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Dealer put "Anything less than a 10 on the survey is failing" on my Invoice.. How about delivering service that warrants a 10?

blnewt

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Based on my conversation with my service writer, I will assume that no they are not. Also, based on reading others experiences from service managers calling them about bad survey scores, I will also assume not.

When the service writer called me, she specifically said that once she received word from her service manager that my survey was turned in, she would give me a Starbucks gift card.

At a minimum, the service manager knows if I completed my survey or not.

Due to the calls I used to get from random managers at other places where I would fill out a survey, it seems the industry practice is the results are not anonymous.

1) I think if Stellantis wants to get real information, these should be anonymous.. and the dealer gets aggregated feedback. There should be at least an opt in model to give feedback to the dealer, if that is what the customer wants to do.

2) With my empathy/cynicism kicking in.. the only result of my survey would be that the service writer would be fired. She wasn't stellar, however, a lot of the issues that I had were beyond her control. She didn't do a great job of running interference for the customer, which should be part of her job.
I also assume the surveys are anonymous, that said I'm really hoping our current two vehicles are the last new vehicles we will have. TBH both dealers were fine regarding purchase experience. We factory ordered the JL and didn't need financing, so it was a simple transaction with only a vehicle inspection (which I went over w/ a fine tooth comb, thanks to a list on this site of all the things to check). The dealer tried to insist that these vehicles are almost certain to require expensive electronic repairs in the future, we passed and they didn't keep the heat on. Ended up buying an extended warranty from Tom Winkles (again from info on this site) and that was simple.

VW dealer was also a simple transaction, they knew I wasn't there to play games and just hammered out the deal and sent us on our way, we had competing financing that they were able to beat. Tried to upcharge the Nitrogen fill on the tires, told them to just replace w/ normal air but lol,, they let me keep them as-is w/ the cool green caps. A few other gimmicks but just kept deflecting and got out of there a couple hours later.

Having dealt w/ so many new car dealings over my 40+ years of buying cars I'm just so done w/ having to spend my time w/ dealers who think we're a bunch of gullible morons. The fact that dealers now seem to have the upper hand in many markets due to the vehicle shortage has to make the situation unbearable at some dealerships. Now getting a vehicle at MSRP is a badge of honor w/ some makes & locations, gives smarmy salesman more ammo, which should terrify the avg buyer :(

Service depts are another story, I rarely have a dealer repair that was done w/out any issues. Only warranty work will be done at the dealer, if it's a repair that I can't DIY I'll go to another independent shop. My steering box TSB was bungled, sending out as done w/ bolts only snug (not torqued to 100 ft lbs), fluid cap on the side of the motor, reused shaft bolt that's never supposed to be reused :( At least me Steering Stabilizer TSB was done ok, not torqued to spec but it wasn't upside down :)

Sorry for the novel, but dealers get me going. Good luck OP w/ your ESS issue, I bypassed mine so have no idea if it still works, hit that bridge down the road I suppose.
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If I thought it would have any sort of impact, I would in a second. It is clear to me that the dealer is not interested in good service. It is also clear to me that FCA is not interested in their Jeep brand image.

I will post it to a Google review when I get the ESS situation resolved. I know their service department reads those....
But wouldn't it make you feel better, just to throw it in their faces? Sometimes, that's a good enough motive. :)
 

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here is the real head scratcher from my POV - If I am the service writer or manager, and I see that you (the customer) are flagged for a survey, and I see you have multiple recent visits I am going to dive in to figure out why, what went wrong and then damn sure try to bring every thing back to par. No way with a straight face I am simply going to ask you for all 10s

Truthfully this should happen with all service visits, but to not even try before asking for all 10s seems like an open invitation for a really bad survey
 

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I picked up my Jeep the other day, and prominently displayed on my invoice was the following:

