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BradyW

BradyW

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@BradyW sorry Brady. Will stop derailing your build thread. Mods are looking great 👍🏻
You guys aren't derailing at all. Bottoming out onto the bump stops is a major issue with the 392. My (non-custom-tuned) Fox 2.5 DSC's at full compression damping isn't enough to stop it. I'm working on a plan to address the issue and I think this is a great place to discuss the successes and failures.
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oceanblue2019

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You summarized it well! I'll try to verify when installing my lift but I've read that the extra-long bump stops on the 392 are to keep the axle off the engine and shouldn't be cut down. I haven't got this far in the build thread yet but in real life, I've installed Fox 2.5DSC's to try and reduce the bottoming out at the stock ride height. Even at 5 clicks of low-speed compression and fully maxed out high-speed compression damping (7-8 clicks) on the 2.5's I'm still bottoming too easily.

I'm installing a 2.5" Clayton lift and keeping my stock tire height. This should allow me to get an extra 1.5" of up travel in the front since I won't be installing any additional bump stops. (The lift is +1" over stock and I lost .5" with the winch up front on stock springs) If the lift Isn't enough I'll look at doing air/hydraulic bump stops as the last resort. The 392 blowing through its limited up-travel is the least talked about shortcoming of the 392 in my personal opinion. I love the jeep, but the bump stops shouldn't be such a familiar acquaintance when venturing off the highway.
The tall towers put the bumps down further without using raised bump stops. Not sure why Jeep did it that way but it is what it is.

The better way to go is aftermarket bump stops that go inside the front spring and mount to the perch. You can set in 0.5" increments to get what you need. I use the Synergies but many others work in a similar way.

You can then run an air bump which will make it a bit nicer to drive knowing you will be into the bumps more often due to that wonderful 392 between the fenders.

Think of the air bumps and bump stops like a sports bra for a really nice rack ;)

Have you cycled to see where it hits the engine? I heard it was oil filter related so perhaps a remote mount filter would get some more clearance?
 
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BradyW

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The tall towers put the bumps down further without using raised bump stops. Not sure why Jeep did it that way but it is what it is.

The better way to go is aftermarket bump stops that go inside the front spring and mount to the perch. You can set in 0.5" increments to get what you need. I use the Synergies but many others work in a similar way.

You can then run an air bump which will make it a bit nicer to drive knowing you will be into the bumps more often due to that wonderful 392 between the fenders.

Think of the air bumps and bump stops like a sports bra for a really nice rack ;)

Have you cycled to see where it hits the engine? I heard it was oil filter related so perhaps a remote mount filter would get some more clearance?
I haven't cycled the suspension to see where exactly the interface will occur. While Installing the lift I'll push the axle up to the bump stops while the springs are off and take some photos. 2.5" of up-travel is not enough for an off-road targeted vehicle. I feel like there are multiple areas of the 392 where the engineers laid out what was needed and were shot down. Exhaust cross-over pipe protection is another literal low-hanging fruit that I can't believe isn't better protected.
 

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I haven't cycled the suspension to see where exactly the interface will occur. While Installing the lift I'll push the axle up to the bump stops while the springs are off and take some photos. 2.5" of up-travel is not enough for an off-road targeted vehicle. I feel like there are multiple areas of the 392 where the engineers laid out what was needed and were shot down. Exhaust cross-over pipe protection is another literal low-hanging fruit that I can't believe isn't better protected.
It's likely a series of diminishing returns and we should all be happy they even put a 392 in a JL from the factory!

It would be really interesting when you cycle it to see where it hits; and then try to project beyond that as to the next hit, etc, etc.

I am trying to find the article on the oil filter being the issue but that might have been on a retrofit using the AMW kit. Could have been @Kevin8086 who mentioned that on one of their videos.
 

