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Whisky19

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Ford sales manager “ what the hell is going on with these cancellations” LOL
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DanW

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Bronco comes with Sync 4. Wireless charging, need the mid pkg I think, and more better all around.
Yeah... but I'm guessing driving around all the time with that crazy ratio is suboptimal to say the least.
We had a few big fords in the late 80's with the crawler gear. They are pretty great to have.
I actually think 4.56 would be the sweet spot. The first gear is so short, even now with 4.10's, that it is almost a crawler. In 4 low, it is absolutely a crawler gear. I can idle up the steepest hills with the air conditioning on! Lol. I think 4.56 would keep first in a reasonable place while makeing 6th more useable. But the difference between 4.56 and 4.88 isn't huge.
 

FinnCustomKnives

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Indeed. The catch is “progress” requires tradeoffs. You can see this very clearly in Grand Cherokee, Ford Explorer...Chevy Blazer!

Today, 99% of SUVs prioritize daily driving comfort and convenience over off-road capability. Wrangler stands alone for resisting to give up its off-road cred.

I’m not saying progress is bad. But Jeep has to do it more deliberately than most when it comes to Wrangler.
Progress for the sake of progress makes little sense. However, competition forcing you to up your frankly lacking/complacent game is never a bad thing. If we didn't constantly have competition upping the playing field the world would look substantially different than it does now.
 

aldo98229

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Progress for the sake of progress makes little sense. However, competition forcing you to up your frankly lacking/complacent game is never a bad thing. If we didn't constantly have competition upping the playing field the world would look substantially different than it does now.
Yes. But competition also tends to homogenize products.

That’s what happened to midsize sedans before they disappeared, and is now happening to SUVs.
 

aldo98229

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I also think the Jeep dash looks a lot better than the Ford. Though, I think the Ford body overall looks better.
The new uConnect is quite a bit better than version 4. A lot faster now that its built on Android. Plus they will finally start doing OTA feature updates and such...apparently.
The new Sync system is not that bad either. Though, I only use android auto, so it does not really matter to me so much.
Wrangler’s interior looks and feels more iconic and has more character. Bronco’s looks more “modern” and more generic.

I’m sure Jeep is working on adding a 12-inch screen to the redesigned JL; similar to that now optional on Ram. It will add wow factor, no doubt, but it will come at the expense of the current interior’s iconic look and feel.
 

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FinnCustomKnives

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Yes. But competition also tends to homogenize products.

That’s what happened to midsize sedans before they disappeared, and is now happening to SUVs.
So then what, the world is better with monopolization of vehicle types? What you just described is what happens when manufactures are lazy AF and build vehicles for people who don't care about vehicles. They are the A-B people, not enthusiasts.

I mean don't get me wrong I understand what you are saying but that happened, in that market, because that's what that market wants. The free market literally made that happen. Whereas if the free market plays out, in reference to enthusiast vehicles, we end up with more options and target specific feature rich vehicles. Bottom line, and case in point, we would literally never have the 392 or this gussied up Rubicon without the introduction of the Bronco.
 

Jhawth

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I believe vast majority of Rubicon owners are like me: they prefer to stay stock and not off road. Probably 80 to 90% of us Rubicon owners fall in that category (including me). We like the bigger factory tires and the look of the steel bumper. That is about it at least in my case.

This Xtreme package maybe good for the remaining 10%. I wonder if FCA may put something out there for the 90%? Maybe something like Heated LED lamps from the factory or a red leather option or cooled & heated seats/steering or wireless apple carplay/android auto will be nice? Heated seats is the only option right now. Pretty sure they can add a cool seats option also if they can add heated seats.

Dang I feel bad for the 90% of Rubicons that never get to go where they were made for. I bought my Rubicon strictly because I wanted to go wheeling. I have been out 3 times since I bought my Jeep about a month ago now too, people are really missing out. It's absolutely nuts what my Rubicon stock can do off road. 28 degrees body roll had my sphincter clenching TIGHT haha!
 

DanW

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Wrangler’s interior looks and feels more iconic and has more character. Bronco’s looks more “modern” and more generic.

I’m sure Jeep is working on adding a 12-inch screen to the redesigned JL; similar to that now optional on Ram. It will add wow factor, no doubt, but it will come at the expense of the current interior’s iconic look and feel.
It isn't just the interior. It is the exterior. It is nice, but not really that unique, other than its throwback tweeks. It is still a fairly traditional SUV style.

When in Moab for EJS, Ford and accessory vendors like 4wp had some lifted and modded Broncos out there. I had 3 of my kids with me. They did not even notice the Broncos. Not once did they point them out. I had to point them out to them. You can spot a Jeep a mile away, but the Bronco has to get on top of you to see what it is. That right there is a HUGE difference. The challenge is not for Jeep to remain viable. It is for Bronco to become viable and sustainable. Time will tell.