IF FOR ANY REASON, YOU ARE NOT ABLE TO SCORE US WITH THE HIGHEST POSSIBLE MARKS ON THE SURVEY, PLEASE LET US KNOW.
  • - REVIEWED MULTI POINT INSPECTION
  • - E-MAIL ADDRESS CONFIRMED
  • - DISCUSSED SURVEY / MY REPORT CARD
  • - CONFIRMED 10’S ARE ONLY PASSING SCORE
Here is the deal, if you are going to continue to deliver the same sh1tty service, the best that you can hope for is that I am not going to waste any more additional time in filling out the survey. For reference, my 2018 JLU is still under warranty until this summer. I purchased it in summer of 2019. I only use the dealer for warranty issues, as my experience with them is sub optimal at best. I even pay an oil change place to do my oil changes, as I don't trust the dealer to get the two years of changes at no extra charge done correctly. I will not let them rotate my tires either.

With the exception of one instance, my dealership is clearly confused on what sort of service is reasonable for a customer to expect considering the rates that they charge. Here is what I expect: (@JeepCares , FYI)
  1. I call the dealer service center to make an appointment. I discuss what I think I need done on my Jeep. The service writer puts this into the service order. The service writer is experienced, and asks questions about issues I may be having, so see if additional services need to be done. Unbeknownst to me, these questions stem from items such as TSBs that would affect my Jeep that I may not be aware of.
  2. Based on time, materials, and technician availability, the service writer negotiates an appointment. (I expect the parts that are needed for the agreed upon services to be in stock when I arrive, as they know I am coming)
  3. I bring my vehicle in at the agreed time. The service writer pulls my ticket, reviews what we discussed needs to be done, makes and additional notes, and I am on my way.
  4. I may get a progress call mid day from the service writer to let me know if things are on track.
  5. I come back to the service center. The service writer and I review what was done. I pay my bill, and leave.

That is what a SEVEN looks like. That is what I expect to be done. This is a reasonable ask, as this is the level of service I get with my cars at the BMW, Mercedes, Audi, GMC, Chevrolet, Ford, and Tesla dealers in the past. I end of putting 10’s on these surveys, as I got tired of service managers calling me up asking what was wrong.. and having to explain that I am paying a premium, I have high expectations. When you do what you are supposed to do, that gets you a 7. In this everyone gets a trophy culture, it is less hassle for me to mark it as a 10. I should give Tesla a 12 in comparison, as they have reached out to me to let me know when my airbag needed replacing. They sent a tech out to the parking lot when I was in the emergency room and did the airbag replacement on site. Doesn’t get much better than that for service. Another story, for another time.

The level of “service” I consistently get from my Jeep dealer warrants a 2. I am being generous, as that is because the service manager is a nice lady. The infrastructure around her is what is failing. Here was my latest experience:


I called the service center to make an appointment. I told the service writer that answered the phone all the info they needed to look up my account. I requested the following services:

1) Anything they needed to do for an annual service, minus any oil changes, or differential fluid fills.
2) I needed the clutch recall done.
3) I was still having wandering steering issues on the freeway. I wanted TSB 08-074-20 done

The service writer suggested a date to do those services. It was two weeks out, which was fine.

The next day, I called in again, as I forgot something. My ESS was not working. They had replaced the AUX battery once before. That corrected the problem for about a month. At this point, it didn’t matter how long I put in on the battery tender; ESS will would not enable. The service writer said that I would need to reschedule, as that would require additional time. That was fine, it was just scheduled for one day later than the previous one. No problem.

I bring the Jeep in. The service writer pulls up my ticket. This was the third service writer that I was working with. The ticket was empty. Nothing is in it. The service writer was aware that someone with my name had an appointment for that day and time, that was it.

I work with the service writer to rebuild my service request for the four things that I wanted done. I called my Uber, and went home.

I received a call just after lunch from the service writer. She told me that:

1) The wandering steering was caused by my aftermarket lift kit
2) The ESS failure problem was being caused by my after market stereo.
3) The clutch recall had been done
4) My engine air filter and cabin air filter had been replaced.
5) My Jeep was ready to be picked up.