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I haven't cycled the suspension to see where exactly the interface will occur. While Installing the lift I'll push the axle up to the bump stops while the springs are off and take some photos. 2.5" of up-travel is not enough for an off-road targeted vehicle. I feel like there are multiple areas of the 392 where the engineers laid out what was needed and were shot down. Exhaust cross-over pipe protection is another literal low-hanging fruit that I can't believe isn't better protected.
My 2021 Diesel is the same as the 392. very little up travel due to longer jounce tubes. at full stuff, with bumpstops fully compressed there is a lot left on the table. Here is a pic with factory suspension and 35s with the XR wheels. I am looking at options for more up travel as well as I am in the bumps a lot compared to my other JLURs.

1C46EE87-5A89-489E-AB12-3B13AA2E8EE2.jpeg


29CE39D3-C9ED-4376-BA3B-45D45FFBC440.jpeg
 
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Phase 2: Basic Protection
For axle side lower control arm protection, I went with the Rock Hard 4X4 bolt-on skid plates. These skids are seriously beefy; hitting them off rocks shouldn't give you a moment's concern. I didn't have a torque wrench that went high enough to retorque the control arm bolts to 190ft-lbs, which had to be purchased. Without the torque wrench, I would have left these bolts under torqued, as getting them to 190 isn't easy. I struggled to get the front passenger control arm bolts reinstalled for an hour before returning to the forum to learn that torquing the front wheel will move the control arm in the mounting bracket. Using that trick, I got everything bolted back up in only a few minutes. My only complaint is that you have to remove the rear skids if you want to remove the rear shocks. Some of the other, more form-fitting, skid designs appear to avoid this minor inconvenience.

IMG-0480.jpg


IMG-0514.jpg




After seeing a few threads with the stock Rubicon rock rails bending into the body and their lack of horizontal protection, I searched for an aftermarket replacement. There are so many options for rock rails, steps or no steps, body mount or frame mount, pinch seam coverage or not, etc. Here are a few of the options I considered and the (maybe lack of) logic used to get to the final purchase decision.
  • First Love: LOD Destroyer steps. I liked the way they looked and that they were frame-mounted. I didn't like the loss of ground clearance, and I was worried that they wouldn't be durable enough if used as proper sliders instead of steps. These fears are probably unfounded, but I moved on in my search. A month later, I look back at this option and realize they wouldn't be compatible with my incoming belly skids due to the frame mounting and the way they don't cover the last few inches of pinch seam on the front/back bothers me.
  • Second Love: White Knuckle Offroad sliders. I liked how the tube is angled upwards to help protect the sider rocker panels of the body and how the rear portion of the slider is slightly wider than the front. I also liked that the White Knuckles were frame-mounted, but during my research on these sliders, I learned about the interference of frame-mounted sliders and belly pan skids. Belly skids are a high priority in my build, so I pivoted the search to sliders with body-mounted options.
  • Brief Consideration: Ace Engineering Sliders. I initially liked the look of the Ace sliders, but the idea of adding a slider over the top of the stock Rubicon rails seems to create multiple inefficiencies. The stock rails continue to occupy numerous mounting points, which would make the Ace system more rigid and "one" with the body if they were available. The stock rails also become extra weight without providing much additional protection while residing inside the Ace bars.
  • Final Decision: Rock Hard 4X4 Patriot Sliders. The longer I've had these sliders, the more I like them. Here is a quick rundown after a few weeks of ownership.
  • Pros:
    • Complete coverage of the pinch seam; these sliders have an OEM look covering the pinch seam from front to back. They look like part of the Jeep instead of an aftermarket accessory. I don't understand why other companies don't cover the entire body length unless it is to maintain compatibility with people who run tires so large they require body trimming.
    • IMG-0592.jpg
    • IMG-0586.jpg

    • They maximize mounting locations to the body. The Patriots utilize the body mount bolts and all of the stock Rubicon rails mounting points; this helps give a body-mounted slider as much rigidity as possible.
    • IMG-0588.jpg

