,

We are terribly sorry to see that this happened! We would like to ensure that you have a Jeep Wave Specialist working on your behalf while you are in service. Please send our team a private message with your VIN to get started.

Darlene
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Kurt0

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Then you should know that no racing body requires or advocates ABS /TC on their cars. Why is that... because they expect you to be able to drive them. AS far as "old age crap" it's a fact that cars did not have any of this stuff growing up.

You really are a piece of work.
thats interesting. The amateur formula car i drove had both. In fact, modern traction control in cars we drive today had their genesis in Formula racing. Its so effective fia goes back and forth with banning it because of the advantage it gives teams.

the fact is this: Youve never tested emergency vehicle dynamics with and without, so you dont really know. I have, so i do. “Piece of work” would apply better to the guy who has zero professional training or experience purporting to be an expert, and advocating for a practice that he has never empirically measured the results of.
 
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Kurt0

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Yeah, works until it doesn't - like the 737Max......
they dont fail that often. And why on earth would you intentionally disable them just because it might need repair one day? Thats like insisting your house be heated with fire places because you will have to service or replace a furnace in the house one day.
 
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thats interesting. The formula car i raced had both. In fact, modern traction control in cars we drive today had their genesis in Formula racing.

the fact is this: you actually have no idea. Youve never tested emergency vehicle dynamics with and without. I have. you dont know what youre talking about, I do, and it is as simple as that.
Please explain the details of the test you were part of that demonstrated that ABS and Traction control were faster on the racetrack: What track, date, weather, racecar details, number of laps for each test, crew cheif and a manager I can verify this with.
 

Kurt0

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Please explain the details of the test you were part of that demonstrated that ABS and Traction control were faster on the racetrack: What track, date, weather, racecar details, number of laps for each test, crew cheif and a manager I can verify this with.
🤣 want my medical work up, eye exam results, reactionary tests, and blood sample too?

you guys know you can do some of these schools yourself, right? Like, you can actually go and learn this shit?

unbelievable.
 

runningshoes

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Not to get in the middle of the argument, but I will say that disabling those systems will likely lead to your insurer arguing against any coverage should any accident ever happen. That likely includes your medical coverage as well if air bags are disabled and upper body / head injuries occur.
 

MKC JL

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thats interesting. The amateur formula car i drove had both. In fact, modern traction control in cars we drive today had their genesis in Formula racing. Its so effective fia goes back and forth with banning it because of the advantage it gives teams.

the fact is this: Youve never tested emergency vehicle dynamics with and without, so you dont really know. I have, so i do. “Piece of work” would apply better to the guy who has zero professional training or experience purporting to be an expert, and advocating for a practice that he has never empirically measured the results of.
Sorry again you don't know what you're talking about. Pretty sure my years of desert racing in trucks & bikes taught me a few things. I would also venture my Porsches and Vettes did as well.

Now to my original post nowhere did I advocate turning stuff off for daily driving. I'm very happy that most people have this nanny stuff because they can't seem to drive without it.

If you as an instructor aren't teaching all the concepts of driving on the track you are doing them a big disservice. Maybe recommend they call their lawyer & sue you should they lose control.

You do as you please. I advise people to know what their vehicle will do & how to react. I'm sure all that experience will help you in a Jeep should you ever get it off road.
 

Kurt0

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Sorry again you don't know what you're talking about. Pretty sure my years of desert racing in trucks & bikes taught me a few things. I would also venture my Porsches and Vettes did as well.

Now to my original post nowhere did I advocate turning stuff off for daily driving. I'm very happy that most people have this nanny stuff because they can't seem to drive without it.

If you as an instructor aren't teaching all the concepts of driving on the track you are doing them a big disservice. Maybe recommend they call their lawyer & sue you should they lose control.

You do as you please. I advise people to know what their vehicle will do & how to react. I'm sure all that experience will help you in a Jeep should you ever get it off road.

You cannot stop a vehicle on a reduced traction surface as quickly or control it as well with those systems disabled. Period. Thats one of the reasons it is taught both ways.

you should go take a professional class or two. Youll walk away a better and more informed driver.

Now to my original post nowhere did I advocate turning stuff off for daily driving.
at least theres one thing we can agree on.

playing around off road or on a track is completely different and a good time. Someone thinking theyve got magic driving skills that make them better than the ABS computer for stopping in snow is ego leading them down the road of recklessness.
 
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🤣 want my medical work up, eye exam results, reactionary tests, and blood sample too?

you guys know you can do some of these schools yourself, right? Like, you can actually go and learn this shit?

unbelievable.
Kurt, Spend more time in the simulator. You'll be ok.
 

MKC JL

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I'm pretty sure driving in sand or mud would prove you wrong. We agree to disagree. I also looked into the F1 since I'm and old guy and don't remember stuff and it appears that F1 and FIA banned ABS in 94 due to it being a drivers aid.

Still banned today from what I could find. Not sure what Formula cars you drive V maybe that has ABS but no sanctioning body I can find uses it. Having owned over 200 vehicles from a blown A coupe to a 911 & Zo6 I'm fairly certain I have no problems driving.

Not that I couldn't learn what I've forgotten but I can hold my own when it comes to skill level. Here's my 10 sec. A sitting on the salt at B'Ville.
31-10 (1).JPG
 

MKC JL

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You cannot stop a vehicle on a reduced traction surface as quickly or control it as well with those systems disabled. Period. Thats one of the reasons it is taught both ways.

you should go take a professional class or two. Youll walk away a better and more informed driver.



at least theres one thing we can agree on.

playing around off road or on a track is completely different and a good time. Someone thinking theyve got magic driving skills that make them better than the ABS computer for stopping in snow is ego leading them down the road of recklessness.
On this we do agree mostly! Unfortunately these things all give a driver a false sense of security. They are just tools.
 

MKC JL

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Apologies OP for derailing your post!
 

CaJLMetalHead

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Apologies OP for derailing your post!
It happens on the vast majority of the threads... people not answering to the OP concern or question.. and just posting random personal crap... it makes the threads a lot less useful... but hey.. you are dealing with humans... soo...
 
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JDJeep85

JDJeep85

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Hi @JDJeep85,

We are terribly sorry to see that this happened! We would like to ensure that you have a Jeep Wave Specialist working on your behalf while you are in service. Please send our team a private message with your VIN to get started.

Darlene
Jeep Cares
Thanks for the help Darlene, I have sent you a message with that info.
 

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