Dual Battery from Genesis, any issues?

[Thinman]

Good thread.

Confused about the 12.7 cutoff thing. When I get in the Jeep in the morning, my cranking battery is always at 12.4. Is my isolator failing? When not started, I don't think I've ever seen either battery over 12.7. I have an Engel 45 that I leave running all the time and my commute is only 15 minutes, so I def need to get a solar panel to trickle it during the day, but still seems like low numbers.

I have the new FullRiver batteries as well.

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[huberro2]

Good point Wanglerman, I just bought a ESS disabler (https://www.smartstopstart.com/) that I have not installed just yet. I could install that to see if it triggers EVTS calls from the monitoring office. Sounds like with the ESS not reporting any error codes to the system from your experience, I think I'm half way there with confidence that I will have no problems other than JEEP - Just Empty Every Pocket and get a purchase past committee. LOL

 

[WranglerMan]

Good thread.

Confused about the 12.7 cutoff thing. When I get in the Jeep in the morning, my cranking battery is always at 12.4. Is my isolator failing? When not started, I don't think I've ever seen either battery over 12.7. I have an Engel 45 that I leave running all the time and my commute is only 15 minutes, so I def need to get a solar panel to trickle it during the day, but still seems like low numbers.

I have the new FullRiver batteries as well.

I hope I can explain this correctly and if I’m wrong those that run the same system can chime in.

The cutoff is 12.7 +/- .1 before the batteries disconnect, mine disconnect at 12.55-12.58 so very close to specs

When the disconnect occurs it only means that the primary and aux battery are no longer connected together but it does not mean that the main wont go below the 12.7.

Everything that runs thru the PDC comes off the main and all vehicles including the JL have parasitic draw and will continue to pull power.

The only purpose of the smart relay is to protect the main crank battery while you are using the aux battery to run aux equipment and to give you a boost if the main is pulled down past the point of being able to start the Jeep but only if the aux has the power to do so…it’s not a magical pot of unlimited power.

If you think you have a possible issue with the relay or solenoid you can take the connector that plugs into the top of the relay and release it and once you do the batteries will be separated then plug it back in ( it snaps in hard so takes some effort ) then start the Jeep and within two-three mins you should hear the solenoid close as it’s very audible and you should be able to feel the solenoid get warm but a better way is to use a meter and follow what I said on disconnecting the relay and reconnecting but have you meter handy and before starting your Jeep take voltage readings on both batteries and then start the Jeep, once started the main should meter at 14+ volts and quickly meter the aux and it should be lower than the 14 volts then once you hear the solenoid close meter the aux again and it should bead the same voltage as the main and then go one step further by measuring resistance across the solenoid, the solenoid is normally open and will have high resistance but once power is applied it will close and have a low resistance.

I will tell you that you need to get a smart charger as you don’t drive it enough to keep those pricy batteries happy, your best bet is a NOCO 10 or Odyssey 20 or CTEK and use weekly for a day or two.

Those Full River batteries are fully charged at 12.9 like most AGM’s but realize that the 12.9 is resting voltage and once the surface charge disappears they will meter in the 12.6-12.8 range but can drop overnight due to parasitic draw and the main will drop quicker than the aux as they separate at 12.7

Here is some info and tests on my system

https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/fo...ll-by-tank-customs-and-charger-testing.61493/

Hope this helps, it boggled my mind when I first got it and I just needed to understand how it worked and Shane and Mike from Genesis were huge help.

 

[WranglerMan]

Good point Wanglerman, I just bought a ESS disabler (https://www.smartstopstart.com/) that I have not installed just yet. I could install that to see if it triggers EVTS calls from the monitoring office. Sounds like with the ESS not reporting any error codes to the system from your experience, I think I'm half way there with confidence that I will have no problems other than JEEP - Just Empty Every Pocket and get a purchase past committee. LOL

Good choice for ESS… once installed it will give you no problems and the best part is you can leave it in for any work as it’s a pass thru module and won’t block anything using the OBDII port as it’s still plugged into the SGW so no worries of getting hacked either.

 

[Thinman]

FYI, the Noco's are 48% off right now as a Prime Day deal

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07W3QT226/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[TGG]

Figured I'd add this here.

I was having issues with my Genesis and charging (it'd drop to 12.7V which was weird as it wasn't charging the batteries). I couldn't figure it out, but then moved the IBS Sensor to the CRANKING battery and everything has now resolved itself.

Very easy mod... just ensure all tape is cut and you'll get the slack (and flip the provided NEG.cable from crank to aux/aux to crank).