    • Enhanced protection compared to stock rails. The Patriot's square tubing extends about 1.5" below the bottom of the body, whereas the stock rails are mounted directly to the bottom of the seam. The angled-up version of the Patriots also provides horizontal protection of the rocker panels. These things are beefy and should not flex under load, and I can't see myself riding trails where the enhanced strength of a welded-on frame mount slider would be required.
    • IMG-0587.jpg
  • Cons:
    • The angled-up versions of the Patriot sliders are not reasonable entry/exit steps if that is important to you. The tubing is handy for roof or windshield access, but it is too high to ease entry and exit.
    • Like the JL fenders, there is just enough space between the body and the slider for small pebbles to get wedged between the two. An appropriately sized door seal strip or tubing would eliminate this, but I've been too lazy to go down that path.
    • 579F03F6-C6F6-4C34-8A0A-0944D925FE16.jpeg
I didn't learn about the JL body bolt snapping tendency until after ordering the Patriot sliders, which was terrifying. I'll cover the install of the sliders in a separate post, which I think could be helpful for anyone considering sliders that utilize the body mount bolts.
 
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I hope you don’t live where salt and chemicals are sprayed on the roads because of snow. My Patriot sliders started rusting after their first winter and RockHard4x4 told me to kick rocks after pointing out a disclaimer on their site. Good product with a cheap coating.
 
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It was 82F on Christmas here in NTX this year and our society quite literally starts to collapse anytime it snows, ices or the temps drop below 20. With that said I do appreciate the heads up. I plan on doing a rattle can inspection after each wheeling trip to cover new scrapes and I'll be sure to check the general condition of the sliders as well.
 

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It was 82F on Christmas here in NTX this year and our society quite literally starts to collapse anytime it snows, ices or the temps drop below 20. With that said I do appreciate the heads up. I plan on doing a rattle can inspection after each wheeling trip to cover new scrapes and I'll be sure to check the general condition of the sliders as well.
That’s good. We just moved to the DFW a few days ago and won’t miss the snow or any of the negative impacts from it.
 
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Phase 2: Rock Slider Install.

The sliders were well packaged and had some form-fitting hard foam keeping them separated inside the box. My pro-tip of the day is to use one of these pieces of foam as a pillow/headrest as you work tirelessly to safely extract the body mount bolts.
8A88F730-F64E-4005-9680-D70B37956125.jpeg


Patriot sliders next to stock Rubicon sliders.
E2BF0EA7-F315-48B9-B1E8-6A2781D3B18B.jpeg


The Patriot sliders mount to the stock Rubicon rock rails mounting locations as well as the main body mount bolts. My pinch seam needed all 12 of the holes reamed with a 1/2" drill bit. My brother had some custom Dory decals made which went on just before this install. (Yes, there is some irony in using the landscape of a region enduring a generational drought as an aquarium)
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After reading all 37 pages of the broken body bolts thread I chose to follow the @twisty method. Here is the original method.
[
twisty said:
Got is all done. Finally.

My method (YMMV):
Plumbers torch is the way to go. One full minute on the front ones. Wait about a minute, torch again for 15-20 seconds.
I used a 1/2 socket with extension, it's a mother but I wanted more control so I didnt break the bolt.
Loosen a few arcs, then tighten half as many. Torch 12 seconds
Loosen a few more arcs then the spot you stopped at, tighten half as many, Torch 12 seconds
Now loosen until it gets tight or sometimes makes a creaking noise STOP. TIghten again half as many, torch 12 seconds
Continue same method. As you progress the it will take a while before it tightens up.

I used the torch on the other 4 bolts just to loosen them but they cam out easily. Except for the capture washer, you have to pry them out with a large closed end wrench in a jerking motion. LiteBrite has a video on it using a screw driver, my method was better.

Putting them in is a PITA, but sometimes you get lucky. I ended up shining a flashlight in there and moving the capture ring out of the way. Real easy after that.

I torqued at 85, book says 92. Funny no one chimed in on this, guessin must just tighten them not knowing. I will put mine in spec once I get a better torque wrench. Also I didnt loctite them in but instead used antiseize. Not sure how smart that is but I did it on my old CJ and was fine.

