FRAM Ultra @20K Miles

[roaniecowpony]

Not if you take care of it. Only reason I got rid of my Silverado was it was not cost effective anymore. At 305,000 miles it was smart money to trade it for drywall work and get my current rig. Both my mom's Pulsar and her Camry were pushing 400,000 miles before unloading them.

My current off road and hauling rig is a 2005 GMC Sierra and is in outstanding condition. It is only just under 150,000 miles and I figure it's good for at least another 100,000 miles of service.

Both 20+ year old Lexus's are city cars and only pushing 130,000 miles. I see no reason to get rid of what you have if it runs good and functions as needed.

Everyone has a way they do things and budgets to go along. A vehicle that does off-roading will get rattles and cracks in the body from twisting and jarring. At some point, I just want a new one and maybe a different type by the time it gets around 100-150k. It may be sooner or later than that with this JL. We'll see. It's not always about "taking care of it". They can still start having problems that are either gremlins or chains of issues. This JL electrical system with ESS and a secondary battery is concerning regarding its durability/reliability.

As for reasons to change out cars, there are many. One of them is to get the emissions of the older vehicle off the road.

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[OllieChristopher]

As for reasons to change out cars, there are many. One of them is to get the emissions of the older vehicle off the road.

Mine always pass smog. I tend to run the wheels off everything I own. It's a lifestyle and pride I have in my rides. My formula is when it cost's me more than routine labor and repair it's time to unload it.

 

[roaniecowpony]

You might want to read up on it, it is a proven fact for both oil and air filters right up to the point of it reaching its particulate holding capacity--particularly where synthetic media is concerned.

What is the purpose of running the filter closer to the upturn of those curves where the bypass opens? If it's saving money or labor, I guess everyone has a different financial situation. My filters cost me about $10 ea if I recall correctly. So, I could save upwards of $7.50 (every 5k) each change if I went to 20k filter intervals. Sounds very practical. A Happy Meal every 5k.

 

[CarbonSteel]

What is the purpose of running the filter closer to the upturn of those curves where the bypass opens? If it's saving money or labor, I guess everyone has a different financial situation. My filters cost me about $10 ea if I recall correctly. So, I could save upwards of $7.50 (every 5k) each change if I went to 20k filter intervals. Sounds very practical. A Happy Meal every 5k.

The point of the graph is to show how much more capacity synthetic media filters have over cellulose. I would not run either all the way to the upwards part of the curve.

Particulates typically only come into play on aging, poorly maintained, or engines with design flaws which suffer from varnish or sludge. Ergo, a synthetic filter clogging is not even a consideration on a well maintained/properly running engine which is why I had zero concerns running one on mine for 20K miles.

 

[DanW]

Running the filter that long reminded me of that thread where the guy broke off the tip of the filter in the engine. Plastics lose their solvents with age and temperature. Might increase the likelyhood of something similar to that tip breaking on a filter.

Which reminds me, I need to change the oil in the JLUR.

Ouch! But the plastics in a filter rated for 20k will not degrade like that in 20k. The liability would kill them. Plus, It is easy to develop a polymer that can stand up to much more harsh conditions than this engine will throw at it in 20k miles. On the other hand, if a filter is rated for 5k and someone runs it 10, that's on them if it breaks like that. And I could see not worrying about plastic degrading at double the intended life.

I'm curious what brand of filter that was and how long it was in there. Of course, there can always be a defective filter. Every manufacturer will have some of those.

 

[DanW]

What is the purpose of running the filter closer to the upturn of those curves where the bypass opens? If it's saving money or labor, I guess everyone has a different financial situation. My filters cost me about $10 ea if I recall correctly. So, I could save upwards of $7.50 (every 5k) each change if I went to 20k filter intervals. Sounds very practical. A Happy Meal every 5k.

He isn't doing it for financial benefit. He's doing it because he and the filter can do it. I think he had high confidence it would do it with no problem. He has done analyses on his oil when the filter had high miles on it. No sign of bypass. On this one, if it went into bypass at all (I doubt it did, based on what a former Fram engineer said about the Ultras), then it will show up in a used oil analysis in the form of higher wear metals. My bet is that this oil will show no such thing and will show outstanding filtration. I'm going out on a limb and will bet no more than 0.3% insolubles, which is where the Mobil 1 filter has consistently performed for me at only 5k miles. This filter is better than most out there, and it is better for longer.

I don't know any single person who has done more meticulous analysis of oil in the 3.6 than @CarbonSteel . You should see what experiential knowledge he's gained with differential gear lubes in the M210 and M220's on the Rubicon.

 

[multicam]

...I wouldn't own this overpriced rolling gold brick.

Oh my god, I’m dying... quote of the year!

 

[JDJL]

I guess my only concern is the Fram Ultra says "proven protection for up to 20,000 miles."

That's "up to" 20,000 miles... meaning it could actually be less (like 7,000 miles). Pushing your individual filter to test that absolute maximum rating seems like a gamble to me. However, to each their own. Good luck.

 

[hiimmike]

That's a used oil filter if I've ever seen one.... am I missing something?

 

[OllieChristopher]

That's a used oil filter if I've ever seen one.... am I missing something?

Not missing a thing other than testing the limit of a cheap filter at the risk of major engine damage.

 

[DanW]

That's a used oil filter if I've ever seen one.... am I missing something?

Looks no worse than the Mopar that came with my Jeep at 2k miles, and no worse than others I've pulled from 5k to 8k.

 

[roaniecowpony]

My thought is that changing the oil and filter at the vehicle mfr's recommended interval, using good oil, and a good filter, buys you margin. Going 20k on a filter is using margin. Different perspective.

 

[DanW]

Huh... I'm so old I remember when Fram filters were so bad that if you used one in your new vehicle it voided the warranty. When did that change?

A long time ago. I think they are the best mass marketed filter out there nowadays. Even in their worst days I don't remember any car companies saying they'd void the warranty, though.

Check out this thread and scroll down to the post by Jerry Branford, a major league Jeep TJ guy with probably the best rep I've ever seen in the Jeep community. He was a very anti-Fram guy and then took a tour of their R&D facility. He came out with a very different perspective.

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/t...eally-is-garbage-check-this-out.269945/page-5

The part that got my attention was the Fram can filters holding together until they hit about 340psi of oil pressure. WOW! And those were STANDARD cheap Fram Extra Guards. That's even more impressive.

 

[Creeker]

Engines are expensive.
Quality oil and quality filters are relatively cheap.
IMHO, Fram is cheap stuff (look at the comparisons)
Would never put any Fram product on any vehicle I own.

Use Mobile One and Wixs/Napa Gold Filters on my 3.6 Liter Jeep.
Change oil at 5,000 miles or 50% of life, which ever comes first.
This methodology of oil change has been approved by my hiking buddy, a true expert in Flex and all things Jeep.

 

[Retrograde]

Use Mobile One and Wixs/Napa Gold Filters on my 3.6 Liter Jeep.
Change oil at 5,000 miles or 50% of life, which ever comes first.

Same here. Although you could probably ignore your mileage, and just go with the 50% of life oil indicator. That "calculation" is actually just an hour meter, a much more reliable indicator of when to change your oil than miles.

(I figured that bit out the last oil change I did. Oil life reached 50%... at 800 miles. It made sense though, as 90% of my time in the Jeep this past summer was spent in low range, creeping along log roads and fire breaks at 15 MPH or less.)

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