Hope it helps anyone else:

 

[Wow 392]

Hi, Was considering replacing my OEM battery setup in the 2019 JL Rubicon with the Genesis Dual Battery set up for camping. Any issues with the ESS? Error codes from the computer (ESS or other) to prevent passing CA SMOG? NOCO GENIUS 5, 5-Amp Fully-Automatic Smart Charger to keep the main battery (batteries) charged in the driveway Ok and how to hook up? I have Mopar EVTS www.guidepointsystems.com Any issues with false positive calls? Any issues with the selenoid battery switch? Reliability. Starting problems if the aux battery goes dead? With a price tag of $1,800 (with Kit, Deep River batteries, Optional G screen Monitoring System, Tax and Shipping), you would think at that price some kind of promotion would be available. NOT. Anyway, If there are problems with this, it's no go for me. Any real life experiences out there in the Jeep Nation? Not interested in Tech Support or Marketing replies. Or go to the website. Been lied to before... Not interested in being a beta tester for Genesis either. Thanks,

We have had our JK setup for five years and love it, no issues

 

[WranglerMan]

@TGG you said you were having issues with the battery being at 12.7 volts, this is confusing to me as that’s pretty much a fully charged battery, so was the 12.7 metered directly off the crank battery ?

The reason I ask is I know the IBS normally goes to the factory negative on a stock setup but as you well know with the Genesis it goes to the aux negative and it’s actually monitoring the voltage of the aux battery but when the batteries are connected the voltages equalize and the alternator should apply the correct charging voltage as once connected it’s just one big battery.

I currently have my IBS connected to the aux as designed by Genesis and after driving my batteries are connected so I have an equalized voltage but once parked the voltage will drop off the main as the Cole Hersee relay & solenoid will pull power to stay closed and keep the batteries connected but once my main gets to the 12.7 +/- .1 the relay opens and the batteries disconnect and this is by design as you know and then when starting the Jeep once the main sees 13.2 for a few minutes then the relay closes and they become connected again and voltages should equalize.

If you were seeing 12.7-12.8 metered at the batteries then I would expect you to see close to that on the EVIC as the alternator sees the batteries as charged so no need to throw voltage to them.

I have considered doing the mod you just did awhile back but when I have metered my batteries directly at the source both have been in the 12.6-12.8 range and this is usually after being parked for 24 hrs and upon starting the EVIC usually displays 13.6-14 and as I drive it slowly drops and after a good drive the EVIC display is usually 12.8-13.0 so I saw no benefit in moving the IBS but it surely won’t hurt anything doing what you did I’m just trying to realize the benefit of doing it.

 

[TGG]

I was getting the ESS "Not Ready Battery Charging" message and my Voltage Display in the cluster and it was showing a constant 12.6~12.7V while driving.

I also noticed that when I removed the cable from the IBS Sensor the Volt gauge would jump to 14.3V immediately.

Now, the only change to my system was that I had just installed the newer IBS Sensor (Part# 68289207AC) to replace the previous, older one (with the older one, I wasn't having any problems.)

At any rate, I decided to try swapping the IBS location to the cranking battery and once I did everything went back to working exactly as it should. Go figure.

I included the photo to show that it could be done, that's all.

 

[WranglerMan]

I was getting the ESS "Not Ready Battery Charging" message and my Voltage Display in the cluster and it was showing a constant 12.6~12.7V while driving.

I also noticed that when I removed the cable from the IBS Sensor the Volt gauge would jump to 14.3V immediately.

Now, the only change to my system was that I had just installed the newer IBS Sensor (Part# 68289207AC) to replace the previous, older one (with the older one, I wasn't having any problems.)

At any rate, I decided to try swapping the IBS location to the cranking battery and once I did everything went back to working exactly as it should. Go figure.

I included the photo to show that it could be done, that's all.

Oh no worries I was just being curious, there was someone either here or another forum that did what you did and also added a power break in the wire that feeds the solenoid as he did not like it being energized when the Jeep was off…I saw no benefit in doing the solenoid mod but that’s where I got the idea of swapping the IBS.

I do know that when you disconnect the IBS it forces the logic to relearn the charging algorithm but not sure if it forces it to go to 14+ and then drops down as it relearns and i have no idea on how it learns.

