Adding an Aftermarket Amp(s)

[JCae2798]

And you want to amp the Focal's?

My plan was to use the one channel with the passive crossovers that Focal provides. This way* i use 2 channels for each side. I was going to bridge the other two for the sub. Down the line if i wanted to i could potentially run coaxials to the rear and add a 2nd amp for the sub only as i did in my old system.

I know going active would be ideal but this has worked for me in the past and I just want cleaner sound at a little bit of a higher volume then what i have now with factory alpine...

To recap i will be using the JL VX400/4i amp for this setup.

EDIT:
Honestly i probably would have used my 2nd amp for the sub alone and could have had all 4 channels available for the fronts, but with the 4xe, space is limited and i want to keep the trunk space looking stock for when i have the top down/side panel windows off.

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[Terpsmandan]

Nice amp but the DSR-1 will be a little redundant with that amp. Probably mentioned it in a prior post on this topic but I got another set of Quart JC-108's and replaced the dash speakers in her 21 JLUD and it definitely improves the sound. Is it what I have with the Quart system in mine? No, but it is better than the paper dash speakers that come stock.

 

[JCae2798]

So some interesting results today (2024 Alpine)....

I took the front stage and ran it into a Kicker KEYLOC. What I found was that Speakers 1+2 (labeled this way from the PAC CH03 harness) produced Mids + Highs, but as I tweaked the volume higher, the lows were triggered too. When I did the same for Speakers 3+4, I only got Lows + Mids. I have to assume 3+4 are the lower speakers but I'll need to confirm tomorrow when I have more time.

Following kickers keyloc details the low sensor ranges from 20hz to 200hz, so i'm assuming if any of this range is produced, the keyloc will pick it up. So interested to see what range these lines are really getting and why the tweeters would be getting these ranges compared to the mids in the lower pods? Can anyone confirm if there are any crossovers enabled at the speaker level? With people upgrading speakers and MOPAR selling the kicker upgrade kit, makes me wonder if the signals are wider than we might assume..

Either way i doubt these lines are getting a full 20 - 20k which is what i would be after...but if i can sum the two speakers upfront to get this full range, that would be awesome so this way i can feed the two channels directly into my amp and be able to power the Highs, Mids, and Sub all from it.

 

[JCae2798]

Ok update on signals running to the fronts on an Alpine system...

Front Tweeters: 50hz - 0.5v, 100hz - 1.1v, 500hz - 3.9v, 1,000hz - 3.6v, 5,000hz - 4v, 10,000hz - 4.2v
Front Woofers: 20hz - 2v, 100hz - 3.8v, 400hz - 2v, 700hz - 0.6v, 1,000hz - 0.1v

The knee speakers seem to have a very small crossover range set compared to the tweeters. Found this to be a bit surprising but learning a lot here when it comes to audio.

So with this I'm looking for some guidance. I thought about using the Mid signals for my 2-way woofer I plan to install but I feel the signal range is not wide enough for the upgrade I am doing. Would you agree? Here's the speakers I plan to use:
https://www.focal-america.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/FP_PS165FE_GB.pdf
https://www.focal-america.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/FT_PS165FE.pdf
It's hard to understand what the freq range is for the woofer as it seems Focal only lists out the whole range for the set...

 

[BrentMG]

This has probably been posted in here but this thread is 91 pages and most might as well be written in another language for me. I'm sorry, I'm dumb and need this stuff explained to me pop up book reading style.

I have the premium sound with kicker 6s in the sound bar and with the 3.5 Quarts on top of the dash. While I'm not going for competition sound, it would be nice to make it better, especially when the top and doors are off. Is there an amp I can use, which is relatively plug and play and would bring out the best in the speakers? Also trying to avoid spending big money. I typically listen to rock, metal and some country.

 

[DrummerDudeNJ]

Gotta love a slow day at work.... gives one time to read through this amazing post and abundance of info!!!

@Sting_NC_USA I'd appreciate your input on my planned upgrades:

- PAC module connected to factory Alpine 8.4
- RCA's from the non-fading output to Kicker KEY500.1 to drive sub
- Use PAC AmpPRO harness (to bypass Alpine amp) into Kicker KEY200.4 to drive dash, knee, and soundbar speakers

My logic is that the signal from the PAC should be much cleaner than simply tapping into speaker wires, even though the amps are designed to accept both levels.

Just need to make sure I get the wiring correct because even looking at some of the diagrams can make your head fuzzy lol ...... case in point: should I use an adapter harness (i.e. Kicker KISL) to run RCA's from the PAC to the 200.4?

Thanks for your insight!!!

 

[JCae2798]

Gotta love a slow day at work.... gives one time to read through this amazing post and abundance of info!!!

@Sting_NC_USA I'd appreciate your input on my planned upgrades:

- PAC module connected to factory Alpine 8.4
- RCA's from the non-fading output to Kicker KEY500.1 to drive sub
- Use PAC AmpPRO harness (to bypass Alpine amp) into Kicker KEY200.4 to drive dash, knee, and soundbar speakers

My logic is that the signal from the PAC should be much cleaner than simply tapping into speaker wires, even though the amps are designed to accept both levels.

