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Chadillac

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I like you profile photo. It reminds me of a photo of my son at Oceano Dunes (Pismo). All I can say is that was a costly day...
I can imagine. My Jeep sand dune jumping days are over. I've broken engine & transmission mounts, shocks, springs and lost my rear driveshaft. The worst part is driving home in FWD, a pop bottle and duct tape holding the transfer case fluid in, horrible death-wobble, and the engine and transmission loosely connected to the Jeep.
 

Red Willy

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Actman

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I can imagine. My Jeep sand dune jumping days are over. I've broken engine & transmission mounts, shocks, springs and lost my rear driveshaft. The worst part is driving home in FWD, a pop bottle and duct tape holding the transfer case fluid in, horrible death-wobble, and the engine and transmission loosely connected to the Jeep.
This happened while flat towing back home...

20190203_164808.jpg
 

Traveller128

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Yeah, be a smartass to customer service. That will get you somewhere.
Kinda get where he's coming from. Since FCA has not addressed this well, they could use a little fish across the face slap to maybe get them to take notice. They've ticked people off with the band-aids slapped over a poor design.
 

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Traveller128

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I fixed my “where the hell is my Willys” issue. And fixed my have to regear the 3:45 issue. Picked this up today 17345 miles. 2.5 years more warranty. $31,000. Cold Weather Tow package and a few more goodies!
Jeep Wrangler JL Clutch Recall (2/23/23): Clutch Pressure Plate May Overheat -- Affecting 70,000 Manual Jeep Wranglers and Gladiators 20190203_164808
Awesome! Looks good!
 

Toycrusher

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This happened while flat towing back home...

Jeep Wrangler JL Clutch Recall (2/23/23): Clutch Pressure Plate May Overheat -- Affecting 70,000 Manual Jeep Wranglers and Gladiators 20190203_164808
I jumped a Zuki Samurai many years back and the transmission mount broke, dropping the driveline. Was only a few miles from home and had my brother hold the t-case up in place by the shift lever while I drove 🤣🤣🤣
 

IanNubbit

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Ok question, I have the CF2 installed. What are the chances the dealer can or would willingly remove the detune software patch from the last recall? I would very much like that gone...???
We have no ability to do such
 

mwilk012

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Kinda get where he's coming from. Since FCA has not addressed this well, they could use a little fish across the face slap to maybe get them to take notice. They've ticked people off with the band-aids slapped over a poor design.
There is absolutely nothing the lady on the phone can do about it. The process has already begun to have engineering develop a proper repair and once approved then the reimbursement can be processed.
 

IanNubbit

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I'll get it wrong but will try.

The first recalls (2018--20) focused on the hydraulic system, specifically a concern about bubbles in the lines reducing the ability to retract the clutch plate. This "really happens"; there are YouTube videos showing a 50% or greater drop in hydraulic pressure from small bubbles in the lines. The general idea was that clutches were prematurely wearing because they were slipping during shifts. The fix was first a different hose, then a sleeve on that hose to reduce thermal effects.

The 2020 recall moved toward the clutch itself and was based on general overheating leading to material failure above 900-1100F. The action taken was to stop the cause, namely force a shutdown (limp mode) to avoid a catastrophic failure. Because there is no temperature sensor, a proxy was used: The software determines heating conditions (presumably based on mismatched input and output rpm) and estimates temperature. This "really works" because the numbers are available and this type of materials science is easy.

Despite recalls, clutches and/or pressure plates have continued to fail. Near 50, with one reported injury. The number of warranty repairs not showing up as nhtsa complaints is unknown. Anecdotally, people have reported 90k+ miles on the factory clutch, and others fail under 10k. The worst failure mode is around 50 out of 50-100k vehicles, one per thousand. Catastrophic, where material ejects through the bell housing and clips a fuel line, maybe a tenth of that.

Reported failures seem correlated with towing, highway speeds, and normal on-road driving conditions. The software has reportedly entered limp mode in some 4L/off-road scenarios and self resolved by letting the vehicle cool a while.

There has been no public notification of manufacturer-official root cause. Comments you see are speculation, as is any comment about the repair. Note that at least one aftermarket clutch also replaces the hydraulics. Mid April is the expected date for an announcement from Stellantis.
Only thing I could say to add to this is there has been ~50 explosive failures, I've seen many more Techs with pictures of fractured and warped pressure plates, well beyond 50, so you know there is many more then even that, they just get noticed before big boom.
If we want to do some real speculation on what the fix will be, this is what I would put my money one. A solid flywheel, not one with movement built in and gaps from friction area and center hole, this will resolve issues with warping, which will prevent slippage, and ultimately explosions. Now my hope is they also go back to a standard single disc clutch as it can be lighter than a dual friction with a heavy flywheel, and that might be what they need to prevent Start/Stop issues over time. I also thing a software update to change Start/Stop engagement will be a good idea, I'm suspecting that the engine starting at the top of clutch travel, meaning that everytime you re-start at a light etc., you end up slipping the clutch slightly. I would suspect this gets changed to not starting until the clutch is fully disengaged and on the floor like required for a normal start.
So, Big thing is a fully solid flywheel, realistic hope is return to a single disc, and least likely but possible is removal of Start/Stop or changing of operation. Bare minimum a new flywheel is needed or I recommend everyone A.) complain to Jeep directly about not changing after a 3rd recall, and B.) Replace it ASAP with anything that has a single piece solid flywheel.
 

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Traveller128

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There is absolutely nothing the lady on the phone can do about it. The process has already begun to have engineering develop a proper repair and once approved then the reimbursement can be processed.
Yes, but they can pass along the frustration up the chain, and since it was typed, they have something to show up the chain also.

I'm not saying be rude, but lets face the fact that the can has been kicked down the road long enough. Their reply didn't make sense, it was a partially canned response.
 
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OldGuyNewJeep

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I'm going to wait to see what the Jeep fix is, but I'm guessing I'll be disappointed with what Jeep comes up with and will most likely be buying an ACT clutch.
Please, please, please post a review if you go that route. @Actman, do you have any review videos? Saw the install one and it is absolutely fantastic.
 

Actman

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Please, please, please post a review if you go that route. @Actman, do you have any review videos? Saw the install one and it is absolutely fantastic.
Thanks for the props. No review videos yet. As I have said somewhere (not sure what thread), the best thing I can say about driving with our clutch is you find yourself not thinking about the clutch.
 

Stengaaa

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@Actman have you tried pulling a Tommy boy and seeing if jeep would use your clutch’s as a fix to the recall? I don’t mean it in a bad way at all I’m just thinking it would be a solution that helps everyone get what they need out of a bad situation
 

azwjowner

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Thanks for the props. No review videos yet. As I have said somewhere (not sure what thread), the best thing I can say about driving with our clutch is you find yourself not thinking about the clutch.
I'm also interested in learning more. Some sort of video would be helpful. My JL is my first manual car and all I know is from internet searches ACT seems to have a longstanding good reputation in the usual clutch car (Honda, Subaru, etc.) crowd, but I know nothing about shopping for aftermarket clutches and I would be interested in a comparison between Centerforce and ACT to understand the different approaches. I like that the ACT clutch doesn't replace the hydraulics. I wonder why Centerforce needs to replace the hydraulics.
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