Ford 100% underestimated the importance of solid front axle, IMO. I predict that one feature will be their achelles heel in the long run, while at the same time being what keeps the Wrangler viable. Besides its unique and historical styling, the solid front axle is the heart of what makes a Jeep what it is.

And here is the latest challenge and stumble for Bronco.....

https://www.autoblog.com/2021/05/28/ford-bronco-production-delays-continue/

I really hope they can get these things ironed out. I can't help but suspect the vendor for the hard top is sourcing them from China. I do know it is a non-USA source, but I'm not sure from where. I'd much rather it be Mexico.
 

Whisky19

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Jeep torches the Bronco on all fronts especially aesthetics. Quite simply there is no other vehicle as distinctive looking as the jeep and that will never change.
 

aldo98229

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So then what, the world is better with monopolization of vehicle types? What you just described is what happens when manufactures are lazy AF and build vehicles for people who don't care about vehicles. They are the A-B people, not enthusiasts.

I mean don't get me wrong I understand what you are saying but that happened, in that market, because that's what that market wants. The free market literally made that happen. Whereas if the free market plays out, in reference to enthusiast vehicles, we end up with more options and target specific feature rich vehicles. Bottom line, and case in point, we would literally never have the 392 or this gussied up Rubicon without the introduction of the Bronco.
All I’m saying is everything comes at a cost, including “progress.”

Jeepers have had to remain vigilant over the years that the corporate bosses didn’t dilute Wrangler. Just look at what they did to Grand Cherokee —and to Cherokee, for that matter.

Now thanks to Bronco, the pressure is on that the next Wrangler gets an IFS, a fixed windshield, a fixed roof, fixed fenders, a 3rd row, all-aluminum body, or God knows what.

Marchionne wanted these for JL but Jeep owners got wind of it and pushed back so loud and hard, that he had to relent. And, judging by the sales success of JL, thank God that he did. But we may not get so lucky next time.
 

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aldo98229

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And here is the latest challenge and stumble for Bronco.....

https://www.autoblog.com/2021/05/28/ford-bronco-production-delays-continue/

I really hope they can get these things ironed out. I can't help but suspect the vendor for the hard top is sourcing them from China. I do know it is a non-USA source, but I'm not sure from where. I'd much rather it be Mexico.
Geez.

The fact that Ford hasn’t sued the hardtop manufacturer yet, suggests to me that these delays were caused by Ford.

I wouldn’t be surprised if Ford kept screwing around with the top design past the due date the vendor stipulated to be ready for production.
 

pablo_max3045

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Wrangler’s interior looks and feels more iconic and has more character. Bronco’s looks more “modern” and more generic.

I’m sure Jeep is working on adding a 12-inch screen to the redesigned JL; similar to that now optional on Ram. It will add wow factor, no doubt, but it will come at the expense of the current interior’s iconic look and feel.
Ford will also offer OTA updates on their system, similar to Telsa. Without Ford offering something like that, there is literally no way that Jeep would ever do it.
I mean hey! You only paid 60K, why the hell should you expect to get system updates?

It's one thing that the legacy companies really don't understand.
Offering updates to older cars does not mean that you sell less cars. It means that people who buy them end up feeling better about the car they have any not feeling like they are getting the shaft. That in turns helps ensure that they the happy customer buys from them again.
One big reason why Apple sells so many iPhones. Sure, it's a walled garden, but at least you know that 5 years down the road, you are still running the latest SW.

If the Bronco goes 98% of the places a wrangler can go, has the same off road features and mods, plus offers long term updates... no brainer for a lot of people.
 

aldo98229

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Ford will also offer OTA updates on their system, similar to Telsa. Without Ford offering something like that, there is literally no way that Jeep would ever do it.
I mean hey! You only paid 60K, why the hell should you expect to get system updates?

It's one thing that the legacy companies really don't understand.
Offering updates to older cars does not mean that you sell less cars. It means that people who buy them end up feeling better about the car they have any not feeling like they are getting the shaft. That in turns helps ensure that they the happy customer buys from them again.
One big reason why Apple sells so many iPhones. Sure, it's a walled garden, but at least you know that 5 years down the road, you are still running the latest SW.

If the Bronco goes 98% of the places a wrangler can go, has the same off road features and mods, plus offers long term updates... no brainer for a lot of people.
I don’t know what OTAs has to do with anything.
 

Jeepnutz

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I also think the Jeep dash looks a lot better than the Ford. Though, I think the Ford body overall looks better.
The new uConnect is quite a bit better than version 4. A lot faster now that its built on Android. Plus they will finally start doing OTA feature updates and such...apparently.
The new Sync system is not that bad either. Though, I only use android auto, so it does not really matter to me so much.
New U connect? I wasn't aware the 5 was offered on the JL?
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