So, I have read the TSB.. it is pretty clear, it says to fix it.. and has a specific paragraph about how to handle after market lift kits. I explained to the service writer that my lift kit was professionally installed, and that the 2.5” lift and 35” tires are well within FCAs specification limits; as is called out in the TSB. I also told the service writer that I needed her to update my ticket with: “The customer requested that TSB 08-074-20 be performed, and we refused to do it”..

I was put on hold.

I was then told that the TSB would be done. They would call me later in the day.

I got a call later in the day to let me know the parts were not in yet, and they would be in tomorrow. I was fine with that.

Tomorrow comes, I get a call letting me know that not all the parts had come in. It would take a week. Did I want to leave the Jeep with them, or pick it up? I told them I would pick up the Jeep, and bring it in after the holidays. I was told that they needed to keep the ticket open so that the parts that had come in didn’t go to another work order.. (hint: don’t make the customer care about your inventory management incompetence)

I asked about the ESS issue I was having, as I forgot to push back on that earlier. I was told that it was fixed with a software update. (which, sounded like BS)

So, I have my Jeep back for a week. I have that cool new gear indicator on the dash.

ESS still isn’t working. I checked the single lead for my audio equipment with a Fluke amp clamp to see if there was any fantom draw from it, there was none. I went ahead and disconnected it from the battery anyway.

I went ahead and charged the batters with my CTEK 7202 for 72 hours. Verified that the voltage on both the main and AUX batteries was correct. 12.3V. I did not load test.

I checked the relay to see if it was working. The Fluke registered 0V, which is what it should be if that is working.

The EVIC was reporting 14.6V, which means that the system was trying to charge the batteries, even though the voltage and the CTEK said they were likely fully charged.

I called the Service Writer up again. Confirmed that we still had an appointment. I let her know that the ESS was still failing, exactly what tests I had done, and that I needed them to look at it.

I also let her know that the TSB had been updated, and there was now an additional part. The updated TSB number was 08-003-21 REV A,and it was dated November 20, 2021. (we are in January at this point).

I came in for my new appointment, as scheduled.

None of the updates I had given her were in the ticket.

We went over what I wanted done, and I contacted Uber and went home.

I got a call in the afternoon to let me know everything was done, and that I could pick up the Jeep. Called an Uber, went back to the dealer.

I took a look at the parts list. The TSB that was performed was one revision old, and not the newest revision. I figured his out from the parts list.

I looked at the work item for the ESS. The tech tested the batteries, noted that the main battery had failed. Said “REPLACED BATTERY AND RETESTED” .. the parts list shows the part number for the AUX battery, and not the main battery.

My ESS worked on the drive home. It has not worked since. I put the batteries on the CTEK for three days. ESS still does not work.

I got a call a few days later from my Service Writer asking me how I was doing. I told her that the steering was improved, but the ESS was still failing and that I would try a few things to make sure it was still failing, and then schedule an appointment to bring it in again.

She let me know that I should have an email to fill out a suvey, and that anything less than a 10 was failing. When I filled in the survey, her Service Manager would let her know, and they would have a Starbucks Gift card for me!

WOW, A STARBUCKS GIFT CARD. I have a better idea.. how about, DELIVER THE SERVICE I PAY FOR. I don’t really need a Starbucks card. I can swing my own coffee.

I also understand this dealership gives folks free oil changes in exchange for good reviews on Google.

This dealer owns several Jeep stores in my area. I understand the customer experience is pretty sad at all of them.
I work for a large employer in the area, with an active car group chat. Similar stories are told with other FCA products.. including Ferrari and Maserati. Seems there are systemic issues all around.
I can't stand these 'give me all 10's' people.
I've had ONE good dealership experience, those guys got 10's. And that was only because my new Jeep was as expected and they didn't drag their feet or push me for fabric protection.
 

