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Village Idiot

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I have a 19 jl that occasionally has mild knock at low rpms under moderate load as well. My brother has a 19 grand Cherokee with same pentestar engine. He also has the knock at low rpms. I don't believe this is dangerous for the engine and very common. I tried running premium fuel and 89 octane as well. I did not hear knock while using premium, still heard it at 89. Other than that, no performance or mpg differences, though I was hardly scientific. For what it is worth even with 87 octane and 35s loaded with 4 people, this engine impresses me. Under wide open throttle it pulls very hard and no knock in that situation ever. Passing other vehicles is not difficult.
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Goosed

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I have owned over 61 cars in 20 years. Raced and tuned most of those cars. So yeah, I have experience.

I’m a dentist and plastic surgeon and lawyer, won the lottery 12 times, and have 120 vehicles in my collection.

Say what you want, and good that you tune and have so many cars and what not, but you didn’t build a successful business and make a name for yourself.

You’re basically saying that Livernois is lying to all of us Jeep owners and putting their entire reputation on the line to make a few sales?
 

Litfuse

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https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/li...-claims-50hp-gains-on-e85-for-v6-jl-wrangler/

Here is their thread if you wanna call them out hoss. I will be looking forward to some insightful posts on your part.
I won’t argue with you. Do what and believe what you want. Tuners rely on people like you. If you believe a 3.6 liter port injection low compression motor is going to gain 25hp on a tune alone, I don’t have much to say. If anything, I would care less about the horsepower gain and more about the driveability on the 3.6L motor, especially with a manual transmission.
 

Litfuse

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I’m a dentist and plastic surgeon and lawyer, won the lottery 12 times, and have 120 vehicles in my collection.

Say what you want, and good that you tune and have so many cars and what not, but you didn’t build a successful business and make a name for yourself.

You’re basically saying that Livernois is lying to all of us Jeep owners and putting their entire reputation on the line to make a few sales?
I have seen this game played time and time again with tuners on multiple platforms. They take their highest pull, on a given day under certain circumstances. Again, they rely on people with little knowledge to sell their product. I have not experienced their tune and it’s quality, so I won’t speak to its driveability aspects.
 
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Goosed

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I won’t argue with you. Do what and believe what you want. Tuners rely on people like you. If you believe a 3.6 liter port injection low compression motor is going to gain 25hp on a tune alone, I don’t have much to say. If anything, I would care less about the horsepower gain and more about the driveability on the 3.6L motor, especially with a manual transmission.
So now you just exposed that you’re not all that educated because the 3.6 is actually considered a high compression engine at 11:3:1
 

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Litfuse

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So now you just exposed that you’re not all that educated because the 3.6 is actually considered a high compression engine at 11:3:1
So now you just exposed that you’re not all that educated because the 3.6 is actually considered a high compression engine at 11:3:1
It’s considered high compression in the FCA line.
 

BrntWS6

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I won’t argue with you. Do what and believe what you want. Tuners rely on people like you. If you believe a 3.6 liter port injection low compression motor is going to gain 25hp on a tune alone, I don’t have much to say. If anything, I would care less about the horsepower gain and more about the driveability on the 3.6L motor, especially with a manual transmission.
I am not asking you to argue with me. If you have questions about the tune Livernois will answer them. I am sure you have some very technical questions given your experience.

But the 3.6 is not a low compression motor.
 

Litfuse

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I am not asking you to argue with me. If you have questions about the tune Livernois will answer any questions you have. I am sure you have some very technical questions given your experience.

But the 3.6 is not a low compression motor.
I imagine Livernois provides excellent customer service and would answer any questions I would offer. In all aspects, I guess you can say the revised 3.6l motor for the JL is on the line of being a high compression motor. But honestly, a 50+ hp gain from a NA tune says either FCA engineers are extremely incompetent, or the Livernois tune is unsafe. I would have to dig into a datalog to confirm the later portion of my comment. And don’t take this as I am saying their tune is unsafe. I am not saying this at all. But under typical circumstances with normally aspirated motors, these gains are not typical without bolt parts and changing a cam(s). With the experiences I have had over the last 30 years of tuning and building motors, these claims are unheard of on a NA motor. If these gains are true, shame on FCA for providing a poorly written tune. But I have expressed my frustration before on this forum about the OEM tune on the manual transmission JLs.
 

