First sighting of 2020 Jeep JL Wrangler PHEV Plug-In Hybrid!

[jeffoutwest81]

My feeling is that the plug in hybrid is a good intermediate term solution, but it retains all the negatives of both powertrains - the electric isn't as powerful as a full electric but you retain the complexity and maintenance of the normal combustion engine... still, they will manage to fit 30+ miles (most likely) of fully electric range plus around 30mpg, for only a few thousand extra dollars.. I guess the economics are currently at a stage where battery capacity ($100 or more per kWh, so $3k-$10k for range of 30-300 miles) is roughly on par with the cost of a 260-ish horsepower engine.. so at this point you can mix and match a bit, although I still think you are stuck with the downsides of both. Long term, I personally will prefer to spend closer to the $10k on the battery (prices coming down anyway) and get full electric with massive horsepower at each wheel.

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[desert runner]

When the first Jeep was conceived in '41 it was an innovation. I'm sure some people did not like it, because it was different from what they were used to.

Why would we expect Jeep stops innovating now?

You can still drive you stick shift CJ, but there will be no new Jeeps unless Jeep continues to innovate.

 

[fatmat]

Sorry this post is kind of long.. its the experience of an apolitical performance lover's path to embracing electric.

I am an ICE lover for 30+ years.. bikes, trucks, cars, snowmobiles. Turbos, twins, V8's, 2-stroke, 4-stroke, off-road, on-road, sand, snow, water. I've driven, ridden and loved them all.

About a year ago I drove past a used car dealer that had a Chevy Spark EV parked on the lot. Had read in Car and Driver about it, so I stopped and test drove it just for kicks. wow.. instant torque was so fun. I bought it for $8k as a city run-about. My gas bill went from $150/month to an increase in electric bill of ~$15. But I don't really care about that. It could have doubled to $300 and I still would be happy. Its just fun to drive.

I wake up every morning with a full tank. But I don't care about that.. its just fun to drive. It torque steers like crazy, sucks in wet or snow, and understeers like a butt-heavy UTV, but something about that smooth rush of 400 ft lbs of torque is so fun. Only maintenance for the past year is new tires and windshield wipers. But who cares? Passing unsuspecting sports cars on the on-ramp is priceless.

I love it so much I built a 1500W electric fatbike (pedal bike). So fun! Again, instant torque. Plus its light and quiet. It is a riot on single track. I sold my dirtbikes because I ride my electric mtn bike all the time. Not because of the earth or politics or anything.. simply because it is more fun. No fuel injection to map, valves to adjust, clutch to replace but who cares? Its fun. And if I run out of juice I just pedal. I never run out of juice though.. I just use power to get up the hills and then blast down.

Test drove a Zero motorbike and that smooth and instant power delivery again is addictive. Working to add one to the stable as we speak. Not because of rebates or politics or earth love .. just fun!

I can see how those same characteristics would be more valuable to me on a JL. More money, less money, saves the planet, ruins the planet, blah blah blah who cares? From a pure fun perspective electric powertrains rock.

I'm not even going to run the comparison of how much I would save or spend over one version or another. It's a toy to me. Just like a snowmobile or jetski or dirtbike. I don't have to justify those with financial analysis (luckily.. would never make sense) I'm just going to test drive it when it comes out and if it has that smooth low end instant grunt, I'll be all over it.

 

[cjaama]

^ This guy gets it.

 

[DocTwinkie]

Wife and I got back from the Rivian event for preorder folks in NY this weekend.

I’m very curious to see all the prices. The Rivian after tax break starts around 61k. If they do a Tesla pricing model and charge for battery pack and aesthetics but otherwise fully loaded then this thing would be a steal. At that price. If they nickel and dime you or the upgraded battery packs are 20k increments then not so much.

I’ve been nervous about Rivian due to the price and my concern that only having such expensive models will create too small a market to mass produce but in a new interview Rivian is planning to build cars for other companies (aka amazon fleet sales) alongside their consumer models. That would be a huge revenue generator and assure the company stays afloat with high volumes. Amazon has already put 700mil into them.

A fully loaded wrangler rubicon with every bell and whistle stickers for just over 62k. If the plug in is a 5-10k option above this and the Rivian is near that I’m absolutely getting the Rivian.

The suv Rivian approach angle isn’t quite as good but the break-over is actually better than an unlimited. For over-landing style I’d be into would be perfect. At the show they were showing off “tank mode” where the right and left side wheels moved in opposite directions being controlled with a phone to spin in place.

The truck has over 14” ground clearance, can ford over a meter of water, 0-60 in 3 sec, and 750hp.

Included some pics from the event showing the frunk and cargo pass through step/seat. They’re close up for the Rivian forum members who wanted some closer details so I apologize for that.

We shall see.

 

[Billyraff]

We can get the best of electric and the 3.6 ICE if info ever comes out about the rumored 2020 3.6 eTorque.

 

[GARRIGA]

We can get the best of electric and the 3.6 ICE if info ever comes out about the rumored 2020 3.6 eTorque.

I’m interested in that option. Love to get a diesel but too many issues I can’t completely get around. The 2.0 Turbo is very intriguing but starting to believe it’s that 48v that might enhance the driving experience. Hybrid may not benefit my 60 plus mile commute.

