Clutch Fire (1 Day After Recall) Burns 2018 JLU to the Ground

[roaniecowpony]

So what I take away is that if our hydraulic system is intact, has been moved away from heat sources, and bled properly, then the clutch itself should be fine... IDK I already got the a ok for a new clutch so might just do it to feel safe and sound. The CF II looks like it can handle almost 200 ft/lbs more than our 3.6 puts out so overkill but so be stout and last the life of the Jeep I'll assume...

Well, it's a theory at this point. But something that supports it is the fact that this event happened while she was cruising along down the highway. So, IF we believe the hydraulic line or slave is overheating to the point the fluid boils and expands to exert force on the pressure plate and letting it slip, the fact that this event happened to the young lady while just cruising along, supports the concept that heat from the exhaust manifold radiation could have the cumulative effect needed to cause the boiling of the fluid. But it's just a theory at this point. Like I said, if I had a manual trans JL, I'd put some kind of temperature monitoring on the line and slave.

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[roaniecowpony]

So this software fix is a torque reduction? Who wants that?

 

[nomographer]

So you are saying with a fair amount of certainty that it isn't the clutch mechanism or metallurgy, but a hydraulics issue? So are we going overboard replacing our clutches? The girl that started this post whos Jeep exploded, had just had the recalls done the day before, so perhaps they didnt bleed it properly leading to catastrophic failure?

It was my thought upthread that it could have been slipping while the computer thought it was in neutral thus preventing the software from calculating the correct temperature and entering limp mode. If there were bubbles in the line, each shift could have only partially released leading to faster heating. Even if the system would have failed the physical clutch test, it's unlikely to have chosen that precise day to fail, strongly suggesting the maintenance as the culprit.

The trouble is the hydraulic lines degrade as part of regular use. They are a "wear item". If a line gets crusty or brittle, it's your responsibility to replace them. So now you have two competing claims of "wear items", with the real/traditional item leaving to a non-wear catastrophic failure in the second? That's... bad.

I'm sure hoping this one was just severe incompetence during the maintenance.

The current "argument" in favor of the CF is to stop the link between the first wear item failing and the second going catastrophic. Namely, "the CF pressure plate won't fracture on heating but you won't be able to shift and you'll need a new clutch".

I'm not sure what Stellantis does here. They'd have to do annual clutch inspections and hydraulic pressure checks, and they might call it "routine maintenance". They might just be waiting for the lawsuits because even doing that much is a "waste of money" if they're still going to be forced to replace all clutches.

 

[nomographer]

So this software fix is a torque reduction? Who wants that?

No. It's an offset calculation between the output and input shafts used to determine statistical slip amount and, by extension based on the heating properties of the materials, a computed transmission temperature. Above 800F (or so), below the failure temperature, it enters limp mode to avoid failure.

All metals fail, either by melting or shattering. They simply do so at different temperatures. The clutch shouldn't be in operation at 1100F.


I wonder if they checked the transmission fluid levels, forgot to put the plug back in, and all the oil boiled over? Based on the above description of bending of the shaft, the assembly that failed here must have been very hot. Perhaps the next recall will be to drill a hole in the transmission housing to install a real temperature sensor.

 

[JessBiron]

Would anyone stay with a manual after that happened to them?

Honestly. Even tho it was MY jeep.. I am still considering the manual, even after this ordeal.. I've been driving manuals since age 16. Drove an automatic for a year and a half and turned back to manuals. I just feel (ha) safer cause I have more control. This was definitely a mechanical failure. Jeep knew there was an issue. Which is why they issued a recall.. and sadly the recall was "band-aid" fix to the real problem. This recall was to lower torque from the engine so the clutch didn't slip.. they put a poor clutch in it for those years. And it seems as if they fixed it later realizing their error. It has been a tragic week (and day) but it was the way they made it

 

[Cutterone]

Still think I’m gonna go CF clutch so I’m not worried with my kids in the back. Another reason I didn’t look at a 4xe, I’m not fond of my kids sitting right on top of a giant battery. I’m sure it’s safe just makes me uneasy I guess

 

[Cutterone]

Honestly. Even tho it was MY jeep.. I am still considering the manual, even after this ordeal.. I've been driving manuals since age 16. Drove an automatic for a year and a half and turned back to manuals. I just feel (ha) safer cause I have more control. This was definitely a mechanical failure. Jeep knew there was an issue. Which is why they issued a recall.. and sadly the recall was "band-aid" fix to the real problem. This recall was to lower torque from the engine so the clutch didn't slip.. they put a poor clutch in it for those years. And it seems as if they fixed it later realizing their error. It has been a tragic week (and day) but it was the way they made it

Problem is they haven’t been too forthcoming with what or if they ungraded any actual parts, would be nice to know

 

[JessBiron]

After reading the first few pages of the comments here its clear most of you arent familiar with what the recalls actually did. Judging from the pictures posted, the clutch slipped and over heated causing it to come apart. Im guessing the dealer missed something during the recall.....specifically the clutch health test portion of the recall.

