4xe Advantage - 8¢ per Mile on Electric

[Jhawth]

I'm looking forward to an electric vehicle once the technology gets better, would be nice to be able to drive to work and back and have some juice left over for weekday activities. Enjoy your 4xe!

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[Initial-Jeep]

A tank of gas can last me months. Now, winter is a little bit different because of the reduced range, but I'm still far ahead of the game.

Gasoline can't sit for months; you'll need to add a fuel stabilizer and even then, check what the limits are.
Additionally, ICE can't sit unused for a long period of time either; they need to be run at operating temperature regularly.
Finally, I don't know if the EV charging system also keeps the regular battery charged (I would think so but I don't know) since that needs to be charged ~weekly/bi-weekly.

But, yeah, I can see the use for in-town driving vs. out-of-town driving. I can also see the benefit of reducing pollution in certain local areas (<cough>LA</cough>), which would be nice. (to be more accurate, it would shift the pollution from LA, et al. to somewhere else)

We all get it's not for you, but you really need to do a better job of comparing apples to apples.

I don't remember your being "our" representative. You need to do a better job of assuming positive intent and not assuming facts about folks you don't know. I'm in this conversation because I'm interested in the technology and my partner is considering a 4xe, a PowerBoost F-150, and the F-150 lightning. As for me, I'm glad the 4xe exists since it helps the 392 exist.

I did do a "better" job of comparing apples-to-apples; are you going to berate the OP also or just me? I made an honest mistake; I did not "fudge numbers to prove a point" (which doesn't prove anything...that makes no sense).

Applying the correct comparison (without choosing more expensive and a different engine option and selecting certain places to live), the ICE 2.0t auto Rubi with LEDs is $50,485 and the base 4xe is $59,485, a $1,500 difference post-tax credit, not a big difference (15K miles to break-even).

Another good point about the battery: does the warranty kick in when the battery loses capacity? (Not as much of a concern with a 300-mile range vehicle but more so with a 21-mile range) Diminished capacity over time is often overlooked with batteries and solar panels.

I'll try not to let this thread reinforce the stereotype that EV owners/proponents are know-it-all, holier-than-thou jerkfaces.

 

[Strommen95]

I'll try not to let this thread reinforce the stereotype that EV owners/proponents are know-it-all, holier-than-thou jerkfaces.

Don't worry, that ship sailed on page one.

 

[CJ SCION]

From what Im seeing, Great lakes energy rates are over .15 per kWh plus the PCSR rate which is almost .02.

That is goofy as hell. Went to google and found a website named find energy that states a rate of 0.1545 per kWh. Sure have to wonder where they get their info. Will show a clip from recent billing and hope Great Lakes doesn't get any wild ideas.

Here is how it shakes out. +53.46, -0.73, +0.98, equals 53.71. Add sales tax of 4% ...... 53.71 times 1.04 equals $55.86 rounded up from 55.8584. $55.86 divided by 495 kWk equals 0.1128 cents per kWh.

The listed sales tax includes taxes on the highlighted fixed price items which would not be attributed to vehicle charging.

 

[CarbonSteel]

No horse in this race, but isn't the current range of a 4xe about 30 miles on battery power? If so, not sure what there is to celebrate...

 

[Initial-Jeep]

That is goofy as hell. Went to google and found a website named find energy that states a rate of 0.1545 per kWh. Sure have to wonder where they get their info. Will show a clip from recent billing and hope Great Lakes doesn't get any wild ideas.

Here is how it shakes out. +53.46, -0.73, +0.98, equals 53.71. Add sales tax of 4% ...... 53.71 times 1.04 equals $55.86 rounded up from 55.8584. $55.86 divided by 495 kWk equals 0.1128 cents per kWh.

The listed sales tax includes taxes on the highlighted fixed price items which would not be attributed to vehicle charging.

Tiered rates perhaps: the more you use, the higher the rate. Additionally, there may be local sales taxes in some cities.

 

[Stormin’ Moorman]

I think a lot of people today suffer from cognitive dissonance. I hope I'm not one of them but you never know.

Arguing over the "efficiency" of a partially electric brick is silly. When the tax break is gone and they've been out for a few years and the batteries are failing they'll go away. Then we'll need something else to argue about.

Drill baby drill.

 

[Initial-Jeep]

 

[Initial-Jeep]

Arguing over the "efficiency" of a partially electric brick is silly.

I'm an engineer....it's in our nature.

 

[Zandcwhite]

Gasoline can't sit for months; you'll need to add a fuel stabilizer and even then, check what the limits are.
Additionally, ICE can't sit unused for a long period of time either; they need to be run at operating temperature regularly.
Finally, I don't know if the EV charging system also keeps the regular battery charged (I would think so but I don't know) since that needs to be charged ~weekly/bi-weekly.

But, yeah, I can see the use for in-town driving vs. out-of-town driving. I can also see the benefit of reducing pollution in certain local areas (<cough>LA</cough>), which would be nice. (to be more accurate, it would shift the pollution from LA, et al. to somewhere else)


I don't remember your being "our" representative. You need to do a better job of assuming positive intent and not assuming facts about folks you don't know. I'm in this conversation because I'm interested in the technology and my partner is considering a 4xe, a PowerBoost F-150, and the F-150 lightning. As for me, I'm glad the 4xe exists since it helps the 392 exist.

I did do a "better" job of comparing apples-to-apples; are you going to berate the OP also or just me? I made an honest mistake; I did not "fudge numbers to prove a point" (which doesn't prove anything...that makes no sense).

Applying the correct comparison (without choosing more expensive and a different engine option and selecting certain places to live), the ICE 2.0t auto Rubi with LEDs is $50,485 and the base 4xe is $59,485, a $1,500 difference post-tax credit, not a big difference (15K miles to break-even).