The 3.6 is now proven and perhaps a functional eTorque solution would enhance it enough until a full blown electric solution comes out. That I think would be my new holy grail. Test drove a Tesla and the torque was crazy exciting. Filling the power up nightly from my garage is intriguing. Perhaps some artificial Hemi like sounds would be the icing on the cake. Especially when traversing under an overpass. Goose bump mania.

 

[Dkretden]

That Rivian looks really interesting. I think a promised 400 mile range is terrific...... but......

In the cold, that range will drop and drop.

But, if you do get 400 miles, you are still going to need to find a place to charge it, quickly, when you need it.

Make no mistake, I believe electric is the future. But there will be many compromises along the way that may limit adoption to only eMallers.

 

[GARRIGA]

How many miles does one need rock crawling? Over landing can be enhanced by carrying high efficiency solar panels. Some going past 25%. More costly but so is a fully rigged out JL versus going old school donkey. Base camps can setup throughout trails with their own solar panels for recharging. Faster chargers today get you at 80% from empty in less than an hour. Stop and lunch sounds about that amount of time.

I get it. It’s not the petrol solution we have today but it can be quickly if we get ourselves out of the Stone Age and start building that solar.

EVJLUR would be awesome.

 

[Dkretden]

How many miles does one need rock crawling? Over landing can be enhanced by carrying high efficiency solar panels. Some going past 25%. More costly but so is a fully rigged out JL versus going old school donkey. Base camps can setup throughout trails with their own solar panels for recharging. Faster chargers today get you at 80% from empty in less than an hour. Stop and lunch sounds about that amount of time.

I get it. It’s not the petrol solution we have today but it can be quickly if we get ourselves out of the Stone Age and start building that solar.

EVJLUR would be awesome.

I am not an electrical engineer. That said, can you show me a solar array that is suitable for the wilderness that can charge a HUGE transportation battery from empty to 80% in less than 1 hour?

As to your first point, one does not need a big battery to go rock crawling. One needs a big battery to get there and, once there, one needs access to charging stations that are as ubiquitous as gas stations. If the actual charge time is 1 hour, that’s great! Assuming of course, that there aren’t 4 vehicles ahead of you at the one charging spot.........

 

[GARRIGA]

Can’t get stuck in the past to argue the future. Advancement in battery technology and charging are moving at a fast pace. Solar panels can be installed anywhere and batteries can be placed underground to store that energy until needed. Stations can be created at all off-road ventures for charging up at arrival and departure from the park.

For overlanders, a steady constant charge more valuable than a fast one hour charge.

There are no boundaries to full electric other than the boundaries we place trying to avoid it. Does it not epitomize the mantra of tread lightly? No toxic fumes. No loud noises to silence nature. Lower foot print world wide. Can replace existing structures. Plus all that torque. That alone makes me want one. DD will be fun. Mall visits more exciting. Getting milk will not be the same. It will be worth doing.

 

[jeffoutwest81]

I'm a huge fan of the Rivian, it is just out of my price range - although not really much above a loaded Rubicon, as has been pointed out. It will be a consideration for me in the future. I'm considering doing a plug in hybrid wrangler, and maybe five years from now, picking up a used Rivian. Although by that time I'm sure there will be other interesting options

 

[Lecroj]

That’s definitely debatable and depends on usage. The person who averages over 30 miles a trip and can’t recharge then yes, they will most likely not recoup.

In my case at approximately at least $40/week in gas, usually more that puts me at $2080 a year. Again it’s probably more than that. Let’s say the hybrid costs an extra $10k i’ll recoup that in 5 years or less.

A person like myself, I’d venture to say most days of the week I would never need to use gas depending on how the system runs. If it runs off the electric first then gas I could go a long time without needing to even consider getting/using gas. So to me this is a valid option especially when you consider not having to deal with the inconvicnece of just going to get gas. If it’s dual function where it runs on electric until a certain speed then relies on gas then it’s not worth it to me at least.

You can’t compare that to the 2.0T because premium gas is not a requirement. They are already showing it works fine off regular gas. It’s just recommended.

You still have to pay for the electricity if you charge at home and in the northeast that's about half the cost of gasoline. So you have to cut your savings in half unless your neighbor doesn't mind you running an extension cord to his garage, or your work has free chargers.

 

[Lecroj]

If you call 53-100 years a long, long time(for known amounts). There is a finite number to everything esp gas, coal, and oil. And personally, I’d like to make sure my kids actually have a future.

Regardless of what we do, someone, somewhere else will burn every drop of fossil fuel on the planet. That's the problem with putting the global warming burden on just the first world population. The same amount of CO2 ends up in the atmosphere regardless. If the left ACTUALLY believed in global warming, we would be building dams, not hybrids.

 

[Sean L]

Regardless of what we do, someone, somewhere else will burn every drop of fossil fuel on the planet. That's the problem with putting the global warming burden on just the first world population. The same amount of CO2 ends up in the atmosphere regardless. If the left ACTUALLY believed in global warming, we would be building dams, not hybrids.

Plenty of Dams already built. Plus Wind Farms, and Solar Farms. That plan has already been happening for Decades. Still, making new vehicles more efficient than the old ones is a help when it comes to overall air quality. Climate Change or not, cleaner air is healthier.

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