Benefit of shock upgrade w/out lift springs?

[stylett9]

Is there much if any performance gains to be had by upgrading to better shocks, like Falcons, Kings or Fox while keeping the stock Rubicon springs?

A lift has never been part of my plans, but I was brutally left in the dust on a recent trip where some of my buddies in different rigs were able to maintain a much higher speed than me over some washboards and rocks.

I recognize that more travel obviously helps... is the biggest gain from more travel or just a better shock in general?
thanks for any input.

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[Black Jeep Convertible]

off road the ride quality it not really noticeable improvement over stock, there may be a nicer ride but you will not find anything that you cannot do because of your shocks


as for shock travel length, yes that can improve the droop but you are still going to get bound by the control arm bushings, you can test your optimal gain by jacking up one side on the axle until the other side stops drooping and that is your max droop stock and then doing it again with the shock removed, you will see some improvement as the shocks tend to be the bottoming out item in shock travel but the control arm bind is a close second

 

[AnnDee4444]

Is there much if any performance gains to be had by upgrading to better shocks, like Falcons, Kings or Fox while keeping the stock Rubicon springs?

A lift has never been part of my plans, but I was brutally left in the dust on a recent trip where some of my buddies in different rigs were able to maintain a much higher speed than me over some washboards and rocks.

I recognize that more travel obviously helps... is the biggest gain from more travel or just a better shock in general?
thanks for any input.

I'm not an expert, but I believe higher speeds will benefit more from greater bump travel than droop, and unfortunately the only way to increase bump travel is with a lift. However you can still run a better shock that is better suited to this style of driving. Check out Accutune's offerings, they seem to know what they are doing: https://accutuneoffroad.com/product-category/vehicle-specific-products/jeep/jeep-jl/

Also it's worth looking at the Mojave to see what Jeep did to solve this same issue... they added hydraulic bump stops. While the Mojave bump stops would likely require too much modification, Accutune also offers an aftermarket solution: https://accutuneoffroad.com/product/kit-jeep-jl-jt-front-gen2-bump-stop-2-0-series-ifp-2-travel/

 

[AnnDee4444]

Also, here's how much the extra droop can help flex (even with stock bushings): https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/fo...iew-stock-height-can-you-even-flex-bro.30338/

 

[Frezski]

Im running a set of aftermarket shocks on a stock spring set (I have like 1/2" pucks to level due to added weight). I second AnnDee4444. If you are not going to add a lift anytime soon or at all, and willing to to invest some cash into a good set of tuned shocks give Accutune Offroad a call. Granted you may never be able to move as fast as some your friends lifted rigs (more up travel and bigger tires) but your ride quality on the mild ruts/bumps and washboards can be improved. I am currently running some Fox 2.5s with DSC's that are tuned by them. I never knew how heavy my JL was until getting weighed for the tune. I was at 5700Lbs total without a full trail loadout. They will need the front and rear weight fyi. Anyways, long story short they tune the DSC's as well and that gives you so many points of adjustment it's ridiculous. Just the handling on road at freeway speeds on CA shit highways is a lot more balanced and controlled. I have a stretch of road on my way out of town that is filled with ruts, and sharp inclines and declines where at speed you can almost feel the vehicle pull you around and bounce off the bump stops. I don't have that problem now, even when I am loaded down. It's controlled and predictable. A couple clicks here and there. So far I have put 2500 miles on them and 600 were trail miles all over northern AZ. A little mix of everything. Between the tires deflated some and the tuning, forest roads and washboard rural roads I could easily do 40-50 without breaking as sweat. Now if you're trying to fly on something like Schnebly Hill where the rocks are punishing, I would rethink the vehicle you're driving.

 

[stylett9]

Im running a set of aftermarket shocks on a stock spring set (I have like 1/2" pucks to level due to added weight). I second AnnDee4444. If you are not going to add a lift anytime soon or at all, and willing to to invest some cash into a good set of tuned shocks give Accutune Offroad a call. Granted you may never be able to move as fast as some your friends lifted rigs (more up travel and bigger tires) but your ride quality on the mild ruts/bumps and washboards can be improved. I am currently running some Fox 2.5s with DSC's that are tuned by them. I never knew how heavy my JL was until getting weighed for the tune. I was at 5700Lbs total without a full trail loadout. They will need the front and rear weight fyi. Anyways, long story short they tune the DSC's as well and that gives you so many points of adjustment it's ridiculous. Just the handling on road at freeway speeds on CA shit highways is a lot more balanced and controlled. I have a stretch of road on my way out of town that is filled with ruts, and sharp inclines and declines where at speed you can almost feel the vehicle pull you around and bounce off the bump stops. I don't have that problem now, even when I am loaded down. It's controlled and predictable. A couple clicks here and there. So far I have put 2500 miles on them and 600 were trail miles all over northern AZ. A little mix of everything. Between the tires deflated some and the tuning, forest roads and washboard rural roads I could easily do 40-50 without breaking as sweat. Now if you're trying to fly on something like Schnebly Hill where the rocks are punishing, I would rethink the vehicle you're driving.