One reason mine took so long is I also applied some adhesive protection where your foot MIGHT hit the body when using the step. Went on real nice but still time consuming. Looks pretty good too.

Hope this helps someone. The job still sucked but the TORCH is the way to go. YMMV

]

And here is my report back from the install on the broken body bolts thread.
[
I used Twisty's method today to successfully remove the body bolts from my Oct 2021 JLU. The front bolts would turn notably easier after receiving their 12-15s warm-up burns from the torch so I'm a believer in that heat makes the job Iess risky. You aren't melting the Loctite but it doesn't appear to weaken it. I used a 250ft-lb capable torque wrench to Ioosen the bolts in order to have plenty of leverage for smooth and slow pulls. Using counter/stabilizing torque on the socket heads to prevent cross-loading on the bolt.

There is still red Loctite on the front bolts and blue on the rears. My bolts did not appear to have an excessive amount of Loctite on them like some people earlier in this thread.

I did break the spot welds that hold the retaining nut on 3 of the bolts. That pop and momentary loss of torque are TERRIFYING! Whenever the retaining nut breaks the spot weld it's best to use a drill or impact wrench to get the bolts started back on the tightening phase. Much, much easier than starting them by hand. The bolts that kept their retaining nuts welded in place were easy to start back by hand.

I was installing the Rock Hard 4X4 Patriot sliders so I used their included hardware instead of reusing the stock hardware. The Patriot bolts seem notably beefier and were confidence-inspiring compared to the OEM bolts. I torqued all 6 bolts to 95ft-lbs which feels less than whatever the OEM bolts were torqued to originally.
]

Picture of great success!
752C4B30-F418-4FAF-AA7D-08158099A4B1.jpeg


And the final result. I made sure to set aside enough time for this install to not get in a hurry and view the slow pace as an investment compared to what some people had to go through getting broken bolts out of their tubs.
B6B141D1-4207-447C-8872-033DB3D5D2CC.jpeg
 
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Phase 3: More suspension, please!

The stock 392XR suspension is perfectly suited for driving on the road. It has a bit more body roll than I personally prefer but overall comfort and mannerisms are better than you’d expect. When you get on the trails is where you start to see the shortcomings in the stock setup.

In 4-Lo the stock Mopar shocks handle the limited travel fairly well in first and second gear. Crawling over rocks and very slow trail speeds are rarely a concern. Once you get up to third gear speeds (5mph) the weight of the 392 starts to blow through the 2.5” of up-travel pretty easily. Riding light trails where you can cruise in 4-5th gear in 4-Lo (10-15mph) you run the risk of very hard bottoming onto the bump stops if you aren’t able to kill your momentum before each encounter larger than washboarding. We know a JLUR will never be a Raptor or TRX but I do think a 392XR should be able to stock Rubicon off the rocks without putting your spine in jeopardy.

The limited up travel on the 392 come from extra long jounce towers up front. The unconfirmed reason behind the longer towers is that they are required to prevent interference between the axle and the engine. This theory would explain why the regular 392 does not have shorter jounce towers or shorter springs than the Extreme Recon, despite have smaller tires. The lift height of the 392s, which is approximately 1.5" over a stock Rubicon, is the minimum amount of lift Jeep thought was needed to create a passable amount of up-travel in the suspension. I understand the decision to not lift more from the factory but do not agree that it was “enough” after my personal experiences on the trails and rocks.

Front 392 jounce towers.
1152F7BA-5343-43E9-84A1-1702C0F8BD97.jpeg


Front 392 Up-Travel.
5E0E85D6-6C25-46CD-8D22-A45B10738079.jpeg


My plan to attack this bottoming issue was to upgrade the shocks first to something with more compression damping power than stock. If the upgraded shocks were not sufficient by themselves, add an aftermarket lift while keeping the same tire size so that all the lift height gains could go to additional up travel.

