BFG KO2 vs. Falken Wildpeak MT in snow?

[WXman]

Haven't run Falken M/Ts in snow, but the BFG KO and KO2 are both terrible in snow and mud also for that matter. Can't stand the way the tread packs up and then "pushes" or basically understeers going into curves in the snow. Just awful tires.

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[408Rubicon]

Great experience with KO2s. Took a trip from California to Salt Lake City Utah almost 2 years ago in early January. Took Hwy 80 through Truckee and Reno during a snow storm without any issues, while most vehicles were pulling over due to snowy conditions. KO2s performed impressively past Reno at 35psi, with no vehicles on the way to Lovelock and a couple of inches of snow on the road at night without clearing. Speed was about 40 mph of 4HI. No slipping or braking issues when pulling over twice to clear the snow buildup on the LED headlights. Performed great out in Utah even during snowfall the 3 weeks I was out there. Performed decently in mud last year, on a wide clay muddy road after days of rain. Drive was about 4 miles with some climbs with the psi set at 20. Still had potential for better performance at lower psi. Great on dry off road even on steep climbs. I chose to replace with KO3s a couple weeks ago after some research on the updates improvements, and I can say they are definitely smoother and quieter on road so far. I do need to start taking more and better pictures, but these should help.

 

[Dale's Jeep]

Just a question but if MT's are so bad why does jeep sell Firestone MT's on Willy's vehicles?

 

[jadmt]

Just a question but if MT's are so bad why does jeep sell Firestone MT's on Willy's vehicles?

looks aggressive and probably got a screaming deal on them....

 

[Ratbert]

Just a question but if MT's are so bad why does jeep sell Firestone MT's on Willy's vehicles?

I assume MTs are optional since they've good in mud and on rocks. They're good at what they're designed for.

 

[BRuby]

Any tire without tons of full depth siping and a clear path for water to evacuate will suffer on paved snow and wet conditions. That is why the KO3 are apparently better than KO2 if the compounds are identical.

Many other off-road AT and MT have a deeper more aggressive looking wider pattern better for mud. So water does not get "stuck" in the tread. These look good on the showroom floor because they really stand out and look really aggressive which some buyers like. Some even need.

KO3s are an update to the KO2s - just like the KO2s were an update to the very hard compound non-3PMSF KOs.

Have a son-in-law who had BFG on-road AT which he swore by in wet. Moved to KO2s which he felt slipped more in wet but were better off-road - he now has Coopers which he likes again. He fishes a lot and goes on FSRs almost every weekend it seems. Every tire design has compromises. So comes down to what you like overall. Performance or looks or quietness or longevity or durability or weight or balance easy - or something else.

My take is KOs were already great in deep frozen up slush - but KO2s better with a much softer compound - KO3 probably better in wet. Speculating BFG kept to a minimal 15 tread depth because of the amount of full depth siping they designed in and other parameters they considered.

Bottom line - just drive what came on the Jeep or swap to something else more suited to your specific needs. These KO2s came on this Jeep and are fine for our seasonal snow use. But they do fishtail up a wet steep sharp curve unless you drop speed. Our Subie sedan does this as well - just the full time 50/50 fronts pull so hard - the fishtail is much less and muted at higher speeds. This is the world rally car championship inspiration in Subaru. Not the super boring crap non-manual CVT tippy mom and pop SUVs they now sell to 99% of typical buyers.

If your conditions are only on ice and you get lots of this all the time go for Hakka LT3 studded. But studs have their own limitations when not on ice and are banned in certain locations or at certain times of the year. Otherwise the non-studded version looks to be a solid winter option if available in your area. Really - get something like this if you currently have any handling issues controlling your Jeep on ice or snow. It is safer for everyone on the road.

Took our Subie on a solid ice track to check handling at speed and it was a blast. Very predictable and controllable just using snows. But have not tried this with the Jeep yet. Haha!

Otherwise just slow down and learn the limits of your tires and Jeep drivetrain. We got caught in over a foot of soft slush and F+R lockers helped but not enough. Then laid down a couple of tracks and locked fronts pulled us right out.

 

[Dale's Jeep]

So why aren't MT's banned from road use? doesn't the responsibility fall onto the driver?

 

[yokramer]

Had a JLU rental with Wildpeak M/Ts in Denver a month or so ago and they were awful in the snow. There was a point that if I put any input in if it actually happened I was happy. Brakes were a gamble steering was a wish and throttle just sent snow flying. I LOVED my Wildpeak M/Ts on my Xterra here in the NC mud but they are not the choice in icy hard pack

 

[Ratbert]

Any tire without tons of full depth siping and a clear path for water to evacuate will suffer on paved snow and wet conditions. That is why the KO3 are apparently better than KO2 if the compounds are identical.