appreciate the feedback. I see your profile pic looks to be Reward Mine. I was out that way with a couple friends (4 runners with king front coilovers and rear shocks, both were on about 275's to 285s). We were on the West side of 395 just north of Alabama Hills and they were cruising maybe 35mph on what I believe to be maintenance roads.. small ruts, rocks maybe the size of baseballs. On my stock Rubicon Suspension I didn't feel very comfortable taking it above 20MPH due to all the vibrations and rattles. Granted part of this is me getting used to offroading since I'm a newbie... Given your experience and presumably familiar with the terrain around the Sierra's, Do you think shocks and no lift would be adequate enough for me to pickup my speeds a little bit? I'm not looking to Baja Race and fly around like I'm a Ford Raptor. Just trying to not slow down my group as we explore looking for campsites.

When we went East of 395 to hit up Reward mine, that side tended to be softer dirt, and I did feel more comfortable increasing speeds to say..40-50 at some parts near the airfield.

 

[Frezski]

appreciate the feedback. I see your profile pic looks to be Reward Mine. I was out that way with a couple friends (4 runners with king front coilovers and rear shocks, both were on about 275's to 285s). We were on the West side of 395 just north of Alabama Hills and they were cruising maybe 35mph on what I believe to be maintenance roads.. small ruts, rocks maybe the size of baseballs. On my stock Rubicon Suspension I didn't feel very comfortable taking it above 20MPH due to all the vibrations and rattles. Granted part of this is me getting used to offroading since I'm a newbie... Given your experience and presumably familiar with the terrain around the Sierra's, Do you think shocks and no lift would be adequate enough for me to pickup my speeds a little bit? I'm not looking to Baja Race and fly around like I'm a Ford Raptor. Just trying to not slow down my group as we explore looking for campsites.

When we went East of 395 to hit up Reward mine, that side tended to be softer dirt, and I did feel more comfortable increasing speeds to say..40-50 at some parts near the airfield.

To be honest, You will be surprised what a stock Rubi can handle. I think it's an adjustment to the rattles and such. I would have just aired down some to soften the ride if you didn't do that. In those old pictures, I was still on the factory shocks then, and didn't have a problem. But then again I was more being a tourist and just taking it all in. Realistically, I think stock you're also more capable than your friends 4 runners. (A buddy of mine is has built up 4th gen riding on the whole Icon suite like a stage 7/8 on 285s). IFS will ride better in those circumstances, but overall you are better equipped for the trail with lockers, articulation, and droop. If you have no desire to get crazy on the Jeep trails and happy with the stock ride height, consider 35s or 315s to give you a little more cushion and upgrade the shocks when you're ready. My plan is to go bigger, but I am having fun exploiting the JL as it is with the minor mods. It seriously impresses me what it can do. The main reason I upgraded the shocks and had them tuned, is because I have had prior experience running tuned suspension -Carli/King. I dished for Fox is because I haven't ran them before and was considering them for the Jeep's future build and also haven't used Accutune for shock tuning. I wanted a test bed so when my build progresses I knew who I wanted to come back to if I didn't like how it rode.

 

[Compression-Ignition]

You can pickup a ton of speed offroad with a good set of shocks. I have a little 2" spacer lift and some pretty long Fox 2.5's, and the suspension just floats now. The stock springs ultimately aren't strong enough to deal with the heavy 37/13.5r17 Toyo MT's, but it works decent.

I guarantee if you do what was suggested and check out how much extra droop you have and then use that to determine your new desired shock travel, you will be impressed.

Is it worth it to do at stock height? I'd say it depends on the aggressiveness of the driver. If you enjoy a more plush ride, the ability to romp the throttle in the rough stuff and not be bucked around so much, go for it.

Not sure how easy resale would be on short length spendy shocks? Might have better luck selling to a JK owner if it came to that.

 

[AccuTunedJL]

Lots of great feedback already! More usable travel is definitely the hot ticket. For higher speed driving, you will definitely want 5+ inches of up travel. Its extremely common for Jeepers to want the most flex off-road, but usually sacrifice up travel to do so. We are pretty picky when it comes to suspension setup to make sure our customers get the best ride possible, and not just super sick trail flex. Up travel is definitely under rated.

You may want to re-think lifting the Jeep, but by no means do you need to go tall. 2.5" at the most would be a huge improvement over stock.

 

[stylett9]

Lots of great feedback already! More usable travel is definitely the hot ticket. For higher speed driving, you will definitely want 5+ inches of up travel. Its extremely common for Jeepers to want the most flex off-road, but usually sacrifice up travel to do so. We are pretty picky when it comes to suspension setup to make sure our customers get the best ride possible, and not just super sick trail flex. Up travel is definitely under rated.