Just need to make sure I get the wiring correct because even looking at some of the diagrams can make your head fuzzy lol ...... case in point: should I use an adapter harness (i.e. Kicker KISL) to run RCA's from the PAC to the 200.4?

Thanks for your insight!!!

Your approach looks great to me. Good luck

 

[Sting_NC_USA]

Gotta love a slow day at work.... gives one time to read through this amazing post and abundance of info!!!

@Sting_NC_USA I'd appreciate your input on my planned upgrades:

- PAC module connected to factory Alpine 8.4
- RCA's from the non-fading output to Kicker KEY500.1 to drive sub
- Use PAC AmpPRO harness (to bypass Alpine amp) into Kicker KEY200.4 to drive dash, knee, and soundbar speakers

My logic is that the signal from the PAC should be much cleaner than simply tapping into speaker wires, even though the amps are designed to accept both levels.

Just need to make sure I get the wiring correct because even looking at some of the diagrams can make your head fuzzy lol ...... case in point: should I use an adapter harness (i.e. Kicker KISL) to run RCA's from the PAC to the 200.4?

Thanks for your insight!!!

Yeah, looks good from here, and as far as I can tell, standard RCA cables from the PA to your amp should be just fine.

Let us know how it goes!

 

[DrummerDudeNJ]

@Sting_NC_USA and @JCae2798 thanks guys!! I appreciate the input!!

Next question.... the KEY200.4 is a four channel amp. There are 6 speakers (excluding sub) in my JL with the soundbar woofers and tweeters having separate wiring. I was advised by Crutchfield that I could join/splice speaker wires together. For example on dash and knee bolsters.... splice together pos wires from each into a single wire (same process for neg wires) then connect that single wire to the designated channel on the amp (left, right, etc).

Thoughts on this approach? Thanks!!

 

[Sting_NC_USA]

@Sting_NC_USA and @JCae2798 thanks guys!! I appreciate the input!!

Next question.... the KEY200.4 is a four channel amp. There are 6 speakers (excluding sub) in my JL with the soundbar woofers and tweeters having separate wiring. I was advised by Crutchfield that I could join/splice speaker wires together. For example on dash and knee bolsters.... splice together pos wires from each into a single wire (same process for neg wires) then connect that single wire to the designated channel on the amp (left, right, etc).

Thoughts on this approach? Thanks!!

Seems like using a pair of crossovers for the separates would work better. For example, your rear-left amp outputs wire directly into one crossover box, which has 4 output wires with crossover filters built in. Those outputs include the positive and negative wires for your rear-left soundbar tweeter and positive and negative wires for your mid-range woofer. The same exists for the rear-right pair.

The front speakers really should be separates, as coaxial speakers in the knee panels won't focus treble to your ears. If you run separates, the front could be run the same way as described above. But, if both sets of your front speakers are coaxial, they would require full range signals directly from your amp's rear channel. Candidly separates are ideal.

All that being said, if you stick with two coax setups up front, you can run them in Series or Parallel wiring setups.

I'll refrain from starting up the method debate here, but generally speaking, series is safer. However, if your amp can handle a lower amp ohm load, parallel can be a good option.

https://soundcertified.com/how-to-connect-2-speakers-to-one-output/

Scan the above link and research parallel vs series speaker wiring to decide which is best for you and your amp.

Hope that's helpful!

 

[DrummerDudeNJ]

@Sting_NC_USA yessur... very helpful. I'll be sure to hit that link!

The speakers I have are these:

Kicker Plug & Play Speaker Bundle Upgrade (Premium) | '18-'23 JL/ '20-'23 JT (trailseven.com)

They sound really good and have all the crossovers pre-wired into the PNP harness that was included. Dash and knee are coaxial, soundbar are separates all of which are 4ohm and can easily handle the power of the KEY200.4 (50w x 4) which has a min imped. of 4ohm.

So my thinking is perhaps I could get away with a parallel connection?

 

[DrummerDudeNJ]

Actually maybe not.... parallel connections split the ohms.... making 4ohm 2ohm. This is driving me crazy lol

 

[Sting_NC_USA]

@Sting_NC_USA yessur... very helpful. I'll be sure to hit that link!

The speakers I have are these:

Kicker Plug & Play Speaker Bundle Upgrade (Premium) | '18-'23 JL/ '20-'23 JT (trailseven.com)

They sound really good and have all the crossovers pre-wired into the PNP harness that was included. Dash and knee are coaxial, soundbar are separates all of which are 4ohm and can easily handle the power of the KEY200.4 (50w x 4) which has a min imped. of 4ohm.

So my thinking is perhaps I could get away with a parallel connection?

As long as your amp can handle the ohm load without overheating. Just check the manual to be sure.

 

[DrummerDudeNJ]

Yeah I don't think I feel safe wiring that way. I think I may need to use the Alpine system amp to power the knee bolsters and just use the KEY for the dash and soundbar. Fortunately the PAC harness affords me that option.

 

[J2K66]

Yeah I don't think I feel safe wiring that way. I think I may need to use the Alpine system amp to power the knee bolsters and just use the KEY for the dash and soundbar. Fortunately the PAC harness affords me that option.

If possible, you'd be better off running the entire front stage (dash + knees) with the kicker amp and then using the factory amp for the soundbar. It'll sound best when the majority of your sound is in front of you.

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