Accidental audio improvement with dash speakers and Alpine system

Zandcwhite

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Officially settling the debate on impedance for the Alpine upgraded front full range and sound bar full range speakers.

the corner dash and sound bar 3.5’s are considered 4ohm


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Nice work. That being said, if the amp truly is 12 channels, odds are they are all 2 ohm stable and you’d gain more output running 2 to 3 ohm speakers in those locations.
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StockRubi

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Nice work. That being said, if the amp truly is 12 channels, odds are they are all 2 ohm stable and you’d gain more output running 2 to 3 ohm speakers in those locations.
this is true. I haven’t tested the 4” mids. But will later today. My guess is the mids are on a different channel at 2ohm to boost the volume in the midrange. Without testing the amp, it will be tough to say. I will say that the alpine are 86 db at 2v. The JL are 86db at 2.83v. You may loose a negligible amount of volume, however not noticeable. I will install Wednesday and share how they sound. The factory tuning from the stock may be better than the front stage on the JL’s based on balance.

what I noticed with the other after market speakers was ear fatigue as the frequencies left while driving were sharp. The alpines seem to balance this a bit. Without a full system replacement and new amps, the Alpines maybe best
 

GATORB8

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Also wanted to share additional specs on these. They don’t look bad in paper. The magnet is small, however is neodymium vs ferrite…. So the strength of the magnet is greater
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Do you have the data for the 4.5s?
Any identification of alpine crossover frequency?
Knowing the sensitivity is a good point for looking at speaker replacement impact. If the 3.5s are in fact 4 ohms and 86 db sensitivity, it makes sense 2 ohm 90db+ replacements are screaming.

Anyone run pink noise on a Audio Spectrum Analyzer on the alpine system stock and flat? I'd do it if the truck was here (still on order).

Quadratec's "super tweeters" (cheap power bass tweeters on a adapter) come with a spectrum analysis, assumed from a non alpine JL. They show pretty intense roll off in the highs with significant improvement from a simple bass blocker'd tweeter replacement: Note, they increase the bass by 2 clicks on the stock EQ between measurements.
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GATORB8

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this is true. I haven’t tested the 4” mids. But will later today. My guess is the mids are on a different channel at 2ohm to boost the volume in the midrange. Without testing the amp, it will be tough to say. I will say that the alpine are 86 db at 2v. The JL are 86db at 2.83v. You may loose a negligible amount of volume, however not noticeable. I will install Wednesday and share how they sound. The factory tuning from the stock may be better than the front stage on the JL’s based on balance.

what I noticed with the other after market speakers was ear fatigue as the frequencies left while driving were sharp. The alpines seem to balance this a bit. Without a full system replacement and new amps, the Alpines maybe best
2.83V would be 1W on an 8 ohm speaker. Sure that's the right one?

R=V^2/P = 2.83^2/1= 8 ohms
 

GATORB8

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From the JK Alpine system release, but pretty informative:

Says the 3.5s are high passed at 300 hz.

From the JK, 6.5s, he doesn't specifically say it but I'm guessing band-passed 50-~300 hz:
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With the switch to the 4" mid basses, they may have gone to 2 ohms to get the power up, but I wonder if it's not xovered the same.

The 3.5s seem to be the critical piece in the system, playing most of the sound over 300 hz.
 
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Jebiruph

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Officially settling the debate on impedance for the Alpine upgraded front full range and sound bar full range speakers.

the corner dash and sound bar 3.5’s are considered 4ohm


64CF2C8F-601D-4A23-8372-98CB7072F320.jpeg

64CF2C8F-601D-4A23-8372-98CB7072F320.jpeg


85E958B4-BD1F-4D5E-8EC7-D8990B81D44B.jpeg
The debate is not officially settled because you are measuring resistance, not impedance.
 

GATORB8

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The debate is not officially settled because you are measuring resistance, not impedance.
Normally you can round up, as long as your not crossing an inline crossover.
 

StockRubi

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The debate is not officially settled because you are measuring resistance, not impedance.
Measuring the speaker ohm resistance?