I don’t use ESS as I have it disabled but do periodically look for any EVIC messages and even check ESS operation every so often but I also do bi-weekly battery upkeep with a NOCO 10 and once a month or so will break out a Odyssey 20 to do a deep cycle recondition but have found out from talking to NOCO about the “Repair“ option they have on the NOCO 10 and this basically does the same as the Odyssey but in less stages and goes into STBY when done so I may just start using that one instead of the Odyssey as it hangs on the wall next to my parked Jeep.

In the end I think with the JL or for that matter all newer vehicles it all comes down to battery upkeep as these newer vehicles all seem to be power hungry.

But you have sparked my interest again in this mod as it in all honesty it makes it more like the stock setup.

 

[Gorilla57]

Like TGG, mine wasn't charging the aux battery and I was seeing 12.7-ish on the dash. Totally understand this is normal for the "smart alternator" setup we have in the JL. The Cole Hersee relay/solenoid weren't closing and during long drives, I was draining down my my aux battery and rear AAL battery with my ARB fridge (plugged in the fridge the night before, 6hr drive in 100+deg heat). When I was arriving at my camping spot, the aux battery was already down to 12.4V. That's not good, as the Jeep wasn't gonna get any solar charge until the next day if there wasn't any clouds. So, first I moved the IBS to the main battery and everything was peachy, working like it should. But still didn't like the fact all the batteries were only getting 12.7V when the computer decided to only give them that much. Then I decided to just disconnect the IBS and get 14.2-ish volts all the time to all 3 batteries, so they are 100% topped off at all times. I haven't had a CEL for the disconnected IBS yet.

 

[WranglerMan]

@Gorilla57 I used JSCAN and turned off the IBS just for testing and ran that way for almost two months and never had any issues but doing this as you described just throws 14+ volts all the time to the batteries which is pretty much the way it used to be on older vehicles and it hurts nothing.

After testing I just put it back on thru JSCAN and went back to the varying voltsge.

I don’t have any constant power draw on the aux except the small amount that my winch solenoid has and the aux lights when turned on and then when needed I connect a portable air compressor to it, the main reason for its use for me is a jump pack.

What caught my attention was your Cole Hersee solenoid not closing as mine has never failed to work as designed and I have tested it a lot when first installing, I would test for correct operation by doing the below procedure

To begin, we want to make sure the isolator has the batteries
separated. To do that, simply disconnect the large 8-pin plug from the
blue isolator control box. Then reconnect that 8-pin connector and
make sure it clicks into place. This will kill the power to the isolator,
and it will disconnect the batteries if they weren’t already.

Now with a handheld multimeter (or the G Screen), record the voltage
for each battery here and there should be a slight difference

Cranking battery voltage (by the engine):

Accessory battery voltage (by the fender):

Next press the boost button in one time and release it.
You should hear a noticeable click sound from the solenoid.

Did you hear a click, if so the solenoid and boost button are working.

Now check the voltage on each battery again, voltages should be equalized

Cranking battery voltage (by the engine):
Accessory battery voltage (by the fender):

Now disconnect the solenoid as above again and start the engine, and then check the voltage of each battery again, this time the voltage on the crank battery should be 14+ and aux should be a lot lower since they are not connected and after two minutes you should hear that click and then aux should be the same as crank, also you can verify the solenoid is closed by a low resistance across the solenoid posts

Cranking battery voltage (by the engine):
Accessory battery voltage (by the fender):

 

[Gorilla57]

@Gorilla57 I used JSCAN and turned off the IBS just for testing and ran that way for almost two months and never had any issues but doing this as you described just throws 14+ volts all the time to the batteries which is pretty much the way it used to be on older vehicles and it hurts nothing.

After testing I just put it back on thru JSCAN and went back to the varying voltsge.

I don’t have any constant power draw on the aux except the small amount that my winch solenoid has and the aux lights when turned on and then when needed I connect a portable air compressor to it, the main reason for its use for me is a jump pack.

What caught my attention was your Cole Hersee solenoid not closing as mine has never failed to work as designed and I have tested it a lot when first installing, I would test for correct operation by doing the below procedure

To begin, we want to make sure the isolator has the batteries
separated. To do that, simply disconnect the large 8-pin plug from the
blue isolator control box. Then reconnect that 8-pin connector and
make sure it clicks into place. This will kill the power to the isolator,
and it will disconnect the batteries if they weren’t already.

Now with a handheld multimeter (or the G Screen), record the voltage
for each battery here and there should be a slight difference

Cranking battery voltage (by the engine):

Accessory battery voltage (by the fender):

Next press the boost button in one time and release it.
You should hear a noticeable click sound from the solenoid.

Did you hear a click, if so the solenoid and boost button are working.