You may want to re-think lifting the Jeep, but by no means do you need to go tall. 2.5" at the most would be a huge improvement over stock.

First, thanks to everyone providing very helpful feedback for me. Offroading is very new to me but I'm meticulous about understanding my mods before just spending money.

Accutuned, I'm excited to see that I'm not far from you guys, so I do plan to engage with you once I'm ready to hear your opinion on what suits my needs.

Just to clarify your last comment regarding re-thinking lifting the jeep, are you saying I should consider lifting based on my expressed needs of wanting to be able to go a little faster offroad?

I am slowly accepting that maybe a 2.5 may be necessary for what I want to achieve. Just want to make sure I explore all my options first.

 

[AnnDee4444]

Lots of great feedback already! More usable travel is definitely the hot ticket. For higher speed driving, you will definitely want 5+ inches of up travel. Its extremely common for Jeepers to want the most flex off-road, but usually sacrifice up travel to do so. We are pretty picky when it comes to suspension setup to make sure our customers get the best ride possible, and not just super sick trail flex. Up travel is definitely under rated.

You may want to re-think lifting the Jeep, but by no means do you need to go tall. 2.5" at the most would be a huge improvement over stock.

Were the Fox 0-1.5" lift 2.0 remote reservoir shocks canceled? They aren't listed on your website anymore. (Part # 885-24-175)

There's another thread about running the 2-3" lift shocks on the stock height Rubicon (with a 5/8" bump stop extension), and I'm starting to think this may be the best available option for the 2.0 remote reservoir series. Just needs about a 1.5" lift spring, and it should wind up with just over 5" of bump.

I'm limited in total height by my garage door... I wouldn't feel comfortable with anything beyond 3" of additional height (and I'm going to lose an inch to 35s)

 

[AccuTunedJL]

First, thanks to everyone providing very helpful feedback for me. Offroading is very new to me but I'm meticulous about understanding my mods before just spending money.

Accutuned, I'm excited to see that I'm not far from you guys, so I do plan to engage with you once I'm ready to hear your opinion on what suits my needs.

Just to clarify your last comment regarding re-thinking lifting the jeep, are you saying I should consider lifting based on my expressed needs of wanting to be able to go a little faster offroad?

I am slowly accepting that maybe a 2.5 may be necessary for what I want to achieve. Just want to make sure I explore all my options first.

Great! Happy to help get you pointed in the right direction. Yes, a lift kit would allow for more shock travel which would help for faster off-road driving. Shoot us a message if you have any specific questions.

 

[AccuTunedJL]

Were the Fox 0-1.5" lift 2.0 remote reservoir shocks canceled? They aren't listed on your website anymore. (Part # 885-24-175)

There's another thread about running the 2-3" lift shocks on the stock height Rubicon (with a 5/8" bump stop extension), and I'm starting to think this may be the best available option for the 2.0 remote reservoir series. Just needs about a 1.5" lift spring, and it should wind up with just over 5" of bump.

I'm limited in total height by my garage door... I wouldn't feel comfortable with anything beyond 3" of additional height (and I'm going to lose an inch to 35s)

Fox does not offer a 2.0 Remote Reservoir Shock for a 0-1.5" lift. The 2-3" shocks have very similar lengths to the 0-1.5" See below:

FOX-885-24-183 / Fox 2.0 R/R 2-3" Lift

• Product Compressed Length: 16.45
• Product Extended Length: 26.45
• Product Travel: 10.00

FOX-985-24-171 / Fox 2.0 IFP 0-1.5" Lift

• Product Compressed Length: 16.75
• Product Extended Length: 26.85
• Product Travel: 10.10

 

[AnnDee4444]

FOX-985-24-171 / Fox 2.0 IFP 0-1.5" Lift

• Product Compressed Length: 16.75
• Product Extended Length: 26.85
• Product Travel: 10.10

Can you double check these? Other vendors are stating different lengths for 985-24-171, and I'm not sure who is correct. Here's what the other places say:

• Product Compressed Length: 16.25
• Product Extended Length: 25.850
• Product Travel: 9.6

*Edit: looks like you may have listed the lengths for 985-24-172 (rear 2.0 IFP for 0-1.5" lift)

 

[AccuTunedJL]

Can you double check these? Other vendors are stating different lengths for 985-24-171, and I'm not sure who is correct. Here's what the other places say:

• Product Compressed Length: 16.25
• Product Extended Length: 25.850
• Product Travel: 9.6

*Edit: looks like you may have listed the lengths for 985-24-172 (rear 2.0 IFP for 0-1.5" lift)

You are correct! Typo on our end, and now fixed

Fox also lists the shock lengths on their website, which is very hlepful.

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