Next Up: Fox 2.5DSC install, review and settings recommendations for stock height 392s.
 

oceanblue2019

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Phase 3: More suspension, please!

The stock 392XR suspension is perfectly suited for driving on the road. It has a bit more body roll than I personally prefer but overall comfort and mannerisms are better than you’d expect. When you get on the trails is where you start to see the shortcomings in the stock setup.

In 4-Lo the stock Mopar shocks handle the limited travel fairly well in first and second gear. Crawling over rocks and very slow trail speeds are rarely a concern. Once you get up to third gear speeds (5mph) the weight of the 392 starts to blow through the 2.5” of up-travel pretty easily. Riding light trails where you can cruise in 4-5th gear in 4-Lo (10-15mph) you run the risk of very hard bottoming onto the bump stops if you aren’t able to kill your momentum before each encounter larger than washboarding. We know a JLUR will never be a Raptor or TRX but I do think a 392XR should be able to stock Rubicon off the rocks without putting your spine in jeopardy.

The limited up travel on the 392 come from extra long jounce towers up front. The unconfirmed reason behind the longer towers is that they are required to prevent interference between the axle and the engine. This theory would explain why the regular 392 does not have shorter jounce towers or shorter springs than the Extreme Recon, despite have smaller tires. The lift height of the 392s, which is approximately 1.5" over a stock Rubicon, is the minimum amount of lift Jeep thought was needed to create a passable amount of up-travel in the suspension. I understand the decision to not lift more from the factory but do not agree that it was “enough” after my personal experiences on the trails and rocks.

Front 392 jounce towers.
1152F7BA-5343-43E9-84A1-1702C0F8BD97.jpeg


Front 392 Up-Travel.
5E0E85D6-6C25-46CD-8D22-A45B10738079.jpeg


My plan to attack this bottoming issue was to upgrade the shocks first to something with more compression damping power than stock. If the upgraded shocks were not sufficient by themselves, add an aftermarket lift while keeping the same tire size so that all the lift height gains could go to additional up travel.

Next Up: Fox 2.5DSC install, review and settings recommendations for stock height 392s.
That last picture tells me you only see 2.25" inches of up travel before the oil line on the shaft - is that photo really taken sitting on all 4's at ride height?

Also congrats on all the mud - happy to see your 392 is being used versus the paint slowly being polished off from the show-n-shine crowd.
 
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Phase 3: More Suspension, Please! Fox 2.5DSC install
(The build thread is almost caught up with real-life now.)

After being disappointed with the stock suspension's lack of bottoming resistance, I developed a progressive three-step plan. The goal is to upgrade the suspension progressively and stop executing the plan as soon Dory behaves the way I think it should on the trails. This post will cover step 1.
  1. Upgrade to shocks with more compression dampening
  2. If needed, add a lift kit without changing tire size or stock bump stop height, allowing all lift gains to go to up-travel
  3. Only if needed add upgraded bump stops or possibly air bumps
With the hope of not lifting the Jeep, I needed to find shocks that were safe to use at the stock height and be long enough to realize the benefits of a 2.5" lift if it was required. The spring rate and handling dynamics of a lifted Jeep won't match stock and therefore finding an adjustable shock was also important.

I decided to go with Fox 2.5DSCs in the 2-3" lift length variant. These shocks have longer extended lengths than stock (but not so long as to require a new front driveshaft like the MC RockSports) and shorter compressed lengths vs. stock. These dimensions allow you to run the 2.5 DSCs safely at the stock height without fear of bottoming the shock instead of the bump stop and offer increased suspension articulation vs. the stock shocks if lifted.
  • Stock: Extended Length-Compressed Length-Stroke
    • Front: 24.75"-17.25"-7.5"
    • Rear: 27"-18"-9"
  • Fox 2.5 DSC 2"-3"Lift: Extended Length-Compressed Length-Stroke
    • Front: 26.51"-16.34"-10.17"
    • Rear: 28.6"-17.43"-11.17"

