GMRS Travel and Off-road Channels

[DanW]

As we in the off-road community have rapidly adopted GMRS as the primary means of 2 way communication, there are some norms that are appearing to take shape, to help make the experience more user-friendly and easy to understand. Awhile back, NotaRubicon on YouTube proclaimed channel 16 as the universal off-road channel. Several big expeditions later, I can say that this has become pretty common. I've reached other Jeep drivers on the trail who were monitoring or using the channel for communications both within and outside their respective groups.

So next there came a raging debate on a GMRS forum, where off-roaders occasionally clash with a very few people who view us as encroaching on their playground. The debate was over a question a user posed about what channel was considered the universal highway or travel channel for GMRS, just like 19 functions for CB radio. The Ham community and others argued for channel 20. One reason is a pretty good one for those living near our northern border. (It is explained in the video). The main reason is that allegedly it was the designated travel channel a long time ago. In a trip to Moab and back last spring, a trip to Maine and back last Fall, and several trips in between, and finally a trip to Houston, Tx, and back, I never heard one traveler using channel 20. So I was on the channel 19 side. Why? Because so many off-roaders are moving over from CB, where 19 is king. It is easy to remember. If someone moves to GMRS and talks to nobody, they might be likely to try channel 19 by default.

So I've found groups monitoring channel 16 off road. (btw, why 16? Because 4x4=16. Lol, simple.)

If you watch the video, you'll find that Randy (Notarubicon) is hilarious. But boy did he stir up a hornets nest among the non-off-road users. Lol. Watch and enjoy. And if you are new to GMRS, subscribe and learn. He really knows his stuff and lays it out in a very entertaining way.

As for me, I'm on board with the suggestion of channel 16 and 20 as universal channels for off-roading and for road travel. They just make sense.

Enjoy!

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[dchemphill1]

16 for off-road and 19 for road travel...just like CB. I heard somewhere 20 was for emergency situation chatter??

 

[DanW]

16 for off-road and 19 for road travel...just like CB. I heard somewhere 20 was for emergency situation chatter??

I haven't seen that, but an emergency channel would be good. But right now the users are so sparse that I think if I had an emergency I'd want to go where there are other people listening. Channel 20 has been dead as a doornail in my experience. So has 19, really. But hopefully that is changing. Once there is enough radio traffic, I think the next logical step would indeed be to name a universal emergency channel.

GMRS is certainly growing fast enough that this need might not be too far off in the future.

Of course, it should be noted that FCC rules allow for any radio to be used on any Ham/GMRS frequency if there is a true emergency, and whoever has the emergency gets priority to speak. That means you can use a Baofeng on a HAM or GMRS channel without a license if you have an emergency.

 

[DanW]

I just found that they infamous "Line A" is no longer a practical issue, even though the FCC rules have not been updated. Canadians are now allowed to use channel 19 (and 21, as well, which was also verboten above line A. Of course, they are limited to 2 watts on the high powered channels, but since they can now use it, the Line A rule has no purpose. I don't believe it ever was enforced, but certainly now it would not be.

My understanding was that the rule was originally to protect Canadian emergency services from interference, as they must have used that frequencey. But from what I can gather, they don't anymore, and so that's why they have opened it up.

I'm not encouraging anyone to violate a rule, but rather informing that the reason for it to exist in the first place is no longer valid.

Even at 50 watts, the best I get in my Jeep from vehicle to vehicle is about 10 miles. Most of the time it is about 6. I live in a mainly suburban/rural area with lots of trees and some buildings and even farms. BUt it isn't completely flat.

So even trying to be a good neighbor to our Canadian friends, high power won't penetrate that far across the borde unless you are within a few miles of it.

One nice thing for Canadians....they don't have to buy a license. But that makes sense when limited to 2 watts on the high power channels.

Remember, stay safe and legal. Wear a condom and get your GMRS license!

 

[DanW]

16 for off-road and 19 for road travel...just like CB. I heard somewhere 20 was for emergency situation chatter??

20 with a CTCSS tone of 143.1 (or 141.3??) was orignially designated as a travel channel but it never took off because so few knew it and even fewer use the tones. But as for emergency, the FCC opens it up to all channels, even with no license, and even with a technically illegal radio.

I'd say if 19 (simplex) takes off, then that'd be the place to go if you have an emergency. Nobody would hear you on channel 20 unless you get really lucky.