Also the dealer didnt detune the engine. The flash update gave the pcm the logic to monitor clutch temps via a algorithm. The engine only is limited when everything in the algorithim is met. There is more to this story both from the dealer and the driver

It had slipped here and there and that's when I asked about it and I was told this will fix the problem. I had been driving for about 40mins on the i5 and it was perfect after they "fixed" it. Then out of truly no where the pedal dropped and to my right a man was waving to me to pull over. Immediately I did he got out of his truck waving his arms saying "get out..your on fire" so I got my dogs and ran. The pedal drop was my ONLY warning somthin was up. He said the fire had just began underneath my car. Within a few moments it was a blaze.

 

[roaniecowpony]

Like I said earlier, I just don't think they know what the root cause is. They are just treating symptoms.

 

[intentsrig]

You know Stellantis already had a stats guy run the numbers. How many have had this happen, costs to replace ALL parts needed for a fix

Safe to assume at this point it’s cheaper to pay potential wrongful death lawsuits and a warranty approval here and there vs a total parts fix recall. I remember in one of my stats claas the professor talking about auto defects/ deaths Involved. And usually it’s cheaper to just pay the lawsuits. They know they had an issue but simply don’t care. All about $$.

Unless they are working on a parts fix but we’ll see!

 

[Old Dogger]

Wranglers can be replaced, but her and her dogs can not be. Thankfully, nobody got hurt!

 

[azwjowner]

It had slipped here and there and that's when I asked about it and I was told this will fix the problem. I had been driving for about 40mins on the i5 and it was perfect after they "fixed" it. Then out of truly no where the pedal dropped and to my right a man was waving to me to pull over. Immediately I did he got out of his truck waving his arms saying "get out..your on fire" so I got my dogs and ran. The pedal drop was my ONLY warning somthin was up. He said the fire had just began underneath my car. Within a few moments it was a blaze.

Thank you so much for sharing your story. I have a 2022, but now I know that if my clutch ever acts up I will not mess around and IMMEDIATELY pull over to investigate. You may save other people's lives.

 

[BuyHold]

Honestly. Even tho it was MY jeep.. I am still considering the manual, even after this ordeal.. I've been driving manuals since age 16. Drove an automatic for a year and a half and turned back to manuals. I just feel (ha) safer cause I have more control. This was definitely a mechanical failure. Jeep knew there was an issue. Which is why they issued a recall.. and sadly the recall was "band-aid" fix to the real problem. This recall was to lower torque from the engine so the clutch didn't slip.. they put a poor clutch in it for those years. And it seems as if they fixed it later realizing their error. It has been a tragic week (and day) but it was the way they made it

Your manual is dead. Long live the manuals.

 

[JessBiron]

Thank you so much for sharing your story. I have a 2022, but now I know that if my clutch ever acts up I will not mess around and IMMEDIATELY pull over to investigate. You may save other people's lives.

That is my main goal! If I had planned to go hiking out of service, in the gorge (forest everywhere). I can't even imagine how tragic this could have been. But decided to take my uncle up on the stubby bumper so I was on the freeway and thank the lord I was. I can't imagine how terrible this could've been for me and the 2 dogs.. and the trees.. I had no idea I was on fire till the good Samaritan signaled me over. Considering how terrible this incident was, I was/am so fortunate for being where I was, when i was.

 

[58Willys]

If the hydraulic fluid gets overheated, or there is air in the line that gets hot and expands; this could slightly disengage the clutch, causing it to slip and heat up. However, even if this were the case, the clutch/flywheel shouldn’t grenade. If the clutch is slipping, it should eventually slip enough to cause a loss of forward progress, or if recall has been done, then the recall programming should cut power to the engine.

IMO, someone has to get a hold of the friction disks from one of these failures and examine it for wear and glazing. If the disk is worn and/or glazed this would indicate slipping; which could be caused by hot hydraulic fluid. If the disk is not worn or glazed, then this tells me the flywheel or pressure plate design/engineering/quality is at fault.

In Jess’s case, the clutch went to the floor; then it grenaded. If a hydraulic line burst, fine; but why did the clutch explode after that? Or were small pieces of the clutch/flywheel flying apart and one cut the hydraulic line?

Probably enough of these cases to get a class action lawsuit going. Only problem with class action suits is the lawyers walk away with millions and we get $500 off our next Jeep purchase. Hopefully NTSB will get FCA to replace this faulty assembly.

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