Install of the shocks was pretty straightforward. The 2.5’s are harder to compress by hand than the stock shocks so I’d recommend dropping the axle in a controlled fashion to match the shock lengths before bolting up the bottom mount. I’ve done it both ways now and it’s much easier when you don’t have to compress them. Trimming the inner fender liners was really easy and very little needs to be removed to fit the remote reservoir hoses. The hardest part of the install for me was finding an Allen key to fit the reservoir clamps. The bolts are 2.7/2.8mm in size which doesn’t exist. (SAE doesn’t fit either) I found the biggest key that was too small between the 4 sets I own and had to wrap electrical tape around the tip one layer thick to get a tiny bit of grip on the hex.
FB58906C-3FF1-4F14-A96D-9608D9C2D478.jpeg
2DE030B7-EA0A-401A-B306-C7420715B527.jpeg
DF2F25DE-8093-4280-9239-430C2642547F.jpeg


On-road and off these shocks are a major upgrade over stock. You can adjust them between marshmallowly and overly stiff and anywhere in between. The low-speed compression clicker does a great job of controlling body roll in corners and adjusting the high-speed compression adds some control and progression to the limited up travel of the stock configuration. Off-roading rough terrain in the 392 gets the front shocks so hot they almost burn your skin to the touch, the stock shocks don’t hold up well. I am very impressed with the 2.5’s performance and adjustability. Once adjusted I found no increase in harshness over the stock shocks on road, only positives in improved handling and absorption. Off-road they helped the bottoming tendency quite a bit but didn't solve the issue to my liking. They are a big upgrade as they give the Jeep adequate damping but they can’t quite overcome the total lack of travel they were given. on to phase 2!

Here are my recommended clicker settings for a 392 on stock springs. My settings for the Clayton lift are notably different and I’ll provide those in the next post.
On Road: Slow Speed: 5 clicks from open. High speed: 3 clicks from open.

Off Road: Slow Speed: 5 clicks from open. High speed: 7 clicks (maximum) from open or fully closed.
 
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Phase 3: More Suspension Please Finale! Clayton Off-Road 2.5” Overland+ Lift

One day at Hidden Falls OHV Adventure Park was enough to confirm that Dory needed more travel, even after maxing the Fox 2.5 DSC's high-speed compression clickers. There were multiple bump stop bottom-outs on trails that are considered park roads. With the stock amount of up-travel, all obstacles are to be taken with no momentum, there just isn’t enough stroke up front to handle the 392 chassis in motion.

As a Jeep newcomer, it is shocking how many different lift kit options and price tiers exist.

I narrowed my choices to a MetalCloak 2.5" GameChanger and the Clayton Off-Road 2.5" Overland+. I view these kits as very similar and comparable, especially if you are going to run 26-27" length front shocks where the aftermarket driveshaft, shock relocation brackets, and wheel spacers are not required. I chose the Clayton lift but I'm fairly certain I would be just as happy with the GameChanger. I found the MetalCloak video showing misalignment capabilities of their joints really interesting but I learned through the installation of the Clayton that their Giro joints can handle significantly more droop and misalignment than my rear springs or shocks can handle so it's a moot point, for my use case at least.


The lift install was mostly straightforward, though it took me two full weekend days and one evening to finish. I didn't enjoy fabricating the rear sway bar links; it wasn't technically difficult but feels like a step below the bolt-on nature of the rest of the kit. I'm using the Rock Krawler No Limits sway bar links on the front so that cut my link fabrication time in half.