2003hummerh2

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I imagine Livernois provides excellent customer service and would answer any questions I would offer. In all aspects, I guess you can say the revised 3.6l motor for the JL is on the line of being a high compression motor. But honestly, a 50+ hp gain from a NA tune says either FCA engineers are extremely incompetent, or the Livernois tune is unsafe. I would have to dig into a datalog to confirm the later portion of my comment. And don’t take this as I am saying their tune is unsafe. I am not saying this at all. But under typical circumstances with normally aspirated motors, these gains are not typical without bolt parts and changing a cam(s). With the experiences I have had over the last 30 years of tuning and building motors, these claims are unheard of on a NA motor. If these gains are true, shame on FCA for providing a poorly written tune. But I have expressed my frustration before on this forum about the OEM tune on the manual transmission JLs.
Considering FCA is having trouble making Jeeps steer straight, welding frames properly, and making clutches. I wouldn't be surprised if FCA had to tune the 3.6 conservatively in order to meet emission regulations.
 

BrntWS6

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I imagine Livernois provides excellent customer service and would answer any questions I would offer. In all aspects, I guess you can say the revised 3.6l motor for the JL is on the line of being a high compression motor. But honestly, a 50+ hp gain from a NA tune says either FCA engineers are extremely incompetent, or the Livernois tune is unsafe. I would have to dig into a datalog to confirm the later portion of my comment. And don’t take this as I am saying their tune is unsafe. I am not saying this at all. oh don't worry I wontBut under typical circumstances with normally aspirated motors, these gains are not typical without bolt parts and changing a cam(s). not that uncommon at allWith the experiences I have had over the last 30 years of tuning and building motors, these claims are unheard of on a NA motor. If these gains are true, shame on FCA for providing a poorly written tune. But I have expressed my frustration before on this forum about the OEM tune on the manual transmission JLs.

Soooooo guessing I won't see any of your replies in their thread with your vast tuning knowledge.
 

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Litfuse

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Soooooo guessing I won't see any of your replies in their thread with your vast tuning knowledge.
[/QUOTE
Soooooo guessing I won't see any of your replies in their thread with your vast tuning knowledge.
Please direct me to an independent test of these horsepower claims outside of the tuner. I'll wait.
 

jeepingib

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I imagine Livernois provides excellent customer service and would answer any questions I would offer. In all aspects, I guess you can say the revised 3.6l motor for the JL is on the line of being a high compression motor. But honestly, a 50+ hp gain from a NA tune says either FCA engineers are extremely incompetent, or the Livernois tune is unsafe. I would have to dig into a datalog to confirm the later portion of my comment. And don’t take this as I am saying their tune is unsafe. I am not saying this at all. But under typical circumstances with normally aspirated motors, these gains are not typical without bolt parts and changing a cam(s). With the experiences I have had over the last 30 years of tuning and building motors, these claims are unheard of on a NA motor. If these gains are true, shame on FCA for providing a poorly written tune. But I have expressed my frustration before on this forum about the OEM tune on the manual transmission JLs.


Backpedal faster!!
 

Litfuse

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@Litfuse

In my best George Bush voice...."Flipflopper"
Are you going to post independent results or are you just going to keep flapping your jaws? I’m assuming you have their tune. Show your results.
 

BrntWS6

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Are you going to post independent results or are you just going to keep flapping your jaws? I’m assuming you have their tune. Show your results.
I do not have their tune. I would encourage you to read the posted thread, it's informative with customer reviews that you are looking for. One guy did 0-60 before and after on his Tazer with a significant increase.

Get both sides then direct any concerns toward Livernois instead of just blindly saying it's not possible.
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