2018 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon Diesel Mule Spied with DEF Tank

The Great Grape Ape

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While it doesn't impact me, as a diesel doesn't fit my use case (I'd get one if better in the cold), this sucks for something that has been long awaited in the Wrangler, and a great fit for a majority of enthusiasts.

I am surprised this is dragging out so long and that the EPA is essentially holding for ransom the approval of the 2017 software as a bargaining chip / pressure tactic, in what might be one of their last fights for a while considering its slow dismantling; which overall won't change things too much as CARB isn't going anywhere and they still guide much of the market and most of the big states follow their lead.

I have & do wonder if this impediment might accelerate the jump to mild HEV on the roadmap, as that would be a better fit for me. Without a diesel option, can the Hurricane take up enough of the CAFE slack on its own or do they need to push to EV quicker to fill the gap?





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Campbell

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While it doesn't impact me, as a diesel doesn't fit my use case (I'd get one if better in the cold), this sucks for something that has been long awaited in the Wrangler, and a great fit for a majority of enthusiasts.

I am surprised this is dragging out so long and that the EPA is essentially holding for ransom the approval of the 2017 software as a bargaining chip / pressure tactic, in what might be one of their last fights for a while considering its slow dismantling; which overall won't change things too much as CARB isn't going anywhere and they still guide much of the market and most of the big states follow their lead.

I have & do wonder if this impediment might accelerate the jump to mild HEV on the roadmap, as that would be a better fit for me. Without a diesel option, can the Hurricane take up enough of the CAFE slack on its own or do they need to push to EV quicker to fill the gap?
It does suck and I can't help but think "so close but so far" when thinking of how we woulda finally had a diesel Wrangler option either in the first or second model year. :headbang:

The EcoDiesel Gand Cherokee was rated at 18 city / 25 highway and if you compare it to a high output 4 cylinder turbo like the Ford Ecoboost (310hp/320l-ft) that thing gets 21/30 highway. Granted the Mustang is a lighter car than the Wrangler but shows that the Hurricane turbo 4 with similar power output should be able to at least match if not beat the EcoDiesel MPG. As for matching its power (torque) well that's another matter lol.
 

Shaddrach

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A bit of good news. FCA has developed a fix for all future ecodiesel vehicles and is proposing to the Feds to allow them to install the updated software on all existing models. The fact they have created a fix for future vehicles is maybe a good sign they haven't given up on the idea altogether.

"FCA has contended that its vehicles are fully in compliance with regulations, but the company said Friday that its new diesel cars will feature “vehicles feature updated emissions software calibrations.” The company said it will also seek permission to modify the 2014-2016 versions of the diesels that are in dispute to end the standoff with federal regulators."
 

The Great Grape Ape

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A bit of good news. FCA has developed a fix...
That info is in Brogan's post.
They proposed the fix a while back, and doesn't really provide future guidance, it just shows they can do it via software and that it applies to all variants, meaning it wasn't a physicsl barrier.

Unfortunately, the EPA currently won't even consider the updated firmware, and appear to be using it's approval in the 2017 model as leverage.

However even as the EPA's own investigation showed even the minority of the offending code (like 2/8) wasn't the biggest issue, but the lack of disclosure. So fixing it now is likely not the issue so much as repenting and recompense / restitution for past transgressions.
 

Shaddrach

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Yes, they have been working to obtain, but on Friday they actually filed for the certification...this was just a few hours ago.

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/fca-us-files-for-diesel-vehicle-certification-300460652.html

AUBURN HILLS, Mich., May 19, 2017 /PRNewswire/ -- FCA US announced today it has formally filed an application for diesel vehicle emissions certification with the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) and the California Air Resources Board (CARB) for its 2017 model year (MY) Jeep Grand Cherokee and Ram 1500 diesel vehicles. These vehicles feature updated emissions software calibrations.

The filing is the result of many months of close collaboration between FCA US and EPA and CARB, including extensive testing of the vehicles, to clarify issues related to the Company's emissions control technology. With the permission of EPA and CARB, FCA USintends to install the same modified emissions software in 2014-2016 MY Jeep Grand Cherokee and Ram 1500 diesel vehicles. FCA USbelieves this will address the agencies' concerns regarding the emissions software calibrations in those vehicles.