Reviews indicate that the KO3s have a softer compound.

 

[Ratbert]

So why aren't MT's banned from road use? doesn't the responsibility fall onto the driver?

They can be exceptional tires for their use case. What makes you think they should be banned?

A dealership in a state with lots of snow should know better than to order MTs, but maybe they have their reasons.

 

[Dale's Jeep]

Just asking if people thought there so bad. I live in Michigan and see the Firestone M/T's on brand new Jeeps sitting on dealership lots. I have a set of wildpeak M/T's and haven't had any issues. Course I don't drive like a ass hat either like people do nowadays

 

[RudeJeepin]

I was none too happy to learn Jeep bait and switched the BFG KO2 with the Falken Wildpeak MT when I picked up my '24 Willys back in April. I've had 10 years on BFG KO2's and while they're not Blizzaks, they were pretty good in the snow especially on unplowed highways.

Before I go spend $1600 on 5 BFG KO3's, does anyone have experience with KO2's and Falken MT's in the snow and can give me a real world comparison?

I've ran both tires, unfortunately not on the same rig. So no direction comparison.
As far as an MT goes, the Falken does pretty good in packed snow on the hwy. Probably not as good as a good AT. But on my fiberglass bodied, v8 equipped CJ5, they were better than any other MT I ran. And in the untracked/unpacked snow, they were awesome. The deeper the snow the better they got.

If it was me, since you already have the MT, look into getting the center lugs siped. Used to run Buckshot Mudders back in the day. We'd get the center lugs siped, siping just into the inner quarter or so of the outer lugs. This kept the outer stronger for cornering and getting aggressive off road. Made a noticeable difference in the wet and packed snow on the hwy.

 

[BRuby]

Reviews indicate that the KO3s have a softer compound.

Which reviews?

According to BFG the compound changed to have more durability on and off road. This would generally indicate a harder compound with increased longevity even on gravel. They specifically do not mention softer anywhere.

They do note that the full depth siping is for stability and even wear. Personally would have liked deeper tread blocks. But there are compromises with that design approach.

Softer is better for me in wet and snow. But not sure if anecdotal reviews translate to actuality. As noted my KO2s are soft and stay pliable enough already in low temps. But softer and more sticky is even better for me. Though probably at the expense of faster wear unless other special compounds are added.

Granted my mileage with the Jeep is minimal anyways. As this 2018 OEM set still does fine.

 

[Ratbert]

Which reviews?

According to BFG the compound changed to have more durability on and off road. This would generally indicate a harder compound with increased longevity even on gravel. They specifically do not mention softer anywhere.

They do note that the full depth siping is for stability and even wear. Personally would have liked deeper tread blocks. But there are compromises with that design approach.

Softer is better for me in wet and snow. But not sure if anecdotal reviews translate to actuality. As noted my KO2s are soft and stay pliable enough already in low temps. But softer and more sticky is even better for me. Though probably at the expense of faster wear unless other special compounds are added.

Granted my mileage with the Jeep is minimal anyways. As this 2018 OEM set still does fine.

I guess he didn't explicitly say it's softer, just that it's more pliable when cold. The discussion about compounds starts at about 14:30.



He did, however, say the compounds were completely different in a subsequent comparison (at about 2:30):

 

[BRuby]

I guess he didn't explicitly say it's softer, just that it's more pliable when cold. The discussion about compounds starts at about 14:30.



He did, however, say the compounds were completely different in a subsequent comparison (at about 2:30):

Yeah silica vs softer is their secret sauce using soft resins butadiene to allow longer tread life. Special additives as suspected.

Now when I move the tread blocks on my KO2s in the cold - they are already soft and pliable even a bit sticky. Which is perfect for me. Will be tough to tell if the silica offsets faster wearing soft rubber unless tested side by side.

Anyways good to see BFG doing something to combat the competition as the KO2 was ready for an update vs the Falcon 3. Def the KO2 is not shit like many naysayers spew. But whatever. Everyone has their own opinions.

Often am at ski resorts parking on iced up lots that are hard to stand on. Some on slight inclines. Is amazing how soft rubber grips on this. Here is a photo showing an estimated 50% wear. Did not pull out my trusty tread depth gauge so this is an approximation on 15. Maybe was 9 or so as my memory is not as sharp as in my earlier days. Taking off 3 for replacement minimum.

Will probs wear these down to the ground - then slap on my back-up take-off set. Then put on KO3s in 10+ years or so. Or maybe KO4s. Haha!

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