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willcasp

willcasp

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here is the real head scratcher from my POV - If I am the service writer or manager, and I see that you (the customer) are flagged for a survey, and I see you have multiple recent visits I am going to dive in to figure out why, what went wrong and then damn sure try to bring every thing back to par. No way with a straight face I am simply going to ask you for all 10s

Truthfully this should happen with all service visits, but to not even try before asking for all 10s seems like an open invitation for a really bad survey
I think that is the problem here. What you propose is what a good service manager, at a good service department would do.

My experience is that this service department doesn't care to do quality service. They hire the cheapest technicians that they can find, and churn them over. These tech's can't get the warranty work done in book time, therefore, the dealership loses money on every warranty job. This results in them not doing warranty work, and turning it away. I paid this dealer for my Jeep, so I am being a bit stubborn in making sure they do the warranty work.

This is the first time I have been asked to do a survey at this dealer! This is by far, not my first visit. I am wondering if Stellantis is pushing the dealers to do surveys as some sort of condition for reimbursement rate or some other financial incentive.

For my other vehicles, getting a survey request after each service visit is pretty much normal.
 

OutlawBeard

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Just a question. Are the surveys anonymous? If you put less than 10, does the dealer or salesperson know who it is?
Not anonymous at all... Honestly had I known that I would've never left a review. You can read my post earlier in the thread.
 

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Just a question. Are the surveys anonymous? If you put less than 10, does the dealer or salesperson know who it is?
No, that’s the problem with these surveys. Give them a bad score and they will either confront you about it, or make things rather uncomfortable when you need them for a warranty repair.
 

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Another survey-from-hell story...


When I bought my '19 JLR, it was a custom order and the deal was settled re: price and trade-in (meet or beat Carmax). My salesman was great, very helpful and nice guy.

The sales manager, however, was a complete and utter asshole. I thought I wouldn't be at the dealership very long considering the agreed-upon price and trade-in (and yes, was in writing). He still did the "I don't know if I can do that on trade..." bs and the wait-while-I-go-to-bat-for-you game.

Like I said, complete asshole. I was there for hours.

I didn't walk away because it was a custom order, 11% below MSRP, and my trade in was killing my shoulder. I needed to finish the deal.

Anyhooo...I praised my salesman on the survey, but gave the sales manger hell. He deserved it.

The salesman got in touch with me later asking what he did wrong. Apparently the ass hole blamed him for the survey. I was sorry for that, he was a nice guy.

What a crappy system.
 

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I've never been impressed enough by any dealership in 30 years of buying cars to give them a 10.

Before the last 10 years I was moderately satisfied by their performance. In the last 5 years customer service has been like a snowball headed for Hell.

There's something majorly wrong with the upper crust of these dealerships and car manufacturers.
 

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Based on my conversation with my service writer, I will assume that no they are not. Also, based on reading others experiences from service managers calling them about bad survey scores, I will also assume not.

When the service writer called me, she specifically said that once she received word from her service manager that my survey was turned in, she would give me a Starbucks gift card.

At a minimum, the service manager knows if I completed my survey or not.

Due to the calls I used to get from random managers at other places where I would fill out a survey, it seems the industry practice is the results are not anonymous.

1) I think if Stellantis wants to get real information, these should be anonymous.. and the dealer gets aggregated feedback. There should be at least an opt in model to give feedback to the dealer, if that is what the customer wants to do.

2) With my empathy/cynicism kicking in.. the only result of my survey would be that the service writer would be fired. She wasn't stellar, however, a lot of the issues that I had were beyond her control. She didn't do a great job of running interference for the customer, which should be part of her job.
I figured they weren't anonymous so that they can call you back and make things right. But I can see this quickly turning into a hostile environment if you score them low.