FCA US also believes that these actions should help facilitate a prompt resolution to ongoing discussions with the Environment and Natural Resources Division of the U.S. Department of Justice and other governmental agencies.

FCA US expects that following EPA and CARB approval, owners of the 2014-2016 MY vehicles will be able to receive the software updates at their dealerships. FCA expects that the installation of these updated software calibrations will improve the 2014-2016 MY vehicles' emissions performance and does not anticipate any impact on performance or fuel efficiency.
 

CorpCow

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Yes, they have been working to obtain, but on Friday they actually filed for the certification...this was just a few hours ago.

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/fca-us-files-for-diesel-vehicle-certification-300460652.html
Yesss sounds promising IMO. Especially this part:

"The filing is the result of many months of close collaboration between FCA US and EPA and CARB, including extensive testing of the vehicles, to clarify issues related to the Company's emissions control technology... FCA US believes this will address the agencies' concerns regarding the emissions software calibrations in those vehicles.

FCA US also believes that these actions should help facilitate a prompt resolution to ongoing discussions with the Environment and Natural Resources Division of the U.S. Department of Justice and other governmental agencies."


Since they've been working with the EPA directly on a resolution, that means FCA is pretty confident the fix will satisfy the EPA's concerns. Dunno if this gets FCA off the hook for past violations in the GC and Ram 1500, but this may be real good news for an upcoming JL/JLU Wrangler diesel!
 

Billy

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Aaaaaand just like that I'm back in...
 

tatarin

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sad day:(
 

orey22

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My Solution to the Diesel problem, build a Jeep Wrangler that's smaller, and lighter. Poof the MPG's go up, and I'd be first in line to buy one.



The WWII generation had the right idea when it came to Jeeps. Small and Light. Throw on some airbags, and other safety features on it, and sell it.
;)
 

Scuffed

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From 2010 to current EPA regulations choking these diesels. ERG systems ruin turbos. DPF systems fluid cloggs the DEF injectors. DEF fluid every other week for daily drivers $$. If these systems are not deleted, which is illegal and you won't smog, they will ruin components. Turbos $$$$, DEF injectors system "clean" is Dealer Only $$$$. Keep your fuel filters on time and hope for zero fuel pump failure. High pressure fuel pumps $$$$, Pump failure leads to fuel injector failure $$$$. Current fuel system replacement $10-12K. The early Cummings and Merc days of buying a Diesel to possibly make it 500-1,000,000 are long gone. Maybe the caught FCA had the right idea on a pair of deletes. A HP increase on a NA motor sounds good to me and way cheaper to own out of warranty.
 

WaltA

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My Solution to the Diesel problem, build a Jeep Wrangler that's smaller, and lighter. Poof the MPG's go up, and I'd be first in line to buy one.



The WWII generation had the right idea when it came to Jeeps. Small and Light. Throw on some airbags, and other safety features on it, and sell it.
;)
Nine slotted grill... that would make it a Ford, no? :fingerscrossed:

At least the directionals are in the grill, under the headlights, where they belong.
 

Shaddrach

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DEF fluid every other week for daily drivers $$. I
Not hardly. My DEF intervals on my ecodiesel were about as frequent as oil changes. You get thousands of miles per DEF refill. the expense was negligible and a non issue. If you're fortunate enough to live near a service station that sells the pump version instead of purchasing off a shelf, it is even cheaper.
 

OUTBACK JEEP

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I just got off the phone with my local dealership (salesman I use) in Arizona. He had just finished talking with the Chrysler rep who was in there dealership today. The rep told him that the diesel has not even been confirmed yet for production? WTF Ive been waiting for YEARS for jeep to get there shit together and finally put on there big boy pants and put a diesel in there Rubicon! Apparently they still have not decided to man up and just do it. If they do not get there shit together I am going to pick up 2 GM Colorado DIESEL! They just dropped into the GM dealerships and you can finally build one online. I have been a jeep fan all my life. I have purchased 8 Jeeps over the last 25 years. I was planning on getting my wife and I each new Rubicons with a diesel. My wife currently has a 2016 Rubicon. I told my sales guy I wanted two new Jeep Rubicons with the Diesel. I would gladly trade the 2016 in (that was this morning). Now that he actually talked to the rep I am starting to get ticked off at Jeep. What the Hell Jeep? Give us, the consumers what we have wanted for years now. GM is. Im about to jump ship and buy GM.
 

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