Bumper mounted Swing out Tire carrier vs. HD replacement hinge tire carrier

  1. RubiSc0tt

    RubiSc0tt Well-Known Member

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    Examples: Something like an LOD Destroyer Rear Tire Swingout or Smittybilt Atlas vs. something like a Motobilt or an Ace (Not Mopar, Rugged Ridge, or Smitty/Spartacus). .

    I get that the bumper mounted one moves the tire outward and puts all the force on one point. I understand you'll have a better departure angle with an HD hinge replacement type of carrier. Not necessarily looking for that kind of feedback, more Looking for input and first hand experience with both. Drawbacks, flaws, etc. 35's -40's.

    For a long time, I was of the school of thought I'd rather have the weight of the tire off the tailgate. I had swingouts on both of my TJ's. I understood the drawbacks of the swingout, but ultimately i thought the positives outweighed the negatives. I started looking at the Ace and Motobilt, the heavy duty hinge replacement types that are capable of carrying 35-40's. I thought I was sold on that. Then a friend who is a mechanic at a Jeep dealer posted some pictures of a JLUR with one of those kind of carriers, with stress cracks where it attaches to the body, and the tailgate cracked and bending. The Jeep was only using 35's. It seems you may still be beholden to the limits of the mounts in the body.

    I'm not buying yet but I am curious. my plan is to run 35-40's with a full size spare. it's a daily driver, so no, running no spare is not an option. Likewise, neither is putting the spare inside.

    Curious of the collective experience of the forum. I've seen good evidence and arguments for both, but I'm starting to think about cost vs. effectiveness.
     
  2. gpurp

    gpurp Well-Known Member

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    I've always been skeptical about sheet metal supporting 90+ lbs of tire and wheel over time. Maybe for Jeeps that never go off road its fine. Consider the true amount of force being exerted as you're bouncing along on a trail. The bouncing (vertical acceleration/deceleration) is going to exert way more force on those hinges than a static 90lbs. I'd sure be concerned about metal fatigue, deformation, and tailgate sagging. Its easy for me to justify the need for a bumper carrier, just not so much the price. If something warps at least it won't be the Jeep's body and can easily be replaced.
     
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  3. OP
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    RubiSc0tt

    RubiSc0tt Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, that's kind of what I was thinking originally and what I'm thinking now, especially after seeing those pictures. I thought there was more solid mounting in there but it looks like it was just parts pf the tub and some reinforcement braces.
     
  4. spurly

    spurly Well-Known Member

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    #4 Oct 23, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2019
    Any chance you can share those pictures of that JLUR with the cracks and bent tailgate? I thought I read or heard somewhere that the JL's tailgate mounts were actually structural and extend internally to the frame so it wouldn't do this. Unlike JKs and TJs. I just think it would be interesting to see.
     
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  5. Therby

    Therby Well-Known Member

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    Simple is better for me. I don’t want to swing out my carrier, then tailgate.

    has to be a all in one motion for myself.

    i have 35s and mopar reinforcement brackets. No issues so far. I wouldn’t go more than a 35 on this set up though. I do like the evo hinge mounted carrier. So much cleaner than a bumper carrier.

    but it always comes down to personal preference. A nice bumper and tire swing will be almost double or more than a reinforced hinge and bracket that most companies are rating for 37” tires.
     
  6. OP
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    RubiSc0tt

    RubiSc0tt Well-Known Member

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    #6 Oct 23, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2019
    It was posted in a huge Jeep group on Facebook. I’ll have to see if I can dig them up. They are more structural, but they still have a limit.
    I like the simplicity and all in one, in concept. But I often worry about what happens if I’m on the interstate or in traffic and get rear ended by a full size pickup, or I’m on the trail and slide backwards into a rock/tree? My thinking is the forces involved are going to bend the tailgate before it bends the carrier because that is the weak point.