Sway bar link and control arm prep work.
EF64272C-A68D-44A3-9A22-0D85B682C0E6.jpeg



A41C15F6-46A0-41F5-8016-AC8A08C400D5.jpeg


I put on some Rusty's frame side lower control arm skid plates. They do help protect the brackets, but they are the most half assed and sloppy product I've ever seen from an American manufacturer. To say they don’t fit is an understatement. I won't be getting anything else from them.
4FEFB353-D979-48D9-94D0-76ED1B2A99A4.jpeg
DDBF3185-4586-40E0-861C-A53BBE6CABB7.jpeg


If you are doing a lift yourself and you get to the passenger front upper control arm bolt just get a punch and hammer the shit out of it from the back side. It'll scratch up but not dent the exhaust pipe.
FDCFFB69-EB7D-47EE-BE49-526449CCCA2B.jpeg


My biggest struggle with the installation was getting the rear passenger spring installed; it is long enough that you need to droop the axle as far as it will go with the parking brake wires in their stock location and at that point, the spring has to bow around the gas tank. A spring compressor that mounts on the outside of the coil would have saved me multiple Sunday afternoon hours so take note if you are planning to install this same lift in your garage. Compressing the spring with a floor jack and a square of wood and then kicking it into approximate place was step one. Step two involved raising the axle the perfect amount to be able to correctly align the top of the spring in the depression. None of the other springs gave me any trouble. I used a SafeJack with extensions, a regular bottle jack, and a floor jack on the install and there were multiple times I was glad I had all three available.

Post lift side shot. The front has settled about a 1/2" from this photo which is good, it was Baja raked before settling.
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Using the measure app on my iPhone the Clayton recommended lengths for the control arms have my caster exactly at 6deg when measuring on the two holes on either side of the front diff cover. The front of the garage floor zeroed out and the holes measured exactly 90 degrees.

The spring rates of the Clayton lift are notably higher than stock, increasing the slow speed compression clicker from 5 to 6 helps the shocks keep control of the springs on-road and off. Before the lift, I was running high-speed compression at 3 clicks on-road and 7 clicks off-road. With the lift, I have high-speed compression at 1 click on-road and off. I didn’t experience a single event off-road on my shakedown day to warrant more high-speed compression dampening.

For my shakedown run, I went to Cross Bar Ranch OHV park in Davis OK. This is the site of the Ultra4 nationals each October and it offers a unique mix of smoothish 4-HI trails as well as super rough trails that are almost exclusively broken rocks or broken rocks on top of solid rock formations. A perfect location to test out a suspension upgrade.

I started the day riding the first 1/3 of the smooth part of the ultra4 course, covering approximately 8 miles; I had ridden this same trail on the stock shocks and springs about a month prior. With Fox 2.5’s and extra travel of the 2.5” lift I was able to cover this same trail at roughly triple the pace as stock. It’s hard to describe how big of a difference the extra travel makes but I can promise you it wakes the 392 up in a GOOD way. Jeeping isn’t a race but by god, I’d like to go over 10mph without fear when things mostly smooth out and the lift and shocks deliver in a way the stock setup could never dream. The stock suspension had a bottom out or two on this trail after standing on the brakes before each obstacle. Lifted and shocked I didn’t bottom a single time and drove as fast as I felt comfortable over every obstacle. The suspension had more in reserve than I did…love it!

The 2nd 90% of the day was spent on the rougher half of Cross Bar’s terrain. I would describe these trails as kidney abuse on stock suspension but while still rough they are not painful with the extra travel. I drove a few portions faster than I would normally just to hit the bump stops but again could not find them. I am extremely happy with what the lift did to control the weight of the 392 off-road. I didn’t find a spot to fully flex out so that photo will have to wait. As I’ve said in a few other posts this is the way the 392 should have been sprung from the factory and the suspension finally matches the capability and personality of the engine.

A few shots from shakedown day.
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Trails are rougher than these photos make it appear.
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I highly recommend a quality lift to any 392 or diesel owners who are finding themselves on the bump stops more than they would prefer. Dollar for dollar the lift gives you more benefit than upgraded shocks in this pursuit but it certainly helps to attack it from both angles.

My build is now as complete as parts will allow. Waiting on Next Venture Belly skids, diff skids and covers. I hope they arrive before I take too many trips to Cross Bar or I won't have a diff left to attach the skid to! ;)
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Jeepeto

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First Name
Josh
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2021 JLUR XR
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2
Phase 2: Rock Slider Install.

