4XE tax credit to $12,500?

Minty JL

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4xe is not an EV, though. Despite the cord, it is a hybrid.
That statement is true, but they have been giving these credits to Prius owners for years. The 4Xe can run solely on the battery.............so the title for an EV vehicle can be subjective.

"Plug-in electricdrive motor vehicles (sec. 30D) Four-wheeled vehicles (excluding low speed vehicles and vehicles weighing 14,000 or more) propelled by a battery with at least 4 kilowatt-hours of electricity that can be charged from an external source

Base credit of $2,500, plus $417 for each kilowatt-hour of additional battery capacity in excess of 4 kilowatt-hours (up to $5,000) for a maximum combined credit of up to $7,500

200,000 vehicles per manufacturer limitation"
 

Minty JL

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when does the Gladiator get the 4xe...I need a truck but don't want to be Jeepless..
same here, want a Gecko green 4Xe Mojave Glad
 

nowandthen

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The materials for building batteries are EXTREMELY limited and extremely dirty to mine. Electric vehicles will continue to be a novelty until the materials needed to build batteries are readily available and not materials that are extremely rare on the planet.

Its a great idea, "clean" electric cars. But the current materials required to build a battery just aren't going to cut it.
But the materials in batteries are mostly recycleable (is that a word?). Try recycling gas or coal once it is used. :bandit:

Don't get stuck in "the now". Technology continues to evolve.

Having said that, for now, I want a 392!
 

PacNWJLGecko

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But the materials in batteries are mostly recycleable (is that a word?). Try recycling gas or coal once it is used. :bandit:

Don't get stuck in "the now". Technology continues to evolve.

Having said that, for now, I want a 392!
Recyclable doesn't increase the amount of available materials in the Earths crust. I would bet money that hydrogen ends up being the fuel of the future. Electricity is just a distraction that fills politicians pockets.

Hydrogren is plentiful, clean, cheap, and doesn't affect the environment. But it's also not profitable like batteries are.
 

nowandthen

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Recyclable doesn't increase the amount of available materials in the Earths crust. I would bet money that hydrogen ends up being the fuel of the future. Electricity is just a distraction that fills politicians pockets.

Hydrogren is plentiful, clean, cheap, and doesn't affect the environment. But it's also not profitable like batteries are.
Currently, there is no "clean/green/low-cost" way to create hydrogen. It uses as much energy to make as it consumes. It may work out, but don't dismiss other technologies. The future will likely have many alternative that are greener than what we use today. There is no panacea solution.

Many materials in batteries are recyclable. Do some research. Yes, at the moment, we need to mine more materials due to the fact that we are just getting started, but there are companies that are taking used lithium Ion batteries and recycling the materials. The economies are/will be better than mining alone.

Check out this channel, https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCjtUS7-SZTi6pXjUbzGHQCg

Disclousure: I'm not a young pup. Being "green" won't have much, if any impact on my life. But, for some crazy reason, I still advocate for new/better technologies as if I'm going to live forever. :)
 

beaups

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PacNWJLGecko

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Currently, there is no "clean/green/low-cost" way to create hydrogen. It uses as much energy to make as it consumes. It may work out, but don't dismiss other technologies. The future will likely have many alternative that are greener than what we use today. There is no panacea solution.

Many materials in batteries are recyclable. Do some research. Yes, at the moment, we need to mine more materials due to the fact that we are just getting started, but there are companies that are taking used lithium Ion batteries and recycling the materials. The economies are/will be better than mining alone.

Check out this channel, https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCjtUS7-SZTi6pXjUbzGHQCg

Disclousure: I'm not a young pup. Being "green" won't have much, if any impact on my life. But, for some crazy reason, I still advocate for new/better technologies as if I'm going to live forever. :)
The materials to produce batteries on the Earth are VERY limited. They comprise a FRACTION of a percent of the Earths composition. IE, once they are all mined there is nothing else left to mine to produce batteries. IE a FINITE supply. There simply aren't enough materials that are currently mined, available to be recycled or available to be mined in the future to facilitate vehicles that powered by battery power, period. Being "old" does nothing to prove your "experience" btw. We will be in a horse drawn carriage society before we are in a "futuristic" fuel society at the rate we are going. At the rate we are going people aren't going to know which bathroom to use in 50 years.

