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Kansas JL

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Just curious if Jeep added more battery capacity to the 4XE (currently a piss ant 20 miles) I think that we could easily hit 60 mpg average. I think this would be easy to do, raise the back storage deck up Put extra batteries in there? My buddy has a 4XE he averages 35-37 mpg, but his daily commute is small and is on electric a lot. Driving on electric most of the time for daily commuting, with say 100 mile range of electric charge Would be awesome and I would have really wanted a 4XE if this was the case.
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INCRHULK

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Just curious if Jeep added more battery capacity to the 4XE (currently a piss ant 20 miles) I think that we could easily hit 60 mpg average. I think this would be easy to do, raise the back storage deck up Put extra batteries in there? My buddy has a 4XE he averages 35-37 mpg, but his daily commute is small and is on electric a lot. Driving on electric most of the time for daily commuting, with say 100 mile range of electric charge Would be awesome and I would have really wanted a 4XE if this was the case.
The 4xe covers about half my daily commute to and from work. If it was closer to 100-150km for range, and this i6, I’d be happy.
 

jeepingib

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I went down a bit of an internet rabbit hole researching this engine. Looks like the redesigned Charger and Challenger will be first to get it. The distance between cylinders will be narrower than the current 2.0L. Which means that the aluminum block will not have steel sleeves. Instead they are going to spray the bores with a chemical treatment that is supposed to harden to like steel hardness. I'm personally very curious about the treatment, as I was previously unaware of the technology. Also kind of hesitant to get one until it is proven to be reliable. After going into the cars it's likely to go into the truck and Grand Cherokee. I haven't found anything yet about it coming to the JL, but reports do say Wrangler. I've only been able to confirm that it will be in the JM Wrangler when it releases. But that is a long ways off.
 

Heimkehr

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It seems obvious to me the 2.0L will take the "standard" engine role, and the inline 6 will be the H.O. engine, taking the place of the Hemi.

The diesel get great specific fuel consumption, but I don't know what future emissions requirements will be for diesels or how they play into CAFE rating.
I remember when the pig urine requirement was first rolled out for light trucks, and wondering how many more emission encumbrances could be dreamed up to throttle the performance and reliability of consumer diesel engines. The historic advantage of such engines was their relative simplicity, robustness and the slight price advantage of their fuel. No doubt they're still robust. As for design simplicity and fuel cost, though...

By way of example, a family member owns a Ram 3500 Cummins. While it's not a small engine block, it is just an inline six sitting in a comparatively large engine bay. That said, it's still difficult to look down and see the ground, so voluminous are the hoses and wires, etc. that are hung on and around that engine.


Looks like the redesigned Charger and Challenger will be first to get it. The distance between cylinders will be narrower than the current 2.0L. Which means that the aluminum block will not have steel sleeves. Instead they are going to spray the bores with a chemical treatment that is supposed to harden to like steel hardness.

I'm personally very curious about the treatment, as I was previously unaware of the technology.
Tangentially, Suzuki has used a derivative of a proven cylinder hardening treatment, Nikasil, on their motorcycle engines for years now. I've owned several Suzis with what they call SCEM, including the one in my garage right now. Possibly a version of this coating will be used by Stellantis.
 

Whaler27

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As someone who thankfully doesn't live in California but reads every year about the rolling blackouts, I'm wondering how they're going to power these electric cars without electricity.
The short-term solution to California’s power grid challenges may be the continuing mass exodus of Californians moving to other states. They’ve been swarming Oregon, Washington, Idaho, Montana, Colorado, and Texas for years. After seeing the dramatic transformations they’ve caused everywhere else, it’s hard to believe there’s anybody left in California. ;)

Joking aside, its seems like many of the greatest hot rod and 4x4 innovations have come out of California which has had a fantastic vehicle customization culture since the 50s. I know California has always been quick to adopt the latest fad, and the terrible smog problems have inspired aggressive efforts to reduce emissions, but they still love their vehicles down there. I think we’ll see Californians push back hard if the government tries to take their horsepower without an equivalent-or-better option. There’s plenty of time for a new, innovative six for the wrangler.
 