I was lucky that my salesperson was great and would recommend him. If anything, maybe Jeep/Stellantis shouldn't be hard on the staff about bad numbers and look at how many vehicles they sell or some other metric. Just something to not make a hostile environment for the customer.
 

jellis4148

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As a salesman for a CDJR dealership I understand why they are asking. It's honestly not our fault. Nobody is perfect yet Stellantis is asking you to say they are. Your survey on a purchase is emailed to you 72 hours after it is punched sold. If we don't get 10's, and a yes on certain questions it actually costs us, and the dealership money, allocations, and certain other things. I do agree some salesman don't come even close to deserving a 10, but if the guy tried, and was nice why don't you cut him a break and just give all 10's. We can't control what the finance guy does, and if you bash the finance part of the survey the only person it hurts is the salesman not the finance guy or even the sales manager. Everything rolls down to the salesman. So, if the sales guy did his best, help him out. Give a bad google review on the manager and finance or anyone else. That survey can hurt us sale guys a lot if it's not filled out perfect. Knowing that whenever I do a survey for anyone, if they attempt to help and seem sincere they get a perfect score. I know what it feels like to spend several hours or days being nice, helping switch stuff from one car to the next, make sure they one they bought is perfect, and try to make it a seamless process to get a bad score. Makes you feel like shit.

Look, I know there are some bad stores, salesman, manager, and finance. I've worked at the same dealer for 23 years. I do everything I can for a customer. I've spent a whole day trying to find the right car for someone only for them to not buy or get paid only $150 when I sell it. We don't get paid by the hour, only when we sell something. Yes, I have made good money, but at the cost of working a 12-13 hour day, missing my daughters school stuff when they were little or a date night with the wife all because someone walked in 15 minutes before we close, and wanted to test drive 4 cars and buy that night. We can't shut the doors right at 6 and say sorry you have to come back tomorrow. We have to do the deal that night to accommodate the buyer. You guys bashing all salesman have no idea what it's like. Yes I choose this profession, and I'll continue doing it. We have to make the customer happy. We have to make sure you download and log into certain apps, or push the Onstar button even if you don't want it, cause if we don't the store loses money and then we get yelled at.

So, how about you guys be a little reasonable and understand some of us do the best we can and give us a break. It's not our fault a lot of times. If you were lied to or something like that, I get it. I go over and above to to make it a good experience. All it takes is one little scratch from the factory, or a light to come on, or something not work for you guys to call us worthless and all salesman suck, and Carvana is the best because I don't have to deal with anyone and you don't deserve a good survey. All salesman are idiots. Of course I get on this forum, and see so many people ask a simple question that I would've shown at delivery like the ACC cover. That's been asked about 10 million times on here. That's usually the person that thought the salesman was an idiot, and they would've shown them that feature. Give us a break. We are doing our job. You have one or had a job at one time. How did you feel when you worked hard on something and when something that you had no control over screws up and you got blamed, lost money, and still had to smile and fix the problem.
 

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Dealership survey is an illusion of peril/control handed to the customer. "Your're unhappy, please don't hit me with this stick I will hand to you..."

It's just a tool to keep you engaged. Apathy is the worst response, not a "1" score.
 

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The reason they ask you for a 10 is because these are NPS-based surveys (Net Promoter Score). It's unfortunately become the standard unit of measurement in the Customer Service industry. You can read more about it here: https://www.netpromoter.com/know/

The Wikipedia article actually has a good recap of why it's not great: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_promoter_score

Basically, it breaks down 1-10 as such:
1-6 = Detractor. Usually unhappy customers who can damage your brand and impede growth through negative word-of-mouth.
7-8 = Passives. Usually satisfied but unenthusiastic customers who are vulnerable to competitive offerings.
9-10 = Promoter. Considered loyal enthusiasts who will keep buying and refer others, fueling growth.

Your Net Promoter Score is then the difference between the # of Detractors and Promoters.

It's somewhat accurate, TBH, in terms of how I usually complete surveys, but business folks have taken it to the extreme, basically considering everything less than a 9 to be a Detractor, from a functional standpoint, which is what drives the "ONLY GIVE ME 10s PLEASE" hysteria.
 