The sliders were well packaged and had some form-fitting hard foam keeping them separated inside the box. My pro-tip of the day is to use one of these pieces of foam as a pillow/headrest as you work tirelessly to safely extract the body mount bolts.
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Patriot sliders next to stock Rubicon sliders.
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The Patriot sliders mount to the stock Rubicon rock rails mounting locations as well as the main body mount bolts. My pinch seam needed all 12 of the holes reamed with a 1/2" drill bit. My brother had some custom Dory decals made which went on just before this install. (Yes, there is some irony in using the landscape of a region enduring a generational drought as an aquarium)
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After reading all 37 pages of the broken body bolts thread I chose to follow the @twisty method. Here is the original method.
[
twisty said:
Got is all done. Finally.

My method (YMMV):
Plumbers torch is the way to go. One full minute on the front ones. Wait about a minute, torch again for 15-20 seconds.
I used a 1/2 socket with extension, it's a mother but I wanted more control so I didnt break the bolt.
Loosen a few arcs, then tighten half as many. Torch 12 seconds
Loosen a few more arcs then the spot you stopped at, tighten half as many, Torch 12 seconds
Now loosen until it gets tight or sometimes makes a creaking noise STOP. TIghten again half as many, torch 12 seconds
Continue same method. As you progress the it will take a while before it tightens up.

I used the torch on the other 4 bolts just to loosen them but they cam out easily. Except for the capture washer, you have to pry them out with a large closed end wrench in a jerking motion. LiteBrite has a video on it using a screw driver, my method was better.

Putting them in is a PITA, but sometimes you get lucky. I ended up shining a flashlight in there and moving the capture ring out of the way. Real easy after that.

I torqued at 85, book says 92. Funny no one chimed in on this, guessin must just tighten them not knowing. I will put mine in spec once I get a better torque wrench. Also I didnt loctite them in but instead used antiseize. Not sure how smart that is but I did it on my old CJ and was fine.

One reason mine took so long is I also applied some adhesive protection where your foot MIGHT hit the body when using the step. Went on real nice but still time consuming. Looks pretty good too.

Hope this helps someone. The job still sucked but the TORCH is the way to go. YMMV

]

And here is my report back from the install on the broken body bolts thread.
[
I used Twisty's method today to successfully remove the body bolts from my Oct 2021 JLU. The front bolts would turn notably easier after receiving their 12-15s warm-up burns from the torch so I'm a believer in that heat makes the job Iess risky. You aren't melting the Loctite but it doesn't appear to weaken it. I used a 250ft-lb capable torque wrench to Ioosen the bolts in order to have plenty of leverage for smooth and slow pulls. Using counter/stabilizing torque on the socket heads to prevent cross-loading on the bolt.

There is still red Loctite on the front bolts and blue on the rears. My bolts did not appear to have an excessive amount of Loctite on them like some people earlier in this thread.

I did break the spot welds that hold the retaining nut on 3 of the bolts. That pop and momentary loss of torque are TERRIFYING! Whenever the retaining nut breaks the spot weld it's best to use a drill or impact wrench to get the bolts started back on the tightening phase. Much, much easier than starting them by hand. The bolts that kept their retaining nuts welded in place were easy to start back by hand.

I was installing the Rock Hard 4X4 Patriot sliders so I used their included hardware instead of reusing the stock hardware. The Patriot bolts seem notably beefier and were confidence-inspiring compared to the OEM bolts. I torqued all 6 bolts to 95ft-lbs which feels less than whatever the OEM bolts were torqued to originally.
]

Picture of great success!
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And the final result. I made sure to set aside enough time for this install to not get in a hurry and view the slow pace as an investment compared to what some people had to go through getting broken bolts out of their tubs.
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Very nice! I really like the look of those sliders. Nothing over the top, but look to provide sufficient protection. I might have to file these away for later.

Awesome build man, that 392 XR looks to be a MONSTER.
 
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