Most GMRS users, especially in Jeeps, use simplex channels. for those that don't know, it means just turn it to channel 19 and you transmit and receive on the same frequency with no tones or privacy codes. That makes it work just like a CB, which is simple. That's why it was discussed and proposed that 19 now be designated.

So a person buys a GMRS, removes the CB in her/his Jeep, sets it up, and has done little or no research. Logic says to try channel 19 for a highway channel because that's what it has always been on CB. Simple. Logical. That's the reationale. After massive discussion and passionate debate in the GMRS community, this guy decided to use his influence to boost channel 19. We'll see what happens. But I think it is a good idea.

After being lectured over the last 2 years that 20 with a tone is the travel channel, I can say I have not one single time heard a highway traveler talk on channel 20. (I scan on every trip.) That's after several trips, including Indy to Moab, Maine, S. Carolina, and Texas. Not once. So my personal anecdotal conclusion was that 20 ain't workin.

I never heard any Canadian use of 20 when I was in Ohio, VT, NH, ME, or MI, either. So it appears that the rule of Line A is indeed out of date.

 

[DanW]

Of course if you want to use a radio for any distance then VHF is the way to go. My latest radio is 80watts. Compare that with typical GMRS, CB , FRS, Baofeng or other any 5 watt unit.
And yes there are legal frequencies for use on the 10m/Commercial/'VHF Band. You have to do a lot of research to id those frequencies. Don't ask me.
Which radio? - do your research and get a Ham opened to the commercial band or regular commercial band radio.
As far as an emergency Channel/Frequency there has to be someone else at the other end and that almost never happens. I would NOT recommend any radio for emergency use. What do I use while out in the boondocks for help or emergency? I use inReach, but SPOT and Iridium devices have the same text/email feature to someone via satellite. These devices also have a real SOS feature that will result in a helicopter rescue for that terrible thing that happens.

Ham is no doubt superior. But I really just went to GMRS to have great improvement over CB, in both range and clarity. The fact I can use repeaters and talk to folks around the country is just gravy. And not having to study and take a test was good. As well as a 10 year license for only 70 bucks. That'll be even better when they get around to lowering it to $35. But the FCC moves at the speed of government.

The other thing we've got to do is encourage the off-road community to get licenses, whatever they use. So many are ignorning that part of it.

10 years and immediate family coverage is really a bargain at $70, let alone $35. I do understand if someone is holding out for the fee reduction, though.

 

[FinnCustomKnives]

Ham is no doubt superior. But I really just went to GMRS to have great improvement over CB, in both range and clarity. The fact I can use repeaters and talk to folks around the country is just gravy. And not having to study and take a test was good. As well as a 10 year license for only 70 bucks. That'll be even better when they get around to lowering it to $35. But the FCC moves at the speed of government.

The other thing we've got to do is encourage the off-road community to get licenses, whatever they use. So many are ignorning that part of it.

10 years and immediate family coverage is really a bargain at $70, let alone $35. I do understand if someone is holding out for the fee reduction, though.

Serious question and not meant to poke the bear or be snarky or anything. How does a GMRS license do anything at all? No test for said license to use on 100% free airwaves but a licensing fee?! Sounds like a textbook cashgrab to me. ?

 

[DanW]

Serious question and not meant to poke the bear or be snarky or anything. How does a GMRS license do anything at all? No test for said license to use on 100% free airwaves but a licensing fee?! Sounds like a textbook cashgrab to me. ?

Yeah, I'd say so. I'm sure the FCC would say it is to administer the program but they haven't done much in that direction in a long time. They haven't fined or arrested anyone other than a couple knuckleheads that did some very bad things. In the case of GMRS, it appears all they've done is write rules. Those bureaucrats would have been paid anyway.

So I get it and fundamentally agree. But I also believe in following rules until they get legitimately changed. If people start cherry picking which laws to follow, as we've seen in a big way in the last few years, then we'll lose what's left of civility and civilization. I'm a fan of smaller and less intrusive government. But I won't break any laws, or in this case, rules. At least I won't do that intentionally.

 

[DanW]

Correct GMRS is better than CB. I still have CB because I wheel with an off road club and that is what they all use. And none of this group of 75 members are using GMRS. The key is who are you going to communicate with. Someone has to be at the other end.
So I have bath a High power VHF and a CB and folks I travel with are using one or the other.

Me, too. I've got CB's in both my JL and JK. I still have friends in the Jeep clubs with them and I still like to talk to truckers sometimes on long trips. I also keep a bag full of charged FRS talkies to hand out to drivers who have neither. And a couple of Baofengs for my brothers, who occasionally wheel with us. They are immediate family, right? ?