Now check the voltage on each battery again, voltages should be equalized

Cranking battery voltage (by the engine):
Accessory battery voltage (by the fender):

Now disconnect the solenoid as above again and start the engine, and then check the voltage of each battery again, this time the voltage on the crank battery should be 14+ and aux should be a lot lower since they are not connected and after two minutes you should hear that click and then aux should be the same as crank, also you can verify the solenoid is closed by a low resistance across the solenoid posts

Cranking battery voltage (by the engine):
Accessory battery voltage (by the fender):

The solenoid closes just fine when the voltage is about 13.2 or something like that(easily witnessed when I throw my Noco charger on it). So, when the Jeep is running and only throwing 12.7V at the main battery, it doesn’t close. The system works perfectly, disconnects at 12.7 and reconnects in 2 minutes since I’m throwing 14.x volts at it all the time while running. I just didn’t like the fact the ARB fridge was draining the aux and rear battery while driving.

 

[WranglerMan]

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The solenoid closes just fine when the voltage is about 13.2 or something like that(easily witnessed when I throw my Noco charger on it). So, when the Jeep is running and only throwing 12.7V at the main battery, it doesn’t close. The system works perfectly, disconnects at 12.7 and reconnects in 2 minutes since I’m throwing 14.x volts at it all the time while running. I just didn’t like the fact the ARB fridge was draining the aux and rear battery while driving.

I do know in my case of using this system that when I park for a few days the batteries start off connected and as we both know the relay and solenoid pull power to keep them connected until the relay sees the voltage drop to 12.7 +/- .1 and by design it opens the solenoid to protect the main crank battery ( mine disconnects at 12.55-12.6 ) so very close to the 12.7 and once I start up my Jeep I usually see the EVIC voltage at 14+ volts and after a few minutes it connects and the voltages equalize and they stay connected and as I drive the displayed voltage slowly drops as the batteries become more charged.

I have on a few occasions and this has occurred normally after I have done a recondition charge with my Odyssey that since I don’t have any heavy load pulling on the aux and the IBS is connected to the aux after I have shut it down as the voltage drops and voltage gets down to 12.55-12.60 it disconnects upon restarting since the IBS is connected to the aux and it’s apparently a slightly higher charge since it’s not the crank battery charge it does not direct the alternator to throw a heavier charge since its reading the aux and the solenoid does not close but in my case it’s never presented a issue as usually on the next time I go out the aux has dropped enough to make the alternator throw more.

What’s confusing to me in your case is since your fridge is pulling power from the aux and rear battery I would think the IBS would have seen the reduced voltage and adjusted the alternator accordingly.

As I have said in the past when asked ….Is the Genesis system perfect …that would be a NO but for the most part it gives users additional power for aux equipment while protecting the main but in your case I can’t explain why it’s not throwing more voltage if your pulling power so your choice to disconnect the IBS makes sense and in the scheme of things I doubt it will shorten battery longevity that much over the life cycle of the batteries.

I would maybe suggest you reach out to Shane or Mike at Genesis to get their thoughts on your setup, I have spoke to them countless times and they are super to work with.

On a side note I have played around in JSCAN with voltage settings in the IBS as far as min and max voltages on what the IBS needs before it kicks in and I have even directed thru JSCAN to show no IBS present, it’s basically the same as physically disconnecting it and I have let it throw 14+ for weeks and weeks and have seen no ill effects on this.

There is also a small chance that the IBS could be having issues and not trying to take the Genesis system out of the spotlight but in the end the IBS is what directs what voltage is thrown and it could be as simple as resetting it by disconnecting it for 15-20 mins or replacing it but if what you are doing works then go with that.

I have considered doing battery swaps semi annually so I get even use out of my batteries but it seems that all the times I have checked my system they are connected with the few exceptions of doing a deep charge and I have since stopped doing that as often as I was and so far see no problems.

 

[Gorilla57]

It’s possible the IBS needed to finish the relearn process before I started using the fridge and went on my camping trip. So, it all could be a self induced problem. But, I swapped cables and everything before I played with it to see if something was wrong. The Genesis system works perfectly, as designed. I just wanted 3 fully charged batteries when I shut it down at a camp spot.

I also have a dedicated charge wire from the aux battery going to the rear battery. This helps run my dual ARB compressor and that thing likes 14+ volts when it’s running. So, having the Jeep charging at 14+ when I’m filling tires helps it run at a higher rpm.

Appreciate the trouble shooting write up. May need to use that info one day.

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