First Oil Change: How Many Miles/Oil Preference?

blnewt

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After hearing about dealerships putting in 6 qts instead of 5. I'm curious, does it hurt the engine to drive it with 1 qt too much ?
Yes, it will put extra pressure on the seals, especially over a prolonged period.
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hammerheadnc

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@Dennis23d

I suggest you go by actual miles driven on your JL. I would not lets say trust the Oil Life readout.

Do your oil changes as per the manual's recommendations................ or do oil changes earlier then recommended, based on what you feel is what you want to do.
The manual with mine said to change when the Oil Life indicator stated and the other maintenance requirements are outlined in 20K increments. I am at about 65% with 3600 miles.
 

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After hearing about dealerships putting in 6 qts instead of 5. I'm curious, does it hurt the engine to drive it with 1 qt too much ?
Each engine design is different. In some engine designs too much oil can cause frothing, air bubbles blended into the oil from the crank. The crank whips the oil into a froth. Think of blending liquid.
 

WeldrDave

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After hearing about dealerships putting in 6 qts instead of 5. I'm curious, does it hurt the engine to drive it with 1 qt too much ?
This is kind of a loaded question but I've done a bit of work on engines over the years so I'll do my best for you.

Depending on the oil pan design and where the oil level is noted "in" the pan, having too much oil can create a couple things that are "problamatic" but most likely not detremental. The first is sudsing, if to much oil is in your oil pan and the connecting rods hit the oil it can cause an effect like whipped topping or cream, basically airates the oil, now it'll still pull from the bottom of your oil pan from the pick up to your oil pump but this can cause higher crank case pressures. Most oil pans have what is called a windage tray to keep oil in the pan and from splasing around. Eventully the excess oil will evaporate and get pulled through the crank case PVC system and burned. Second, seal leaking around the rear and front mains, this is mostly spotted in older vehicles. Remember, your in a Jeep so the engineers have designed the vehicle to be "off tilt" at times and temporary changes in oil levels will happen. Will you damage your jeep with an extra qt of oil in it, "my" opinion is no but I wouldn't leave it in there either! I'm not a ASE Jeep mechanic but just understand the engineers designed these capacities for a reason.
 

TopPinArcher

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I’m running Liqui Moly. Same brand and weight in my motorhome so I don’t need 2 different kinds
 

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Sources, please? If you can't cite 'em, you're just blowing smoke again.

Fact is, you'd be hard pressed to find a single example of an oil-related engine failure, period, assuming proper maintenance and no gross owner abuse.
You're kidding, right?

FCA even spec'd 5W30 for this engine in the Wrangler up until recent model years, even though the bottom end of the engine is virtually unchanged. Ford used to do the same thing. Zero changes to an engine, but a switch from 5W30 to 5W20 spec in the manual. It's well known that this switch was SOLELY for fuel economy and to meet CAFE and emissions requirements. I don't need to look this up for you. You have internet access.

5W30 provides better protection for an engine. This matters to the end user, since that owner is the one who will deal with the engine at 100,000 miles and beyond. FCA doesn't care after warranty is up.

If you'd like me to show my oil analysis reports on my other vehicle using 5W20 and 5W30 to prove that wear metals are far less and the engine is healthier on the higher viscosity, I'd be happy to. I don't have that data on the JL specifically yet because the dealer is currently doing my oil changes. I'll be doing those myself and having the oil analyzed on it as well as soon as I get through the 4th free oil change. But this isn't rocket science, and nobody said your engine will die tomorrow if you put 0W20 in it. All I said is that 5W30 will give it a longer lifespan, which is a fact.
 

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You're kidding, right?

FCA even spec'd 5W30 for this engine in the Wrangler up until recent model years, even though the bottom end of the engine is virtually unchanged. Ford used to do the same thing. Zero changes to an engine, but a switch from 5W30 to 5W20 spec in the manual. It's well known that this switch was SOLELY for fuel economy and to meet CAFE and emissions requirements. I don't need to look this up for you. You have internet access.

5W30 provides better protection for an engine. This matters to the end user, since that owner is the one who will deal with the engine at 100,000 miles and beyond. FCA doesn't care after warranty is up.

If you'd like me to show my oil analysis reports on my other vehicle using 5W20 and 5W30 to prove that wear metals are far less and the engine is healthier on the higher viscosity, I'd be happy to. I don't have that data on the JL specifically yet because the dealer is currently doing my oil changes. I'll be doing those myself and having the oil analyzed on it as well as soon as I get through the 4th free oil change. But this isn't rocket science, and nobody said your engine will die tomorrow if you put 0W20 in it. All I said is that 5W30 will give it a longer lifespan, which is a fact.
No, I'm not kidding. You are. And if you can't provide (or at least cite) empirical, objective sources to substantiate your alleged "facts," you're blowing smoke again. Use Del Taco fry oil if you want.
 
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I changed my oil for the first time at 5,000 miles. Plan on keeping this interval from this point on (10K, 15K, 20K, etc). And it's easy to remember.

I am using Mobil 1 Extended 0w20 and Mobil 1 Extended filters.
 