    With my last 2 TJ’s, I was spoiled. Especially my ‘98. I built that thing like a tank, so I could toss the keys to my wife or one of my friends who hadn’t driven off road before and I could teach them on an easy to mid range trail and if they had a “miscalculation”, the Jeep would be ok, minus a few scratches. It would also survive if I had a ham-fisted day on the trail. We don’t plan for those, but they happen- so you want to make sure you’re prepped, just in case. This is the part where I should probably mention I’m part of the lunatic fringe. I like to do dumb, stupid things like driving over boulders. Right now I’m doing lighter stuff, but eventually, I want to be able to get back to hardcore use and trails. As such, I’m not concerned about price tag. I’m on a budget like everyone else, but I’ll pay for quality and durability- if I have to save, and wait, I’ll do it. I don’t plan on lifting until I need new tires anyway and the KO series will get 40-60k mi if you’re lucky, so I’ve got a few years, at most. I’m just doing my research, and trying to plan/ think ahead.
     
  7. Crusifix

    Crusifix Well-Known Member

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    Some of them connect to the tailgate as well, so it can swing out with it. Or you can disconnect it and swing them independently.
     
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  8. OP
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    RubiSc0tt

    RubiSc0tt Well-Known Member

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    @spurly here are the pics, and original post. Lou is a good mechanic and a good dude who has built a bunch of Jeeps, so he knows what he is doing.

    75005947-D8C3-473B-B92A-880323E0CEEF.png

    FA033661-E858-4482-80BD-AD0A02D1402E.jpeg

    2900288C-5C16-43CC-9799-05D6E8CA56E0.jpeg

    04006564-9752-4C34-8EE2-3FEB4A82BB0A.jpeg

    1C3DCFEB-C1ED-4BD9-B535-308C43C7338F.jpeg
     
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  9. IndustrialAction

    IndustrialAction Well-Known Member

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    The question is, was that guy's tailgate reinforced? I doubt it.

    I'm having the same debate. I have the MOPAR factory installed reinforcement and run a 35. I don't like having it back there the way it is right now. The tailgate swings slow and heavy and if you're on any kind of a slope (up or down) it either flings itself open or slams itself shut and I keep thinking that can't be good for the tailgate.

    I'm waiting for the Smittybilt to come out. I think I'll likely get the Atlas rear bumper when it is available and move it off the tailgate. Yeah, I'll open two things but the added capabilities and the tire off the tailgate sounds like a win-win to me
     
  10. spurly

    spurly Well-Known Member

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    Broke his tailgate and needs gussets for the axle? Sounds like he jumped his Jeep.
     
  11. Crusifix

    Crusifix Well-Known Member

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    There is definitely more to the story than the owner of the jeep probably let on. The way those breaks are in the structure make it look like he slammed the bottom of the tire down onto a berm or the ground while wheeling.
     
  12. OP
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    RubiSc0tt

    RubiSc0tt Well-Known Member

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    This is just the post that got me thinking, and I agree exactly with your thought process/ conclusions as well.

    For the record: I don’t think The JL in the pic was properly outfitted, and I’m pretty sure it was involved in some kind of idiocy. It just got me thinking....
     
  13. m3lover1

    m3lover1 Well-Known Member

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    The lod OP mentioned is like that, swing out in one motion or option of swingout just the tire carrier. I ordered mine, but still waiting on it to be delivered
     
  14. mikej

    mikej Well-Known Member

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    I have the Ace hinge replacement tire carrier. The tailgate itself holds no weight from the tire. There is a heim joint that connects the carrier to the tailgate, but that’s not load bearing. Its only purpose is to allow for that one handed opening. The tailgate itself is connected only to the hinges.

    I’m not sure which carrier the Jeep had in the picture, but all of those cracks are in the tailgate, not the body. With the Ace, there is no way for the weight of the tire to cause cracks in the tailgate. The weight simply isn’t on the tailgate.

    I have a 35” tire on mine with a heavy wheel (the combo weighs in at 115lbs). It all works very well for me and I’ve had no problems hanging two two gallon rotopaxs filled with gas in addition to the spare. The weight isn’t on the tailgate.
     
  15. gpurp

    gpurp Well-Known Member

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    Does the ACE bolt to the body behind the right rear trim panel like the EVO Does? I've seen the install video but can't tell how thick the metal is where the carrier hinges attach.
     
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