Diesel JL Wrangler specs officially announced

JLURD

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Previous Ram Ecodiesel was 240hp 420lb/ft. JL has the redesigned 3.0. The Pentastar makes different numbers in Ram and JL already, this tinfoil hat shit is laughable.
My mistake...definitely gen3. Edited above with explanation.
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JLURD

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A discard pile for the gen2 ecodiesels is interesting, but I don't think they'd opt for the usdm wrangler as the target for the discards.

It's mostly due to service logistics: at some point the gen2 engine supply will run out and they'll have to make a new set of service procedures for all their dealer service departments to have on file.

There are also probably better vehicles to discard to assuming there is some parts commonality between the A630 and the L630(eu-market). Hypothetically a situation like: "We have some A630s to get rid of. Lets just send them to Maserati since they were going to rebuild and re-tune the top end anyways."

The engine start/stop also should have a beefier starter motor to handle many more cycles, and that seems like it would make it less likely they'd introduce a gen2.5 just to get rid of old stock.

the 442 number could be any number of things:
* old info/typo

* down-rated to make the pentastar more appealing
Pentastar is almost certainly more profitable for FCA. With that sales volume, all R&D costs have long since been absorbed. Then there is the "learn to work on an uncommon diesel engine" for the service staff. I mean, they have to learn to do it for the odd ram ecodiesel or grand cherokee, but maybe only one guy has to know right now, and maybe he gets an extra 5 bucks an hour. Purely speculative, but in the confines of the logistical cost, entirely probable.

* down-rated to make the EPA cut
EPA has some weird rules for manufacturer fleets. Wrangler can be less aerodynamic and get worse fuel economy because the grand cherokee compensates for it. I can say with certainty that the EPA also does this with the efficiency of the windows in my house! I think trucks are still allowed to pollute more, a half ton might be allowed higher torque numbers because it's seen as a work vehicle.


Can anyone think of easy ways to identify if the engine is gen2 or gen3? Does compact graphite iron look different from the previous cast iron? IIRC The turbo is different, is that easy to spot? Since we haven't seen the gen3 in the flesh yet, there can't be anything concrete, but it would sure be nice to be able to confirm it before shelling out 60k on a new vehicle
They won’t need to be ID’d...JLU is definitely gen3 hardware as the TFL link from back in ‘17 discussed. My mistake. The 38 ft-lb down-tune from the 1500 gen3 is either for fuel economy or cooling issues or both. Rest assured, Banks, GDE etc will have 480+ ft-lb tunes for the JLU 3.0 by Q2 2020 for sure.
 

plex

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Any words about the towing capacity, is it still going to be that crap 3500#?
 

harleypap57

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Any words about the towing capacity, is it still going to be that crap 3500#?
Yeah, I'd really like to know the towing also before we go buy a JT. We'd like to get a camper and the stupid 3,500# in the U.S. really limits what to look at.
 

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I would think the lower output compared to Ram would be at least in part due to TQ input limitations of D44 compared to the Ram rear axle. Think about this, the last year of 12V Cummins either manual or auto, did not make either the HP or TQ that ecodiesel did, these had Dana 70 out back.
 

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Yeah, I'd really like to know the towing also before we go buy a JT. We'd like to get a camper and the stupid 3,500# in the U.S. really limits what to look at.
The diesel may actually be a few hundred pounds less than the 3.6 because of the extra engine/exhaust system weight. However, the 2.2L JLU diesel in Germany has a 5500lb tow rating with an otherwise identical vehicle because they have both trailer brake and towing speed limit laws there. Tow ratings for the same vehicles sold here are less because they have to guarantee the vehicle can safely avoid a decaying oscillation of the trailer and brake in a safe distance from the highest speed limit in the country (85mph in TX) with no trailer brakes. In other words if you keep your speed to 62mph and use trailer brakes for loads over 4000 lbs or so, the JLU will safely tow 5500 lbs here.
 

JLURD

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I would think the lower output compared to Ram would be at least in part due to TQ input limitations of D44 compared to the Ram rear axle. Think about this, the last year of 12V Cummins either manual or auto, did not make either the HP or TQ that ecodiesel did, these had Dana 70 out back.
Doubt it...people have run 500+ lb-ft through D44s for years without issue. More likely an efficiency tune or cooling issues or both. They had to alter the gladiator front end to improve cooling under load. There’s also no mid-size or full-size pickup towing/payload/torque war to keep up with in the Wrangler segment so they can prioritize efficiency for fleet fuel economy purposes.
 