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No, I'm not kidding. You are. And if you can't provide (or at least cite) empirical, objective sources to substantiate your alleged "facts," you're blowing smoke again. Use Del Taco fry oil if you want.
No problem. When I get a chance tonight, I'll post "empirical" evidence to show the significant decrease in engine wear with higher viscosity.

Stay tuned kids...
 

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No, I'm not kidding. You are. And if you can't provide (or at least cite) empirical, objective sources to substantiate your alleged "facts," you're blowing smoke again. Use Del Taco fry oil if you want.
One of my vehicles has ran 0w-20 (per factory, since new) for 8 years and 120,000 miles. 0w-20 is shit and doesn't protect lol
 

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So here we go. Since some people won't believe anything they can't see with pictures. :giggle: Much like the Pentastar in the Jeeps, my other car has an engine that was used for many model years and originally was spec'd with a 30-weight oil. Then, seemingly out of the blue, they changed the spec. to a 20-weight with no changes to the engine. Concerned about wear, enthusiasts pressed an engineer who worked on that powertrain team about why the change was made, and he confirmed that it was purely a fuel economy/emissions move and that he himself still would use a 30-weight in his own car for longevity.

So, after mine had been run on the 20-weight for a very long time I looked at oil analysis to see where the metals were running. Obviously, metals are indicative of wear. On 3-5-2018 I switched to a 30-weight oil of the same brand, just the higher viscosity. Immediately on the very next oil change 9-15-2018 the wear metals decreased significantly, particularly iron and copper. My viscosity number was a tad low, indicating that there was probably still some of the old 20-weight crap still in the engine. So, on this next oil change coming up March 2019, I should see wear metals decrease even more. Clearly, the engine is wearing less on the higher viscosity.

Really, this is going on across the board with all aspects of a Jeep. Notice the new Dana axles, which are specifying a 75w90 fluid when they always used a 140 in the past. Or the way the transmissions are no longer using a universal fluid type, instead relying on a low-friction formula. The goal of the automaker is to put up the very best MPG numbers they can in EPA testing because it saves them money. The goal of the end user is not the same. For most of us, what we want is protection for our vital driveline parts, which is why 5W30 is the way to go once warranty is up.

Again, for those of you who struggle with reading comprehension, I am not saying that your engine is going to die on 0W20. What I'm saying is that a higher viscosity oil is going to provide a better barrier and therefore give your engine a higher probability of lasting longer.

ScreenHunter_128 Jan. 04 19.08.jpg


5W30.jpg
 

DanW

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No problem. When I get a chance tonight, I'll post "empirical" evidence to show the significant decrease in engine wear with higher viscosity.

Stay tuned kids...
I'm really looking forward to seeing what you present. I've looked at countless UOAs on BITOG and haven't seen this kind of trend, at all. The thick/thin debate rages because there is no conclusive evidence supporting one over the other for engine longevity. I see engines there hit over 200k miles all the time on both thin and thick oils. On the 3.8 V6 in my JK, I've done UOA's on 5w20 vs. 5w30 and 10w30. I saw no significant difference.
 

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So here we go. Since some people won't believe anything they can't see with pictures. :giggle: Much like the Pentastar in the Jeeps, my other car has an engine that was used for many model years and originally was spec'd with a 30-weight oil. Then, seemingly out of the blue, they changed the spec. to a 20-weight with no changes to the engine. Concerned about wear, enthusiasts pressed an engineer who worked on that powertrain team about why the change was made, and he confirmed that it was purely a fuel economy/emissions move and that he himself still would use a 30-weight in his own car for longevity.

So, after mine had been run on the 20-weight for a very long time I looked at oil analysis to see where the metals were running. Obviously, metals are indicative of wear. On 3-5-2018 I switched to a 30-weight oil of the same brand, just the higher viscosity. Immediately on the very next oil change 9-15-2018 the wear metals decreased significantly, particularly iron and copper. My viscosity number was a tad low, indicating that there was probably still some of the old 20-weight crap still in the engine. So, on this next oil change coming up March 2019, I should see wear metals decrease even more. Clearly, the engine is wearing less on the higher viscosity.

Really, this is going on across the board with all aspects of a Jeep. Notice the new Dana axles, which are specifying a 75w90 fluid when they always used a 140 in the past. Or the way the transmissions are no longer using a universal fluid type, instead relying on a low-friction formula. The goal of the automaker is to put up the very best MPG numbers they can in EPA testing because it saves them money. The goal of the end user is not the same. For most of us, what we want is protection for our vital driveline parts, which is why 5W30 is the way to go once warranty is up.

Again, for those of you who struggle with reading comprehension, I am not saying that your engine is going to die on 0W20. What I'm saying is that a higher viscosity oil is going to provide a better barrier and therefore give your engine a higher probability of lasting longer.

ScreenHunter_128 Jan. 04 19.08.jpg


5W30.jpg

Sorry, hoss, but your sample of one proves nothing. And trying to throw gear oil into a discussion about motor oil is a red herring. If you don't know what a red herring is, look it up. :facepalm:
 
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