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As a salesman for a CDJR dealership I understand why they are asking. It's honestly not our fault. Nobody is perfect yet Stellantis is asking you to say they are. Your survey on a purchase is emailed to you 72 hours after it is punched sold. If we don't get 10's, and a yes on certain questions it actually costs us, and the dealership money, allocations, and certain other things. I do agree some salesman don't come even close to deserving a 10, but if the guy tried, and was nice why don't you cut him a break and just give all 10's. We can't control what the finance guy does, and if you bash the finance part of the survey the only person it hurts is the salesman not the finance guy or even the sales manager. Everything rolls down to the salesman. So, if the sales guy did his best, help him out. Give a bad google review on the manager and finance or anyone else. That survey can hurt us sale guys a lot if it's not filled out perfect. Knowing that whenever I do a survey for anyone, if they attempt to help and seem sincere they get a perfect score. I know what it feels like to spend several hours or days being nice, helping switch stuff from one car to the next, make sure they one they bought is perfect, and try to make it a seamless process to get a bad score. Makes you feel like shit.

Look, I know there are some bad stores, salesman, manager, and finance. I've worked at the same dealer for 23 years. I do everything I can for a customer. I've spent a whole day trying to find the right car for someone only for them to not buy or get paid only $150 when I sell it. We don't get paid by the hour, only when we sell something. Yes, I have made good money, but at the cost of working a 12-13 hour day, missing my daughters school stuff when they were little or a date night with the wife all because someone walked in 15 minutes before we close, and wanted to test drive 4 cars and buy that night. We can't shut the doors right at 6 and say sorry you have to come back tomorrow. We have to do the deal that night to accommodate the buyer. You guys bashing all salesman have no idea what it's like. Yes I choose this profession, and I'll continue doing it. We have to make the customer happy. We have to make sure you download and log into certain apps, or push the Onstar button even if you don't want it, cause if we don't the store loses money and then we get yelled at.

So, how about you guys be a little reasonable and understand some of us do the best we can and give us a break. It's not our fault a lot of times. If you were lied to or something like that, I get it. I go over and above to to make it a good experience. All it takes is one little scratch from the factory, or a light to come on, or something not work for you guys to call us worthless and all salesman suck, and Carvana is the best because I don't have to deal with anyone and you don't deserve a good survey. All salesman are idiots. Of course I get on this forum, and see so many people ask a simple question that I would've shown at delivery like the ACC cover. That's been asked about 10 million times on here. That's usually the person that thought the salesman was an idiot, and they would've shown them that feature. Give us a break. We are doing our job. You have one or had a job at one time. How did you feel when you worked hard on something and when something that you had no control over screws up and you got blamed, lost money, and still had to smile and fix the problem.
Thank you for sharing your viewpoint.

I refuse to accept the premise that doing your job merits a "10" on a survey. Doing your job in my book is a "7". Doing exceptional work is a "10"

Let's take a restaurant as an example. I paid $560 for a nice dinner and a decent bottle of wine with my wife. The survey asked "The food was served at the appropriate temperature." For the price I paid, there is only one acceptable answer. The restaurant is not getting a "10" for that. That is an expectation, that is a "7".

I don't understand why they send out surveys for the sales department. There are much better and more tangible metrics that actually matter. For example, customer entries to sales conversion ratio, repeat sales numbers, etc.

This is about the service department. I pay a premium for service, it is fair that I get the service I paid for.

If I have a bad experience, I am allowed to give a bad rating.

If the Service Manager punishes the wrong person for that bad rating, that is the fault of the piss poor management skills of the manager. A smart manager gives credit where it is due, and fixes issues where they need to be fixed. A customer survey is a great tool to gain insight and the perception from the customer viewpoint. The source of revenue.

Blaming the service writer for a bad technician, or a salesperson for a bad finance person.. that is idiotic, and does not improve the customer experience at all.

At the end of the day, customer experience is what drives revenue and profit.
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