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INCRHULK

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I went down a bit of an internet rabbit hole researching this engine. Looks like the redesigned Charger and Challenger will be first to get it. The distance between cylinders will be narrower than the current 2.0L. Which means that the aluminum block will not have steel sleeves. Instead they are going to spray the bores with a chemical treatment that is supposed to harden to like steel hardness. I'm personally very curious about the treatment, as I was previously unaware of the technology. Also kind of hesitant to get one until it is proven to be reliable. After going into the cars it's likely to go into the truck and Grand Cherokee. I haven't found anything yet about it coming to the JL, but reports do say Wrangler. I've only been able to confirm that it will be in the JM Wrangler when it releases. But that is a long ways off.
If it’s what I think it is, it’s not a chemical, but a ionized alloy that’s only a few atoms thick. The deposition hardens the block and provides a super low friction surface. Because it’s basically embedded into the block at the atomic level it is incredibly durable.
 

jeepingib

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If it’s what I think it is, it’s not a chemical, but a ionized alloy that’s only a few atoms thick. The deposition hardens the block and provides a super low friction surface. Because it’s basically embedded into the block at the atomic level it is incredibly durable.
My concern is in it's thin-ness in truth. Wear from the friction of moving components in an engine tears down even hardened steel over time. With this treatment being so thin I worry about what happens when the wear does finally get through. It may take a while to get to this point, but I imagine a quite catastrophic failure once it does occur.
 

beaups

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That'd take a 300,000 mile engine and make it like 100,000. A turbo itself is lucky to go 100k, less if it's doing heavy boosting a lot. Bearings go, then the carbon/ceramic oil seals, engine starts eating aluminum and oil from the compressor side..... Good for the 30-50k owners, bad for the 10-15 year owner crowd.
Exactly. That’s why you never see turbos in heavy duty consumer vehicles or big rigs. The technology is totally flawed. 😂
 

INCRHULK

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My concern is in it's thin-ness in truth. Wear from the friction of moving components in an engine tears down even hardened steel over time. With this treatment being so thin I worry about what happens when the wear does finally get through. It may take a while to get to this point, but I imagine a quite catastrophic failure once it does occur.
I remember seeing a demo of this process a couple of years back. Fascinating, and from what I understand, it’s nothing like the normal physical sputter deposition techniques.

only time will tell, but I suspect the lifespan will be easily 200k.
 

roaniecowpony

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The short-term solution to California’s power grid challenges may be the continuing mass exodus of Californians moving to other states. They’ve been swarming Oregon, Washington, Idaho, Montana, Colorado, and Texas for years. After seeing the dramatic transformations they’ve caused everywhere else, it’s hard to believe there’s anybody left in California. ;)

Joking aside, its seems like many of the greatest hot rod and 4x4 innovations have come out of California which has had a fantastic vehicle customization culture since the 50s. I know California has always been quick to adopt the latest fad, and the terrible smog problems have inspired aggressive efforts to reduce emissions, but they still love their vehicles down there. I think we’ll see Californians push back hard if the government tries to take their horsepower without an equivalent-or-better option. There’s plenty of time for a new, innovative six for the wrangler.
I think most of the "Californians" leaving CA are people that came to CA from other states in the past. The only people I've heard of leaving were deeply conservative.
 

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roaniecowpony

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I remember seeing a demo of this process a couple of years back. Fascinating, and from what I understand, it’s nothing like the normal physical sputter deposition techniques.

only time will tell, but I suspect the lifespan will be easily 200k.
I believe the GT350 engine uses a deposition on the bores.
 

abnormal4x4

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The short-term solution to California’s power grid challenges may be the continuing mass exodus of Californians moving to other states. They’ve been swarming Oregon, Washington, Idaho, Montana, Colorado, and Texas for years. After seeing the dramatic transformations they’ve caused everywhere else, it’s hard to believe there’s anybody left in California. ;)

Joking aside, its seems like many of the greatest hot rod and 4x4 innovations have come out of California which has had a fantastic vehicle customization culture since the 50s. I know California has always been quick to adopt the latest fad, and the terrible smog problems have inspired aggressive efforts to reduce emissions, but they still love their vehicles down there. I think we’ll see Californians push back hard if the government tries to take their horsepower without an equivalent-or-better option. There’s plenty of time for a new, innovative six for the wrangler.
Everything is cyclical, I'd like to see it become the Golden State again instead of the brown frown.
 