Another good point about the battery: does the warranty kick in when the battery loses capacity? (Not as much of a concern with a 300-mile range vehicle but more so with a 21-mile range) Diminished capacity over time is often overlooked with batteries and solar panels.

I'll try not to let this thread reinforce the stereotype that EV owners/proponents are know-it-all, holier-than-thou jerkfaces.

Your apples to apples configuration came out exactly where I posted, a $1500 difference if you select the 2.0t. There were several reasons I included the V6 numbers. A. You posted “increased maintenance cost of the turbo” so I assumed you preferred NA? B. The V6 with etorque is much closer to the 4xe as it has a higher voltage battery pack and electric motor incorporated. If you really want apples to apples you’d need a wrangler with 400+ ftlbs so we’d be talking diesel or 392. The diesel would be about $15k more expensive without any state or local rebates. The 392 would be closer to $30k more expensive here in CA as not only are there state and local rebates on a PHEV, there’s a $3,500 gas guzzler tax on the V8. I’m cynical by nature and tend to react to false information regardless of the intent of the poster so I apologize if I came off offensively. It’s hard to argue performance for the dollar across the wrangler lineup with $7,500-12k in tax rebates. As far as break even points that again varies widely with each person’s useage, gas prices, electric rates, and miles driven in fully electric vs hybrid mode. Do I think the 4xe is for everyone? Absolutely not. They don’t seem to like extremely cold climates, those commuting long distances frequently would be much better served by the diesel, they’ll never have the fun factor of the 392 from the sound to the acceleration, and the configurations are limited. It truly is the hey day for Jeeps with more options than we’re ever available. In my opinion if you are in the market for a 4dr JL with an auto trans, don’t live in frigid climates, and do frequent short trips, the 4xe is by far the best value, but you know what they say about opinions.

 

[Pinky Tuscadero]

4XE is a start for sure but I was waiting for 2 things before ordering one
1. Had to be offered in Pink
2. Had to be offered in RHD
The first has already been cancelled without cause and the second will only happen in some Eurotrash country so I'm out.
Also, yeah, this guys a real ass for driving like that as has been mentioned before, I generally drive the speed limit with all the local enforcement here and often a couple miles under - but if you want to pass me I'm all for it and will even move over in my lane so you have an easier time
Rock on in your 4XE's though regardless of the mpg fighting here, good Jeeps throughout I'm sure !

 

[Initial-Jeep]

Your apples to apples configuration came out exactly where I posted, a $1500 difference if you select the 2.0t. There were several reasons I included the V6 numbers. A. You posted “increased maintenance cost of the turbo” so I assumed you preferred NA? B. The V6 with etorque is much closer to the 4xe as it has a higher voltage battery pack and electric motor incorporated. If you really want apples to apples you’d need a wrangler with 400+ ftlbs so we’d be talking diesel or 392. The diesel would be about $15k more expensive without any state or local rebates. The 392 would be closer to $30k more expensive here in CA as not only are there state and local rebates on a PHEV, there’s a $3,500 gas guzzler tax on the V8. I’m cynical by nature and tend to react to false information regardless of the intent of the poster so I apologize if I came off offensively. It’s hard to argue performance for the dollar across the wrangler lineup with $7,500-12k in tax rebates. As far as break even points that again varies widely with each person’s useage, gas prices, electric rates, and miles driven in fully electric vs hybrid mode. Do I think the 4xe is for everyone? Absolutely not. They don’t seem to like extremely cold climates, those commuting long distances frequently would be much better served by the diesel, they’ll never have the fun factor of the 392 from the sound to the acceleration, and the configurations are limited. It truly is the hey day for Jeeps with more options than we’re ever available. In my opinion if you are in the market for a 4dr JL with an auto trans, don’t live in frigid climates, and do frequent short trips, the 4xe is by far the best value, but you know what they say about opinions.

I was trying to keep it simple without oversimplifying. If you're going to compare torque, then compare everything: payload, acceleration, etc. but not everyone cares about those.

Normally, I like turbos but I don't care for GDI. Normally, I like max performance and I like efficiency (in that order) but for my Jeep, I wanted simplicity, which the 4xe is certainly not, followed by ESS and then eTorque. Last thing I want is to be stranded in the middle of nowhere due to some ESS BS. If I'm gona be stranded, it's 'cos I ran outta gas.

Back to the original assertion: is the 4xe that cheaper to run than a comparable ICE? It seems like a very complex "it depends" and it seems any gain will take time to be realized, which means one has to keep the vehicle long-term, which many--especially Wrangler-owners--don't seem to do. (However, I would assume that anyone interested in frugality would keep vehicles long-term)

CA? One could move out of CA, buy a 392, and still have a cheaper cost of living (and health, if we're talking SoCal).

I'm disappointed in the diesel (a big fail IMO) since I was interested in it with a Gladiator.

 

[Initial-Jeep]

4XE is a start for sure but I was waiting for 2 things before ordering one
1. Had to be offered in Pink
2. Had to be offered in RHD

OH, yeah, might be a great postal vehicle!

 

[Rollcast]

No horse in this race, but isn't the current range of a 4xe about 30 miles on battery power? If so, not sure what there is to celebrate...

I can drive a Jeep for my daily commute that is as fuel-cost efficient as a Prius...and not a Prius. Then, I can do regular Jeep stuff when wanted. No need for celebration, but it works damn well for me.

 

[aldo98229]

I was just watching a trail recon youtube video, he is having all sorts of dash light problems on his last trip and mileage poorer than expected.

Of course he is. If he didn’t, he wouldn’t have a YouTube channel...

For the record, I’m not sold on either: 4Xe or Brad.

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