 

[prerunner1982]

And you wont need to buy a crappy GMRS radio. Just buy a 2 meter radio the uses the GMRS frequencies.

Except 2m is VHF and GMRS is UHF so you would want a dual band radio.
I am sure that's what you meant but I just wanted to clear that up for anyone else who wasn't aware.

 

[jeepdriver99]

Except 2m is VHF and GMRS is UHF so you would want a dual band radio.
I am sure that's what you meant but I just wanted to clear that up for anyone else who wasn't aware.

PLUS you will have to get the radio modified to use it in the GMRS band.

 

[Cycle11111]

And you wont need to buy a crappy GMRS radio. Just buy a 2 meter radio the uses the GMRS frequencies.

Technically that is illegal to Tx on for GMRS except in emergencies. To use GMRS for TX/RX you need to have a GMRS radio (part 95 certified I believe) and a GMRS license.

 

[Cycle11111]

GMRS isn't 2 meter, so there's that...

Yep UHF - in the 460MHz(s) - 70cm

 

[cornercanyon]

For many of us most of what you all say flies right over our heads. We may know that VHF is Very High Frequency and UHF is Ultra High Frequency, and I am old enough to remember tuning a black and white television set or listening to the LA Dodgers on my transistor radio. Though TX? RX? TL;DL? Tones and repeaters? 16 or462.5750? Mode, Power, Band? Frankly, I don't even know if my dual band radios are GRMS or FRS. What pragmatically does all this mean those who want to join in on the trails in a productive, civil way while enjoying our jeeps amongst you all? Perhaps you would be kind enough to offer a lesson or point a noob in the right direction–

 

[jeepdriver99]

For many of us most of what you all say flies right over our heads. We may know that VHF is Very High Frequency and UHF is Ultra High Frequency, and I am old enough to remember turning a black and white television set or listening to the LA Dodgers on my transistor radio. Though TX? RX? TL;DL? Tones and repeaters? 16 or462.5750? Mode, Power, Band? Frankly, I don't even know if my dual band radios are GRMS or FRS. What pragmatically does all this mean those who want to join in on the trails in a productive, civil way while enjoying our jeeps amongst you all? Perhaps you would be kind enough to offer a lesson or point a noob in the right direction–

@cornercanyon Valid point. Let me try to give a high level explanation for you.
TX and RX are "radio shorthand" for Transmit (TX) and Receive (RX).

Tones are a way to filter out transmissions. You set your receiver to look for a tone that can not be heard by people that will accompany a transmission. If your radio is set to listen for that and it is present, it will send the audio to the speaker. If it's not present, you won't hear it. This will filter out others on the same frequency from being heard and you will only hear those you want to hear.

Repeaters: It is when you transmit on one frequency and another station (the repeater) will receive your transmission and retransmit it on a different frequency. For this to work, your display will show your receive frequency and if you are in repeater mode, when you transmit, the radio will transmit at the repeater frequency which is an offset from your receive frequency. For example (I'm using ham frequencies since I'm more familiar with ham repeaters) if you are receiving at 148.88 and in repeater mode, when you push the "push to talk (ptt) button, it will transmit from your radio at 142.88. The repeater will receive the signal on 142.88 and retransmit at 148.88. Since your radio can not transmit and receive at the same time, your radio won't hear the repeater as long as that ptt button is pushed. There are also repeaters that use the tones explained above to filter out signals that should not be repeated.

16 or 462.5750: Just like CB, the channel has a corresponding frequency associated with it. Channel 16 of GMRS is 462.5750. You can find the frequencies and channels at GMRS Radio Frequencies and Channels | Right Channel Radios

Mode: this is where you are talking directly to another radio on the same frequency which is called simplex mode or if you're in repeater mode as I described above. There are other modes but those are the ones being used in GMRS

Power: FRS (Family Radio Service) is a no license needed radio system but you are limited to 2 watts of power. This is normally the small hand held radios. GMRS (General Mobil Radio Service) can use 50 watts of power. Some of the GMRS frequencies are also used by FRS so they can talk to each other.

Band: As it was discussed in this thread, there is 2 meter band for hams which is 144.000 to 148.00 and 73cm band which is 430.000 to 440.000. GMRS and FRS are 462.55 to 467.7250. So the 73cm band is close to the GRMR frequencies and some ham radios have been modified to work on the GMRS bands.

Dual band: Those are ham radios that can be used on the 2 meter band or the 73cm band. They do not normally include GMRS or FRS.

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