Did the same test on a speaker with 4 stated ohm with the same result.

the multimeter I used was set to OHM for the test. The measure of impedance is a speakers resistance to current. It is normal to round up slightly due to resistance in the wire and connectivity. I also measured a SKAR audio 3.5” and an Alpine Sxe-0825 3.5” with similar results.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wikihow.com/Measure-Speaker-Impedance?amp=1
 

Jebiruph

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Measuring the speaker ohm resistance?

Did the same test on a speaker with 4 stated ohm with the same result.

the multimeter I used was set to OHM for the test. The measure of impedance is a speakers resistance to current. It is normal to round up slightly due to resistance in the wire and connectivity. I also measured a SKAR audio 3.5” and an Alpine Sxe-0825 3.5” with similar results.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wikihow.com/Measure-Speaker-Impedance?amp=1
My bad, I was half joking and should have posted a smiley. I was making the point that resistance is for DC and impedance is for AC and they are not the same. As your link states, measuring actual impedance takes specialized equipment. "If you're just confirming the general range of your speakers, all you need is a multimeter. If you want to conduct a more accurate test, you'll need some specialized tools."
 
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StockRubi

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My bad, I was half joking and should posted a smiley. I was making the point that resistance is for DC and impedance is for AC and they are not the same. As your link states, measuring actual impedance takes specialized equipment. "If you're just confirming the general range of your speakers, all you need is a multimeter. If you want to conduct a more accurate test, you'll need some specialized tools."
Very true!!
 

StockRubi

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Installed the JL C2-350x speakers in the front and rear and they sound great. The rear speakers don’t quite fit in the sound bar and I am considering slightly widening the opening to have them fit. Not sure I want the front and rear stage mismatched as there will be eq issues. I will say that the JL’s sound better than the alpine upgrade, but not a ton. I am considering keeping things stock alpine unless I do a full system upgrade with amps and new kick panel boxes. The factory tune alpine is still good, not great. And with the ambient road noise in the cabin, the clarity of the JL’s will be lost. Volume wise, no clipping or unexpected behavior from the JL’s and while parked sound amazing. But it’s a jeep, so an audiophile grade system is a little bit of a waste.
 

StockRubi

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So after three days of driving, testing and auditioning the JL C2-350x in the front dash and rear sound bar here are my impressions. The JL’s are clean, crisp and detailed. The silk tweeters were accurate but not at all harsh. There is no ear fatigue while parked and parked there seems to be about a 15-20% improvement in stage over the premium Alpine.

Driving is a different story. While driving the JL’s loose some of the clarity due to cabin noise. You can occasionally hear an instrument or nuance that was not there before, but mostly they become a little sharp. After driving for an hour at volume, my ears were a little tired. The flip side is the Alpine Premium did not seem to loose the clarity and there was no ear fatigue. Of all of the speakers I have tested, the Alpine premium seem to be the best overall balancing road noise and clarity. I am a little shocked by this and am now curious about Morel and diamond audio as an option. I do believe the JL’s sound great parked, however, the Alpines have gained a new respect from me as overall they balance the road noise of a rubicon very well. I am planning on sending the JL’s back and keep the Alpine Premium for now. This was just a 4 speaker replacement with factory everything else. I do know that new amps, kick boxes loaded with 6.5 components and the works is a whole different thing. I am not wanting that type of investment currently and am quite pleased with the result after several weeks of testing. Sound is like taste and personal… enjoy what you have and what sounds good to you!!!
 

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I did a sort of "blind sound test" to see if some of the theories in this thread about these speaker upgrade not being worth it would pan out. I had replaced the front upper corner dash with the Infinity's in this thread and replaced the sound bar with the JL's also mentioned in this thread about 5 months ago when the hard top was still on. I had noticed with the top off it was very hard to hear any music at speed and what I could hear sounded awful. I swapped them all back to factory a few days ago and said nothing to the wife. She got back from running errands and said "Did you upgrade the speakers in the Jeep? It sounds so much better and louder! I can hear it now when driving with the top off over the wind noise." I'm now agreeing with some of the previous posts that to do this right you really need to rip out and replace the factory amp and all speakers to get the optimal sound. Again, a non-scientific sound test, but still...
 
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