Oh and Matt Ferrell is a creative designer btw. He produces videos to generate clicks to make money. Period. That doesn't make him an expert or even qualified to produce videos on really anything scientific. Turning any hair brained scheme into a pretty video to get clueless idiots to click on it to generate revenue is his game.
 

nowandthen

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The materials to produce batteries on the Earth are VERY limited. They comprise a FRACTION of a percent of the Earths composition. IE, once they are all mined there is nothing else left to mine to produce batteries. IE a FINITE supply. There simply aren't enough materials that are currently mined, available to be recycled or available to be mined in the future to facilitate vehicles that powered by battery power, period. Being "old" does nothing to prove your "experience" btw. We will be in a horse drawn carriage society before we are in a "futuristic" fuel society at the rate we are going. At the rate we are going people aren't going to know which bathroom to use in 50 years.

Oh and Matt Ferrell is a creative designer btw. He produces videos to generate clicks to make money. Period. That doesn't make him an expert or even qualified to produce videos on really anything scientific. Turning any hair brained scheme into a pretty video to get clueless idiots to click on it to generate revenue is his game.
Like fossil fuels, I too am concerned about mining for materials needed for batteries. I don't think strip mining for battery materials is any better than drilling for oil or mining coal. I'm not delusional. At least I don't think I am. And if I am would I know it? :)

Matt, to me, seems to present the technologies fairly. I think he does a good job of explaining the pros and cons of each technology. Have you actually watched his videos? They're not all rainbows and butterflies. :)
 

PacNWJLGecko

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Like fossil fuels, I too am concerned about mining for materials needed for batteries. I don't think strip mining for battery materials is any better than drilling for oil or mining coal. I'm not delusional. At least I don't think I am. And if I am would I know it? :)

Matt, to me, seems to present the technologies fairly. I think he does a good job of explaining the pros and cons of each technology. Have you actually watched his videos? They're not all rainbows and butterflies. :)
I don't watch "pretty," graphic, and overly long videos that dumb down complicated scientific processes that rely on unproven hypotheses that are unrepeatable and don't hold up to scrutiny. I prefer to read boring scientific papers that present the actual information without glorifying the "what ifs." It doesn't generate money for internet grifters that rely on people that click and go "neat NOW I'M AN EXPERT, this shit is the way of the future." Even if its completely impractical and illogical.
 

nowandthen

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My sincere apologies for the hijack of this thread. I hate when that happens... especially by me.

Now back to our regularly scheduled topic:
4XE tax credit to $12,500?
 

OINC

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The materials to produce batteries on the Earth are VERY limited. They comprise a FRACTION of a percent of the Earths composition. IE, once they are all mined there is nothing else left to mine to produce batteries. IE a FINITE supply. There simply aren't enough materials that are currently mined, available to be recycled or available to be mined in the future to facilitate vehicles that powered by battery power, period. Being "old" does nothing to prove your "experience" btw. We will be in a horse drawn carriage society before we are in a "futuristic" fuel society at the rate we are going. At the rate we are going people aren't going to know which bathroom to use in 50 years.

Oh and Matt Ferrell is a creative designer btw. He produces videos to generate clicks to make money. Period. That doesn't make him an expert or even qualified to produce videos on really anything scientific. Turning any hair brained scheme into a pretty video to get clueless idiots to click on it to generate revenue is his game.
The assumption you're making for battery technology that you seem not to make for hydrogen fuel cell technology is that the technology we currently have is the only one we'll ever have. Battery technology/chemistry is RAPIDLY advancing and improving.

Anyway, hydrogen fuel cell vehicles are EVs at their essence, just not BEVs. If you read the actual proposal, there's an up to $8000 tax credit (before the additional $5000 for American- and union-made) for fuel cell vehicles (as compared to the $7500 for BEVs). The incentives are there if someone can figure the technology out.

Care to explain your non-sequitur about bathrooms?
 

Dryver

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The materials to produce batteries on the Earth are VERY limited. They comprise a FRACTION of a percent of the Earths composition. IE, once they are all mined there is nothing else left to mine to produce batteries. IE a FINITE supply. There simply aren't enough materials that are currently mined, available to be recycled or available to be mined in the future to facilitate vehicles that powered by battery power, period.
Does anyone else remember the days when the U.S. was "running out of oil?" Seems to be plenty of it now. Pretty good chance that there are a significantly larger amount of these "limited" materials to be found out there. And as others are noting, battery tech is advancing. I see articles all the time talking new battery tech and the different materials they are experimenting with.

Given that pretty much every auto manufacturer is planning on going all-electric in some given time frame, you'd think they would have vetted, or at least considered, the possibility of running out of the materials to produce batteries.
 
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