SecondTJ

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Any words about the towing capacity, is it still going to be that crap 3500#?
Yes it’ll be the same. The 3.6 is not the limiting factor in the low tow capacity.
 

harleypap57

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The diesel may actually be a few hundred pounds less than the 3.6 because of the extra engine/exhaust system weight. However, the 2.2L JLU diesel in Germany has a 5500lb tow rating with an otherwise identical vehicle because they have both trailer brake and towing speed limit laws there. Tow ratings for the same vehicles sold here are less because they have to guarantee the vehicle can safely avoid a decaying oscillation of the trailer and brake in a safe distance from the highest speed limit in the country (85mph in TX) with no trailer brakes. In other words if you keep your speed to 62mph and use trailer brakes for loads over 4000 lbs or so, the JLU will safely tow 5500 lbs here.
Yes, I never understood why Jeep JL's sold in Europe had a 2,000lb heavier towing rating than the JL's here in the U.S. I guess that makes sense with the speed limit and trailer braking.
 

CaliJK

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Yeah, I'd really like to know the towing also before we go buy a JT. We'd like to get a camper and the stupid 3,500# in the U.S. really limits what to look at.
For what it's worth, I use my JLUR with tow package to tow our horses. Combined weight of trailer and horses is maybe a touch over 4000lbs, and she towed way better than I thought. Mainly flat roads, speeds between 50-60 mph. Electric brakes. Not recommending anyone tow more than the posted weight limits, just sharing my experience.
 

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For what it's worth, I use my JLUR with tow package to tow our horses. Combined weight of trailer and horses is maybe a touch over 4000lbs, and she towed way better than I thought. Mainly flat roads, speeds between 50-60 mph. Electric brakes. Not recommending anyone tow more than the posted weight limits, just sharing my experience.
Great points... I not going to share my details but suffice to say... while excessive towing with 37's, up and down the grapevine and Sierras in CA (biga$$mountains) never have trouble holding 70.. Now those crazy guys in TFL CO certainly brought the 3.6 JT to its knees up that gauntlet mountain at full GCMW (max weight).. so some may need it.. But really, is anybody, really going to be towing ~5k lbs with 40's and hitting a difficult trail.. Most places you need to get that kind of weight to is a regular road and those RAM 1500's are hard to beat for comfort and ease of towing etc..

To each their own... I choose to stay light and quick as possible (trail ready). I do look forward to driving the 3.0 to see if it can really keep up with the 3.6 (reliably with light loads <4500lbs) in typical hard core trail conditions.. (I am not 2.0 hater, just like the 3.6 better, more usable RPM range 800 - 6700, less gadgets to fix).. if I am wrong I will be swapping out my 2018 JL with a 2020 3.0..

My expectations are low at this point.. But I hope to be surprised..

My 2 cents..

TC
 

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I think barring any Regen issues with extended trail use, the 3.0 is gonna be hard to beat for anything but technical rock crawling.

If the trail can support a 2-3 second spin up delay for the ecodiesel engine, the Jeep is gonna love all that low end torque.
 

Almost

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They won’t need to be ID’d...JLU is definitely gen3 hardware as the TFL link from back in ‘17 discussed. My mistake. The 38 ft-lb down-tune from the 1500 gen3 is either for fuel economy or cooling issues or both. Rest assured, Banks, GDE etc will have 480+ ft-lb tunes for the JLU 3.0 by Q2 2020 for sure.
That is looking far less likely since the EPA just made it illegal for any company to sell any race/off-road tunes defeating any emissions equipment. There maybe a black market that opens up from tuners outside the USA, but as of now all those companies have performed stop sales on anything that is not EPA compliant.
 

JLURD

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That is looking far less likely since the EPA just made it illegal for any company to sell any race/off-road tunes defeating any emissions equipment. There maybe a black market that opens up from tuners outside the USA, but as of now all those companies have performed stop sales on anything that is not EPA compliant.
Yea isn’t it amazing how 8 years of Obama and Co led to no such aggressive EPA action against individuals/tuners, but the supposedly deregulatory Trump administration manages to drop such hammers left and right? Who doesn’t love blue team vs red team duopoly politics amirite?
 

TCogs1

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I think barring any Regen issues with extended trail use, the 3.0 is gonna be hard to beat for anything but technical rock crawling.

If the trail can support a 2-3 second spin up delay for the ecodiesel engine, the Jeep is gonna love all that low end torque.
Really good point.. My Dodge Cummins was terrible in the sand due to the weight and slow spin up.. I hope they have this solved this with the 3.0..
 
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