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Murphydog

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Everything is cyclical, I'd like to see it become the Golden State again instead of the brown frown.
I watched the Rose Bowl today and you could see the mountains in the distance . When I was a kid it was a rare day that the smog was thin enough so that one could see anything. Clearly some good has come about
 

roaniecowpony

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I watched the Rose Bowl today and you could see the mountains in the distance . When I was a kid it was a rare day that the smog was thin enough so that one could see anything. Clearly some good has come about
The past couple days here has been beautiful, with cool clean clear air and the snow covered mountains in the background.

And yes, the air here has changed dramatically since I came into the LA basin at a young boy in 1968. We drove down the Cajon pass and into San Bernadino in the summer and my whole familie's eyes were watering like crazy and our throats were burning. The air was a thick brown and stunk of chemicals and exhaust. We stopped at the original In-N-Out right off the side of I-10 at Francisquito Ave (not that we knew anything about In-N-Out at the time). In following years while in my teens, the air was so bad in the summer that there'd be these things called "Smog Alerts". They call them some other mambi-pambi something or nother now.
PHOTOS: Los Angeles under cover | Smog through the years - Los Angeles Times (latimes.com)

I grew up as a car, motorcycle, and later an airplane enthusiast. I had a methanol burning minibike as a grade-school kid. My brother and I shoe-horned in the biggest Briggs-Stratton engine that would fit in that thing, then modified the heck out of it. It would wheelee down the street. By my late teens we were hanging out at Ak Miller's shop and had a turbocharged car running 12's in the quarter. All the while either cursing vehicle smog laws or violating them or both.

I watched the air quality improve over my life, and I have to say, today I am a fan of all these laws they've passed to clean up the air. I doubt I'd be alive if not for them. I had a mild asthma as a teen, it worsened into my 20s, then got better over the years. Today, it rarely is a thought during the year. People's lives shouldn't be limited just to drive a car, whether a hot rod or just transportation. Yes, maybe smog is just 25 or 35% of the makeup today, but back in the 60s and 70s it was much higher in the greater Los Angeles area. This area had one of the worst geographic and climate conditions for trapping and adding to the emissions effects. So when I hear all the grumbling and cursing of smog laws from younger people, I think how I had the same perspective years ago and how fast cars are today right out of the dealer, and the aftermarket industry is still going strong. We adapt, as long as we still can breathe.
 

legacy_etu

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The past couple days here has been beautiful, with cool clean clear air and the snow covered mountains in the background.

And yes, the air here has changed dramatically since I came into the LA basin at a young boy in 1968. We drove down the Cajon pass and into San Bernadino in the summer and my whole familie's eyes were watering like crazy and our throats were burning. The air was a thick brown and stunk of chemicals and exhaust. We stopped at the original In-N-Out right off the side of I-10 at Francisquito Ave (not that we knew anything about In-N-Out at the time). In following years while in my teens, the air was so bad in the summer that there'd be these things called "Smog Alerts". They call them some other mambi-pambi something or nother now.
PHOTOS: Los Angeles under cover | Smog through the years - Los Angeles Times (latimes.com)

I grew up as a car, motorcycle, and later an airplane enthusiast. I had a methanol burning minibike as a grade-school kid. My brother and I shoe-horned in the biggest Briggs-Stratton engine that would fit in that thing, then modified the heck out of it. It would wheelee down the street. By my late teens we were hanging out at Ak Miller's shop and had a turbocharged car running 12's in the quarter. All the while either cursing vehicle smog laws or violating them or both.

I watched the air quality improve over my life, and I have to say, today I am a fan of all these laws they've passed to clean up the air. I doubt I'd be alive if not for them. I had a mild asthma as a teen, it worsened into my 20s, then got better over the years. Today, it rarely is a thought during the year. People's lives shouldn't be limited just to drive a car, whether a hot rod or just transportation. Yes, maybe smog is just 25 or 35% of the makeup today, but back in the 60s and 70s it was much higher in the greater Los Angeles area. This area had one of the worst geographic and climate conditions for trapping and adding to the emissions effects. So when I hear all the grumbling and cursing of smog laws from younger people, I think how I had the same perspective years ago and how fast cars are today right out of the dealer, and the aftermarket industry is still going strong. We adapt, as long as we still can breathe.
I am always a bit surprised when I get behind an old 60’s or 70’s vintage car on the road. unburnt gas is all I smell. Can’t imagine LA back then With all those cars on the road.
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